991.2 GT3 Paris 1-16 October official presentation
10-26-2016, 05:37 AM
#421
I don't want to discredit your theory but I have it first hand that at least two of the 991RS at the Porsche Masters Class in September were down for "unknown reasons".
Porsche will never tell you there is a problem as you say!
I also have it on good account that ALL the early RSR Nurburgring 991 GT3 cars have had replacement and their RS had recently been attended to as well (close friends were there three weeks ago).
In the WEC series in Germany this season I'm told second hand there were three RS engine issues (the GT3 have almost all had issues),
Myself and others here with failed engines (over 40 and counting) almost all warm our cars up before taking them on the track or driving in anger Im sure.
To date the only hard driven track GT3 on this board I recall have not yet had issues are the F series cars of Manifold, OrthoJoe and perhaps R.Deacon. Most are now succumbing to replacements.
For the RS I only know off hand two guys run those at 20 plus days so far (track car and Joe). I'm guessing G series GT3 and RS will start to show issues next track season.
So yes it's strange how PAG tell you one thing when really another happens - but let's be honest here fellows - this has been the theme since rod bolt recall starting from fire Jan 2014...,the theme has been RADIO SILENCE.
They revise and revise (in MA175 engine now over 40 changes now since first production E and in RS latest G engine has also a number of revision including heads and cams and springs.
I'll eat my hat happily if wrong but I'm guessing the changes identified in November during 9A1 testing are the changes you already see in 911R, July RS and now all replacement GT3 engines, namely DLC cams, new heads with altered oil galleries and updated ECU software running revised oil pressures! I believe your version 2.5 engine is already arrived, and that the 991.2 engine will be more of the same. I bloody well hope I'm wrong as it help my enjoyment of the new GT3 although I will miss the 9000 redline (what a crying shame they had to dumb this down for R and RS and no doubt all future GT3).
Call me cynical but I don't think after what we've been through since 2013 it would be right to feel any other way. Until AP speaks up and makes us all feel good again of course ;-p
Porsche will never tell you there is a problem as you say!
I also have it on good account that ALL the early RSR Nurburgring 991 GT3 cars have had replacement and their RS had recently been attended to as well (close friends were there three weeks ago).
In the WEC series in Germany this season I'm told second hand there were three RS engine issues (the GT3 have almost all had issues),
Myself and others here with failed engines (over 40 and counting) almost all warm our cars up before taking them on the track or driving in anger Im sure.
To date the only hard driven track GT3 on this board I recall have not yet had issues are the F series cars of Manifold, OrthoJoe and perhaps R.Deacon. Most are now succumbing to replacements.
For the RS I only know off hand two guys run those at 20 plus days so far (track car and Joe). I'm guessing G series GT3 and RS will start to show issues next track season.
So yes it's strange how PAG tell you one thing when really another happens - but let's be honest here fellows - this has been the theme since rod bolt recall starting from fire Jan 2014...,the theme has been RADIO SILENCE.
They revise and revise (in MA175 engine now over 40 changes now since first production E and in RS latest G engine has also a number of revision including heads and cams and springs.
I'll eat my hat happily if wrong but I'm guessing the changes identified in November during 9A1 testing are the changes you already see in 911R, July RS and now all replacement GT3 engines, namely DLC cams, new heads with altered oil galleries and updated ECU software running revised oil pressures! I believe your version 2.5 engine is already arrived, and that the 991.2 engine will be more of the same. I bloody well hope I'm wrong as it help my enjoyment of the new GT3 although I will miss the 9000 redline (what a crying shame they had to dumb this down for R and RS and no doubt all future GT3).
Call me cynical but I don't think after what we've been through since 2013 it would be right to feel any other way. Until AP speaks up and makes us all feel good again of course ;-p
10-26-2016, 05:52 AM
#422
Rennlist Member
10-26-2016, 09:16 AM
#423
Was just chatting with Ron Simons (owner of RSR) and whilst he confirms the engine issue Footsoldier had (one car had 8 engine replacements) not all of their GT3's had issues. And besides having had some accidents, none of their RS's have had engine problems.
From the horse's mouth.
From the horse's mouth.
10-26-2016, 09:41 AM
#424
Rennlist Member
Thanks Mika. Kobolt and I have spoken tonight about this via PM. It was the Ring Taxi company, and my mistake. The issue may not have been the missfire code as I have no other information.
The international press quoted RSR in 2015 in relation to further issues Porsche were having with the E replacement engines. Hence the reference to ALL the early RSR 991 GT3 in my prior post . However its good to have your input direct from the owner that not ALL their 991 GT3 have had missfire issues. Its peculiar however one car has had 8 transplants, just bad luck or that car gets alot of rental work I guess...
Without doubt the G engine GT3 and RS are holding up better than the E (many "missfire" issues recorded) and the F (growing number now of missfire issues).
To this day I still have ZERO instances of G engine MA175 or MA176 (RS) engines with missfires reported first hand. As many who have been keeping across the other thread will have read we have heard of some mechanical issues with RS in recent months but only through second and third hand sources and no specifics to why this has occurred (we have had two complete engine failures reported which appear to be more likely rod bolt failure).
Whilst its is natural for people to defend the product they have invested their hard earned $$$ in, there is no denying the fact that PAG have chosen to make significant improvements to the G series engine sin GT3 & RS in recent months by inclusion of new heads and cams.
I also need to highlight that I have no axe to grind. Infact I am here since the very first post on this board 4 years ago, have been a 991 GT3 owner since 2013, have been involved in heading up the group to help bring some compensation to the early owners affected, have been through three engines and four thermostats, and I am still driving my 991 GT3 and love every moment of it. I intend to keep the car at least another 18 months until the new GT3 arrived on our shores, but I will only change the car once I am informed and educated that the new engine is a significant redevelopment of the MA175/6 series improvement engines, or otherwise I may as well keep extending my factory warranty for another 8 years and receive the engine up dates for "free" as they evolve accordingly etc.
The international press quoted RSR in 2015 in relation to further issues Porsche were having with the E replacement engines. Hence the reference to ALL the early RSR 991 GT3 in my prior post . However its good to have your input direct from the owner that not ALL their 991 GT3 have had missfire issues. Its peculiar however one car has had 8 transplants, just bad luck or that car gets alot of rental work I guess...
Without doubt the G engine GT3 and RS are holding up better than the E (many "missfire" issues recorded) and the F (growing number now of missfire issues).
To this day I still have ZERO instances of G engine MA175 or MA176 (RS) engines with missfires reported first hand. As many who have been keeping across the other thread will have read we have heard of some mechanical issues with RS in recent months but only through second and third hand sources and no specifics to why this has occurred (we have had two complete engine failures reported which appear to be more likely rod bolt failure).
Whilst its is natural for people to defend the product they have invested their hard earned $$$ in, there is no denying the fact that PAG have chosen to make significant improvements to the G series engine sin GT3 & RS in recent months by inclusion of new heads and cams.
I also need to highlight that I have no axe to grind. Infact I am here since the very first post on this board 4 years ago, have been a 991 GT3 owner since 2013, have been involved in heading up the group to help bring some compensation to the early owners affected, have been through three engines and four thermostats, and I am still driving my 991 GT3 and love every moment of it. I intend to keep the car at least another 18 months until the new GT3 arrived on our shores, but I will only change the car once I am informed and educated that the new engine is a significant redevelopment of the MA175/6 series improvement engines, or otherwise I may as well keep extending my factory warranty for another 8 years and receive the engine up dates for "free" as they evolve accordingly etc.
10-26-2016, 01:10 PM
#425
Rennlist Member
Any educated guesses on MSRP for the 991.2 three Pedal Car?
10-26-2016, 02:04 PM
#426
Addict
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10-26-2016, 03:22 PM
#428
Rennlist Member
Interesting... perhaps since the lack of PDK will actually keep the price closer to last 991.1 GT3?
Thanks for the responses.
Thanks for the responses.
10-26-2016, 03:40 PM
#429
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
I heard Manual gearbox will be a no-cost option (not sure if Porsche saves much money by making 30% of the cars with Manual and charging same as PDK). Presumably, the Manual cars will also come with mechanical LSD rather than the electronic variety that requires hydraulic pressure (usually shared with the PDK's pump).
10-26-2016, 03:43 PM
#430
Addict
Rennlist Member
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10-26-2016, 04:12 PM
#431
Race Car
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: The way to hell is paved by good intentions “Wenn ich Purist höre...entsichere ich meinen Browning” "Myths are fuel for marketing (and nowadays for flippers too,,,)" time to time is not sufficient to be a saint, you must be also an Hero
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forget 130k
just look jump on 2/4S go figure GTx nowadays..
just look jump on 2/4S go figure GTx nowadays..
10-26-2016, 04:18 PM
#433
Race Car
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: The way to hell is paved by good intentions “Wenn ich Purist höre...entsichere ich meinen Browning” "Myths are fuel for marketing (and nowadays for flippers too,,,)" time to time is not sufficient to be a saint, you must be also an Hero
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i ll get 2 for that price , 2 optionals and 160k in a moment
10-26-2016, 07:53 PM
#434
Nordschleife Master
Or more to the point buying a 911R or late production RS?
As a few who have looked at this issue more closely have advised, it's not the oil alone that is the issue but the friction between the cam lobe and the finger follower which do not appear to carry a sufficient film of lubrication...
So if they want to stop the DLC from sheering off the finger followers and thus scoring the cam lobes it's my thought they need more than additional oil lubrication to remedy this issue...they have already added oil galleries and up rated the oil pump and filter as well as the ECU software that regulates pressure on the later MA175 and MA176 engines.
I want to believe the 991.2 engine is bullet proof and that it can operate robustly at 8500-9000 rpm. Pointing to the racing program and saying the road car will be all right is nice but like many I have grown a healthy level of scepticism since taking delivery of my GR3 in 2013 (and three engines later). To be honest I hardly trust what I'm told these days...
As a few who have looked at this issue more closely have advised, it's not the oil alone that is the issue but the friction between the cam lobe and the finger follower which do not appear to carry a sufficient film of lubrication...
So if they want to stop the DLC from sheering off the finger followers and thus scoring the cam lobes it's my thought they need more than additional oil lubrication to remedy this issue...they have already added oil galleries and up rated the oil pump and filter as well as the ECU software that regulates pressure on the later MA175 and MA176 engines.
I want to believe the 991.2 engine is bullet proof and that it can operate robustly at 8500-9000 rpm. Pointing to the racing program and saying the road car will be all right is nice but like many I have grown a healthy level of scepticism since taking delivery of my GR3 in 2013 (and three engines later). To be honest I hardly trust what I'm told these days...
Engine problem on the GT3/GT3RS never bothers me. If it blows up, Porsche replaces it for free, and tacks on extra warranty. The car will be properly documented at the factory as having the correct replacement engine in the car as if it came from the factory with the replacement engine, and the serial numbers will all match in Porsche's system and that's what counts.
If I were to buy a GT3 right now, I would pick a 14 with the replacement engine over a 15 that hasn't has the engine replaced. A 14 with the extended engine warranty will be worth more than a 15 with only the standard warranty.
As for the .2 GT3, it will be good to know the engine is a race derived engine. Something a lot of Porsche GT lovers loved. Like the old Mezger engines.
If I were to buy a GT3 right now, I would pick a 14 with the replacement engine over a 15 that hasn't has the engine replaced. A 14 with the extended engine warranty will be worth more than a 15 with only the standard warranty.
As for the .2 GT3, it will be good to know the engine is a race derived engine. Something a lot of Porsche GT lovers loved. Like the old Mezger engines.
10-26-2016, 09:06 PM
#435
Burning Brakes
