718 GT4RS
11-10-2021, 07:00 AM
#3211
You guys are arguing over the virtues of the GT3 vs the GT4 RS on the assumption that the buyer is cross shopping the two. There are a huge number of buyers out there that have multiple cars so it's not a question of choosing one over the other, rather its simply a question of whether you are going to get an allocation or not. These buyers will suck up all the limited production very, very easily and even many of those buyers will be disappointed.
In my case, it looks like I am going to be one of the disappointed ones. I put in a signed EOI with a small holding deposit almost 4 years ago when I first heard about the car. I was first name down at my dealer. Well, last week I get the call. My dealer is only getting 2, maybe 3, 4 RSs next year.....and considering I am also getting a GT3 Touring....I would have to choose....GT3 Touring or GT4 RS
. They are just trying to be fair to their good customers so at least some get one or the other.
It's a very hard choice...but I have gone for the Touring...but still have my hat in the ring for a 4 RS in case they get more cars.
In my case, it looks like I am going to be one of the disappointed ones. I put in a signed EOI with a small holding deposit almost 4 years ago when I first heard about the car. I was first name down at my dealer. Well, last week I get the call. My dealer is only getting 2, maybe 3, 4 RSs next year.....and considering I am also getting a GT3 Touring....I would have to choose....GT3 Touring or GT4 RS
. They are just trying to be fair to their good customers so at least some get one or the other.It's a very hard choice...but I have gone for the Touring...but still have my hat in the ring for a 4 RS in case they get more cars.
I totally agree with Chris....your dealer sounds like mine. I have been on the list since the 981 GT4 #4 spot and I may not get one.
In my personal case I could either go GT4RS or 992 GT3, I don't have a personal choice but if price on the GT4RS is too close to GT3 you can count on me moving to the 992 platform.
Here's hoping that Porsche did the smart thing and placed pricing right smack in the middle (or just tad above) between GT4 and GT3....since I don't have to deal with ADM all I have to worry is PAG producing enough so my dealer gets at least 4 of these.
So once we know on Nov 17 then the agony starts again waiting for allocations.....
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993RR (11-10-2021)
11-10-2021, 08:52 AM
#3212
You guys are arguing over the virtues of the GT3 vs the GT4 RS on the assumption that the buyer is cross shopping the two. There are a huge number of buyers out there that have multiple cars so it's not a question of choosing one over the other, rather its simply a question of whether you are going to get an allocation or not. These buyers will suck up all the limited production very, very easily and even many of those buyers will be disappointed.
In my case, it looks like I am going to be one of the disappointed ones. I put in a signed EOI with a small holding deposit almost 4 years ago when I first heard about the car. I was first name down at my dealer. Well, last week I get the call. My dealer is only getting 2, maybe 3, 4 RSs next year.....and considering I am also getting a GT3 Touring....I would have to choose....GT3 Touring or GT4 RS. They are just trying to be fair to their good customers so at least some get one or the other.
It's a very hard choice...but I have gone for the Touring...but still have my hat in the ring for a 4 RS in case they get more cars.
In my case, it looks like I am going to be one of the disappointed ones. I put in a signed EOI with a small holding deposit almost 4 years ago when I first heard about the car. I was first name down at my dealer. Well, last week I get the call. My dealer is only getting 2, maybe 3, 4 RSs next year.....and considering I am also getting a GT3 Touring....I would have to choose....GT3 Touring or GT4 RS
. They are just trying to be fair to their good customers so at least some get one or the other.It's a very hard choice...but I have gone for the Touring...but still have my hat in the ring for a 4 RS in case they get more cars.
BTW, we weren’t arguing about the virtues of the GT3. I was responding to the comment made by someone that all those folks locked out of the 992 GT3 lottery would then just opt for 4RS. I don’t see that happening much for the reasons I indicated.
Last edited by Archimedes; 11-10-2021 at 08:56 AM.
11-10-2021, 08:53 AM
#3213
11-10-2021, 09:03 AM
#3214
You guys are arguing over the virtues of the GT3 vs the GT4 RS on the assumption that the buyer is cross shopping the two. There are a huge number of buyers out there that have multiple cars so it's not a question of choosing one over the other, rather its simply a question of whether you are going to get an allocation or not. These buyers will suck up all the limited production very, very easily and even many of those buyers will be disappointed.
In my case, it looks like I am going to be one of the disappointed ones. I put in a signed EOI with a small holding deposit almost 4 years ago when I first heard about the car. I was first name down at my dealer. Well, last week I get the call. My dealer is only getting 2, maybe 3, 4 RSs next year.....and considering I am also getting a GT3 Touring....I would have to choose....GT3 Touring or GT4 RS. They are just trying to be fair to their good customers so at least some get one or the other.
It's a very hard choice...but I have gone for the Touring...but still have my hat in the ring for a 4 RS in case they get more cars.
In my case, it looks like I am going to be one of the disappointed ones. I put in a signed EOI with a small holding deposit almost 4 years ago when I first heard about the car. I was first name down at my dealer. Well, last week I get the call. My dealer is only getting 2, maybe 3, 4 RSs next year.....and considering I am also getting a GT3 Touring....I would have to choose....GT3 Touring or GT4 RS
. They are just trying to be fair to their good customers so at least some get one or the other.It's a very hard choice...but I have gone for the Touring...but still have my hat in the ring for a 4 RS in case they get more cars.
I am looking at the 4RS for track duty.
11-10-2021, 09:28 AM
#3215
I am starting to reach my limit with the wait for allocations. Life is too short.
Been playing the waiting game for more than 15 years. I am no VIP.
Will buy other cars. If the p-cars show up they show up.
Been playing the waiting game for more than 15 years. I am no VIP.
Will buy other cars. If the p-cars show up they show up.
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11-10-2021, 09:49 AM
#3216
Yes but the key part of my argument is that a lot of the GT3 crowd can't get a GT3. By most accounts allocations for 2022 MY are 30% less than the production rate for the 991.2, and all of those allocations are being handed out right now. Yes the average GT3 buyer knows the GT4RS is below the GT3, but if they can't get that GT3 it's the next best thing.
From what I've seen of the VIP's and the heavy hitters is that they just buy these cars because they can. So they'll buy the Sport Classic and the GT4RS and the GT3 if they can get allocations. For a GT4 I was looking at this summer, the previous owner had bought something like 25 cars from that dealer, and he bought the GT4 on a whim. Traded it in with 1500 miles and got a 25th Anniversary Boxster for his wife. Buyers like these can afford to buy any and all of these cars, and part of the draw is that they can always be the first on the block to buy something, even if they don't intend to keep it that long.
If it works out that way I'll be over the moon. But from what I've seen, there are plenty of people that will eagerly accept a $150-160k GT4RS. I'm sure some will drop off but I don't think it'll be 80%.
From what I've seen of the VIP's and the heavy hitters is that they just buy these cars because they can. So they'll buy the Sport Classic and the GT4RS and the GT3 if they can get allocations. For a GT4 I was looking at this summer, the previous owner had bought something like 25 cars from that dealer, and he bought the GT4 on a whim. Traded it in with 1500 miles and got a 25th Anniversary Boxster for his wife. Buyers like these can afford to buy any and all of these cars, and part of the draw is that they can always be the first on the block to buy something, even if they don't intend to keep it that long.
If it works out that way I'll be over the moon. But from what I've seen, there are plenty of people that will eagerly accept a $150-160k GT4RS. I'm sure some will drop off but I don't think it'll be 80%.
These are just some assumptions of course.
11-10-2021, 09:51 AM
#3217
11-10-2021, 10:09 AM
#3218
Drifting
I dropped by my dealer to speak with my SA... 4RS came up and he indicated that they are all pre-sold/alocated to their respective VIPs. Likely expecting less than a handful.
(FTR, I'm waiting on my spyder so I've got no skin in this game.
)
11-10-2021, 10:14 AM
#3219
Thanks though, will see what happens. Nobody has promised me a 4RS. Allocations are not out yet so it's just hyperbole I would think. But they will have an idea somewhere of who MUST get one.
Spyder is a great car! Enjoy it.
11-10-2021, 10:18 AM
#3220
Drifting
I hope they take care of you! 
11-10-2021, 10:30 AM
#3221
Rennlist Member
I may be in the minority on this, but I think the demand for the 4RS is going to be lower than people expect. Even if it's an awesome car, people need to remember that a stupid high percentage of the 3RS's are purchased by people who never go near the track and many probably will never even drive the car hard. They buy it because its the Big Bad, plain and simple. And we all know, no matter how Bad the 4RS is, it's still going to be the lesser child in a lot of Porschefile's eyes. And the fact is that most, not all but most, Cayman buyers aren't in the same price range as the typical GT3 buyer, so selling a $165k+ GT4 en masse is going to require GT3 buyers to step down to the 4RS.
I think there will be a group of die hards that'll do that and pay a premium for this car up front, but I think that group is smaller than people think. And I think if Porsche were to produce 4,000 of them, they'd struggle to sell all of them for what we all know will be a pretty high sticker.
I think there will be a group of die hards that'll do that and pay a premium for this car up front, but I think that group is smaller than people think. And I think if Porsche were to produce 4,000 of them, they'd struggle to sell all of them for what we all know will be a pretty high sticker.
You .......... Sir are 100% on Target ^^^
Terry
11-10-2021, 10:38 AM
#3222
Rennlist Member
Regarding GT4RS Pricing - I hope that we will learn the official MSRP at the time the car is officially launched (presumably at the LA Auto Show Nov 18th ish). I feel pretty sure the US base price range of the new car will fall somewhere between the base price of a GT4 and a GT3, ($101,200 - $160,100). I am concerned that due to recent supply issues and pent up demand that Porsche will likely move the needle on that scale closer to the GT3's price. It will be disappointing if the car becomes so expensive that it no longer represents the value proposition of a Cayman, albeit - the most expensive one. I am first on the list at a fair agreed price in relation to MSRP (exact details can't be disclosed).
If the MSRP comes in close to the GT3, it may take it out of my comfort zone for a track car. Worse yet, is if wealthy investor-types buy the car as if it was a "hedge fund investment" and park in a garage collection that jack up its value to a point where it would be foolish to take it to the track.
So my hope is MSRP will fall somewhere in the middle and Preuninger goofs again and says something like we will build as many as people want to buy. This is my prediction as this car will likely stick around for sometime while Porsche re-tools for the electric Cayman.
If the MSRP comes in close to the GT3, it may take it out of my comfort zone for a track car. Worse yet, is if wealthy investor-types buy the car as if it was a "hedge fund investment" and park in a garage collection that jack up its value to a point where it would be foolish to take it to the track.
So my hope is MSRP will fall somewhere in the middle and Preuninger goofs again and says something like we will build as many as people want to buy. This is my prediction as this car will likely stick around for sometime while Porsche re-tools for the electric Cayman.
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phefner (11-10-2021)
11-10-2021, 11:34 AM
#3223
Regarding GT4RS Pricing - I hope that we will learn the official MSRP at the time the car is officially launched (presumably at the LA Auto Show Nov 18th ish). I feel pretty sure the US base price range of the new car will fall somewhere between the base price of a GT4 and a GT3, ($101,200 - $160,100). I am concerned that due to recent supply issues and pent up demand that Porsche will likely move the needle on that scale closer to the GT3's price. It will be disappointing if the car becomes so expensive that it no longer represents the value proposition of a Cayman, albeit - the most expensive one. I am first on the list at a fair agreed price in relation to MSRP (exact details can't be disclosed).
If the MSRP comes in close to the GT3, it may take it out of my comfort zone for a track car. Worse yet, is if wealthy investor-types buy the car as if it was a "hedge fund investment" and park in a garage collection that jack up its value to a point where it would be foolish to take it to the track.
So my hope is MSRP will fall somewhere in the middle and Preuninger goofs again and says something like we will build as many as people want to buy. This is my prediction as this car will likely stick around for sometime while Porsche re-tools for the electric Cayman.
If the MSRP comes in close to the GT3, it may take it out of my comfort zone for a track car. Worse yet, is if wealthy investor-types buy the car as if it was a "hedge fund investment" and park in a garage collection that jack up its value to a point where it would be foolish to take it to the track.
So my hope is MSRP will fall somewhere in the middle and Preuninger goofs again and says something like we will build as many as people want to buy. This is my prediction as this car will likely stick around for sometime while Porsche re-tools for the electric Cayman.
11-10-2021, 01:30 PM
#3224
Three Wheelin'
Dealers here in South Florida want premiums on used cars. We are currently living in a difficult economic climate where scarcity of autos (new and used) and public cash in hand favors premium pricing. I personally would not pay a S2500-3000 markup on a used Honda, but evidently there are those who will. The already fevered climate for GT cars superimposed on the current climate results in absurd pricing for commodities that are intrinsically depreciating assets regardless of highly publicized gains by flippers. Many dealers have abandoned long term customer relationships in favor of short term profits. This strategy will prevail and succeed only as long as supply chain bottlenecks continue. Should supplies catch up or increase some equilibrium may be restored. For my part none of Porsche’s GT offerings justify the exorbitant premiums being asked despite their desirability.
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G.Irish (11-10-2021)
11-10-2021, 01:36 PM
#3225
Rennlist Member
Ok, what’s the going guess on the following:
HP=
US allocations=
GT4 or GT3 based engine=
CL or Studs=
Numbered editions=
WP=
Base ADM=
Base Price=
My guess:
HP=485
US=900
GT4 variant
CL
Not numbered
WP package avail - PCCBs, plastic hood/glass, LW batt, light interior material
ADM=50K
Base price 140k
HP=
US allocations=
GT4 or GT3 based engine=
CL or Studs=
Numbered editions=
WP=
Base ADM=
Base Price=
My guess:
HP=485
US=900
GT4 variant
CL
Not numbered
WP package avail - PCCBs, plastic hood/glass, LW batt, light interior material
ADM=50K
Base price 140k
US allocations= ?
GT4 or GT3 based engine= GT4
CL or Studs= CL
Numbered editions= Nope
WP= maybe mag wheels optional?
Base ADM= $25k
Base Price= $160k
Last edited by Larry Cable; 11-10-2021 at 01:51 PM.