JasonAndreas

Check out THIS thread for instructions and the board separation trick.


The plug comes off easily AFTER you pull the DME control unit out from under the seat. The way the connector is hinged I think it is almost impossible to "unlock" the connector with ECU still under the seat.

tafkai

get real rob .
my car is the same year as yours , so ................... 13 YEARS ago , you could say our engines where the same , and porsche's "one chip fits all" to suit any driver chip was fitted AFTER the original was perfected in a live situation !!!

now however , our cars are totally different , after 70k miles my car is still with original compression specs. is yours ? what RON petrol do you use ? have you changed cat , full exhaust , air filter , injectors ??????

if you like , you can borrow MY chip and put it in your car to run it !!!
after-all , mine is a modified chip and you say they're all the same cars so just think of mine as the "original" and you are fitting an off-the shelf copy .

Lorenfb

"I disagree with the various analogies (eg wedding dress) - the 'measurements' are pretty wel known - our engines are pretty much exactly the same - identical enough for the factory to issue them all with a standard chip when new anyway. IMHO!"

Besides, as many forget or are unaware of, that other than at full throttle, the closed loop
O2 system controls the fuel mixture irrespective of simple engine mods, e.g. exhaust change.

So tweaking the fuel maps of ECMs has basically no effect and a waste of time/money.
The Porsche knock control system provides another feedback element which optimizes
the ignition timing for octanes, temperatures, and engine loads, thus maximizing engine
torque obviating ignition timing tweating too.

Red rooster

Lorenfb,

I admire your consistent denial of the possibility of motor bhp/lbs-ft improvement through timing /fuelling re-calibration.

You state that as the fuelling is running closed loop , any fuelling change will achieve nothing . Woops -WOT runs open loop and so can be directly re calibrated.
For your interest , all performance German cars are set to run too rich at full load and high rpm to help with cooling during Autobahn , flat out cruising.

You state that the factory timing calibration is set so that the ignition timing is being held by knock control. I know that fuel qualility is poor in California but I cannot believe that this statement is correct for a 964 DME , with US, poor fuel quality mapping selected !Such a horrendous situation would be shown as a continous problem on a Hammer.
If you are right , then a timing re-cal to bring the motor out of continuous detonation would result in a better running motor.

I think you may agree that both statements maybe need a rethink.

All the best

Geoff

rodders

' make sure you are well grounded to prevent static damage to the chip' what does that mean and what should I do - what is a ' chip puller ' ?
who said this was easy !!

rodders

JasanA - thanks for your advice on the box and the hinged connector - great help - I thought I was going to have to undo the little screw on the connector
Tomorrow morning is the great day - classic **** up sunday morning session !!
such confidence for such a little job

tafkai

A: a little velcro wrist-band with a curly wire and crocodile clip (car jumper lead to ear or nose will suffice )

B: a soft plastic tool that grips under the chip on both sides and lifs out vertically without damaging chip or connection ( a spoon inserted either side of chip and levered down will suffice )

IN MY HUMBLE OPINION !!

rodders

JasanA - thanks for your advice on the box and the hinged connector - great help - I thought I was going to have to undo the little screw on the connector
Tomorrow morning is the great day - classic **** up sunday morning session !!
such confidence for such a little job

Lorenfb

"You state that as the fuelling is running closed loop , any fuelling change will achieve nothing . Woops -WOT runs open loop and so can be directly re calibrate"

Didn't say that!

"You state that the factory timing calibration is set so that the ignition timing is being held by knock control."

No, didn't say that either.

Red Rooster - You need to do some careful re-reading of posts!

"Such a horrendous situation would be shown as a continous problem on a Hammer."

And this is the case for 964 performance chips, continuous knocks
and a resulting retarding of the timing.

Then you need to buy, read, and try an understand:

1. Porsche 964 manual WKD 495 121
2. Porsche 993 manual WKD 498 621

Then buy and use the Porsche ST2 system tester and monitor both
the 964 and 993 engines running viewing their live data. Oh, and stop
reading so many performance chip marketing hypes.

rodders

wow - this is getting serious
..... should I assuming that an fresh engine with a changed air filter and exhaust system will NOT benefit from a chip mapped to reflect the changes.
I am as technical as my dogs a--e but I would expect to HAVE make some subtle change to engine management control to optimize on the physical input and out of the engine.

Is not the argument over Extravagant claims made by chip manufacturers over the years.
... but there also seems to be a significant difference in the European and the US condition that is confusing me ??.

MarkD

From what I gather, loren's argument is that other functions of the DME (like knock control) override any gain you might have in a different chip.
That is basically it, right?

I am gonna guess I made it too simple for this thread.

Oh, and please don't flame me.

Red rooster

Lorenfb,

This is starting to get a bit personal which is not why I post here.

By the way ,I have been involved with motor calibration for 20 years which is why I find your observations amusing. Try working for a manufacturer and still hold the same views!!

I have the equipment /publications you mention and a lot more besides.

In the end I guess its up to each individual to determine what they want to do based on what they want to believe.
I must confess to being too busy to get involved in pointless bickering !!

All the best

Geoff BSc.MIEE ( if that helps !! )

Lorenfb

"Should I assuming that an fresh engine with a changed air filter and exhaust system will NOT benefit from a chip mapped to reflect the changes." - rodders -

You're totally correct! Invest your time & money in a Porsche DE event.
It 'll yield better results. The Rennlist Forum has many threads which indicate
such. Just do a search.

Furthermore, the torque curve is basically flat over the AFR range from 11.0 to
14.0 and as such yields little/nothing the result of tweaking.

Check here www.systemsc.com/graphs.htm for data on this and other engine info.

Laurence Gibbs

refering to my post on page two of this thread. How do the engines in our dyno test make there additional HP. The range of figures varied from 260-300 and the average was for around 275-280hp Does the motoronic have the abilty to map for the changes made i.e. cup bypass and "sports air filter" and even maff units ? does it have the abilty to advance itself past what's in the map? Porsche themselves "chip tuned" the dme 's of there cup cars and the 93' 964 cups were producing 275-280 hp was none of this acheived with tuning the dme ?

rodders

OK - Done the chip - now the car wont start - it has a Toad alarm etc - every thing works - engine turns seems like the imobiliser has kicked in - what do I do next - help fellas !!!