OT: AMG GT R
12-19-2016, 06:53 AM
#166
This is what the actual driver said:
Christian Gebhardt / sport auto:" No slicks or cutted slick-tyres were used for the lap time. AMG will offer two different versions of the Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2 for the AMG GT R. A normal one, like it is available for the GT S, and a special one for track driving with a more sticky compound. BUT: Both versions of Cup 2 for the AMG GT R are fully street legal! You can compare the sticky Cup 2 for AMG GT R with the Cup 2 for the Corvette Z06. The grip level feels pretty similar! We, sport auto, would never ever drive a production car with slicks. It was a serious press test! "
So, like I wrote initially.. It is very fast car but who knows how much difference these special tires make. Or whether other manufacturers use something like those as well?
Christian Gebhardt / sport auto:" No slicks or cutted slick-tyres were used for the lap time. AMG will offer two different versions of the Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2 for the AMG GT R. A normal one, like it is available for the GT S, and a special one for track driving with a more sticky compound. BUT: Both versions of Cup 2 for the AMG GT R are fully street legal! You can compare the sticky Cup 2 for AMG GT R with the Cup 2 for the Corvette Z06. The grip level feels pretty similar! We, sport auto, would never ever drive a production car with slicks. It was a serious press test! "
So, like I wrote initially.. It is very fast car but who knows how much difference these special tires make. Or whether other manufacturers use something like those as well?
Could the GT-R compound be even more aggressive with shorter life? maybe but we only know what we've been told.
Ultimately, it's a great lap and the car seems to have considerable pace in it. It'll make rounds at other tracks so we'll get an overall performance envelope not just one instance.
12-19-2016, 10:37 AM
#167
The GTR looks legit and Porsche and Ferrari need to up their game. All good for the consumer.
I remember when the 996 tt broke the 8 minute mark with 7:50 mark when they were released back in 2001. Amazing how far road legal sports cars have come.
12-19-2016, 11:18 AM
#168
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If the GT-R lap time was set with an extra grippy version of the Cup 2, that does need to be accounted for when comparing with the Porsches.
For that matter, the N1 of the RS seems to have more grip than the N0 of the GT3, so even within Porsches we're not apples to apples.
Then add the factor that tires with more grip tend to not last as long, so the operating cost goes up.
I'd like more data so that we can better judge the lap times of these cars if they had equal tires.
But there's no denying that the GT-R is wicked fast, and much of that is due to aero, suspension, handling, and power/torque, not just tires. Maybe the designers of the GT-R have been hanging out with the F1 engineers.
For that matter, the N1 of the RS seems to have more grip than the N0 of the GT3, so even within Porsches we're not apples to apples.
Then add the factor that tires with more grip tend to not last as long, so the operating cost goes up.
I'd like more data so that we can better judge the lap times of these cars if they had equal tires.
But there's no denying that the GT-R is wicked fast, and much of that is due to aero, suspension, handling, and power/torque, not just tires. Maybe the designers of the GT-R have been hanging out with the F1 engineers.
12-19-2016, 05:49 PM
#169
Not to rain on anyone's parade here but just so we can be factual, Nissan entered the GTR in the N24 like Porsche did. The car finished and finished well just like the GT3 RS.
http://www.motorauthority.com/news/1...elopment-video
I have yet to hear anything about how the car wasn't standard but for the few minor tweaks that were made (spelled out in the press release/article). With that in mind, I may not like the GTR or prefer that type of approach to going quickly but I do have a massive amount of respect for that kind of durability. I don't think there are many brands that build cars to that type of standard. If AMG has done something similar with this car I'd consider it truly special. It must be so tempting to cut corners to keep costs down or to make parts that aren't as durable as they could be for this kind of event with the intent of going that little bit faster.
http://www.motorauthority.com/news/1...elopment-video
I have yet to hear anything about how the car wasn't standard but for the few minor tweaks that were made (spelled out in the press release/article). With that in mind, I may not like the GTR or prefer that type of approach to going quickly but I do have a massive amount of respect for that kind of durability. I don't think there are many brands that build cars to that type of standard. If AMG has done something similar with this car I'd consider it truly special. It must be so tempting to cut corners to keep costs down or to make parts that aren't as durable as they could be for this kind of event with the intent of going that little bit faster.
12-20-2016, 08:45 AM
#171
Rennlist Member
the five AMG GT3 which were driving in 2016 the 24N - had still the 6,2l NA engine in.
lets see what will happen in 2017.
nevertheless 2016 was with 1st until 4th a blast for MB! http://www.motorsport-xl.de/document...uYWwucGRm.html
but yeah... GT3 / SP9 cars... lets take the BMW M6 for example regarding "stock" / close-to-production vehicle....
lets see what will happen in 2017.
nevertheless 2016 was with 1st until 4th a blast for MB! http://www.motorsport-xl.de/document...uYWwucGRm.html
but yeah... GT3 / SP9 cars... lets take the BMW M6 for example regarding "stock" / close-to-production vehicle....
12-20-2016, 02:49 PM
#172
I've ran quite a few sets of the Z06 Cup 2's on my Z06. They will last 2-3 days if you're going for a pace around 90% of the car's capability. If want to stay above 95%, they will last about 1.5 days. Assuming normal trackday sessions.
Could the GT-R compound be even more aggressive with shorter life? maybe but we only know what we've been told.
Ultimately, it's a great lap and the car seems to have considerable pace in it. It'll make rounds at other tracks so we'll get an overall performance envelope not just one instance.
Could the GT-R compound be even more aggressive with shorter life? maybe but we only know what we've been told.
Ultimately, it's a great lap and the car seems to have considerable pace in it. It'll make rounds at other tracks so we'll get an overall performance envelope not just one instance.
I believe the N1 Cup2s on GT3 RS and GT4 are based on the Cup2 development from 918 Spyder. Hence I expected that N1 Cup2s has better grip than N0 Cup2s.
12-20-2016, 02:52 PM
#173
I have ordered one, but non-binding.
They will check and tell me if I will get one or not in January. It seems that marketing is deciding who will get a car - at least in Germany
They will check and tell me if I will get one or not in January. It seems that marketing is deciding who will get a car - at least in Germany
12-20-2016, 03:02 PM
#174
Drifting
the five AMG GT3 which were driving in 2016 the 24N - had still the 6,2l NA engine in.
lets see what will happen in 2017.
nevertheless 2016 was with 1st until 4th a blast for MB! http://www.motorsport-xl.de/document...uYWwucGRm.html
but yeah... GT3 / SP9 cars... lets take the BMW M6 for example regarding "stock" / close-to-production vehicle....
lets see what will happen in 2017.
nevertheless 2016 was with 1st until 4th a blast for MB! http://www.motorsport-xl.de/document...uYWwucGRm.html
but yeah... GT3 / SP9 cars... lets take the BMW M6 for example regarding "stock" / close-to-production vehicle....
Factory race car homologated for GT3 races in a 24 hour race
vs.
Factory takes street legal high performance car, adds the bare minimum of safety equipment, competes in 24 hour race and notches respectable finish
12-21-2016, 09:45 AM
#176
Nordschleife Master
A company can use any tires they want and I think the only fair comparison is using the tires a company intended the car to come with. I do not see why a car should be written off for using better tires. It would seem reasonable for a performance car to come with the best tires that meet the requirements outlined by the designers.
Using the same tires can provide some interesting information but I think it skews the comparison in such a way that you are no longer really comparing the two cars based on how the engineers intended them to perform. If one car uses worse tires then all blames rests on that car's manufacturer for not using better tires.
Using the same tires can provide some interesting information but I think it skews the comparison in such a way that you are no longer really comparing the two cars based on how the engineers intended them to perform. If one car uses worse tires then all blames rests on that car's manufacturer for not using better tires.
12-21-2016, 11:10 AM
#177
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A company can use any tires they want and I think the only fair comparison is using the tires a company intended the car to come with. I do not see why a car should be written off for using better tires. It would seem reasonable for a performance car to come with the best tires that meet the requirements outlined by the designers.
Using the same tires can provide some interesting information but I think it skews the comparison in such a way that you are no longer really comparing the two cars based on how the engineers intended them to perform. If one car uses worse tires then all blames rests on that car's manufacturer for not using better tires.
Using the same tires can provide some interesting information but I think it skews the comparison in such a way that you are no longer really comparing the two cars based on how the engineers intended them to perform. If one car uses worse tires then all blames rests on that car's manufacturer for not using better tires.
Also, the grippier tires tend to not last as long, so the comparison isn't really fair if an extra grippy version of the Cup 2 lasts only two days whereas a less grippy version lasts say six or more days. I personally am not interested in paying for an incremental increase in grip if the tire operating cost increases by a factor of 2x or more.
12-21-2016, 07:16 PM
#179
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^ Tires are by far the biggest factor affecting lap times which can easily be changed.