Dealer Allocation Tracker
06-01-2022, 05:19 PM
#4261
Drifting
100% this. It's one thing to just tell people what the deal is and if they alter the deal, just be transparent about it. The infuriating thing is to have the dealer string you along for months or years only to change things up on you, thereby screwing up your whole car buying plan. If you wanna charge markups, be upfront so people can make a decision about what direction to go and not lose out on time they could've been enjoying a car.
That is the biggest stink about all of this, the lack of transparency. Here we have a bunch of people trying to buy some of the most expensive cars Porsche makes and many dealers just don't keep in the loop or try to play games with smoke and mirrors. This kinda thing can sour people on the whole brand and undermine accumulated goodwill.
That is the biggest stink about all of this, the lack of transparency. Here we have a bunch of people trying to buy some of the most expensive cars Porsche makes and many dealers just don't keep in the loop or try to play games with smoke and mirrors. This kinda thing can sour people on the whole brand and undermine accumulated goodwill.
its weird because its like, what does the dealership have to gain to string people along like that? Most if not all deposits for waitlist get refunded, and you clearly have someone who is willing to buy right now. If you never intend on selling at MSRP, then all you are doing is pissing off a potential buyer by stringing them along. Everyone would love to buy at MSRP, but also knowing a car is on its last year or so, a lot of us (like myself) are willing to pay to play.
06-01-2022, 05:44 PM
#4262
100% this. It's one thing to just tell people what the deal is and if they alter the deal, just be transparent about it. The infuriating thing is to have the dealer string you along for months or years only to change things up on you, thereby screwing up your whole car buying plan. If you wanna charge markups, be upfront so people can make a decision about what direction to go and not lose out on time they could've been enjoying a car.
That is the biggest stink about all of this, the lack of transparency. Here we have a bunch of people trying to buy some of the most expensive cars Porsche makes and many dealers just don't keep in the loop or try to play games with smoke and mirrors. This kinda thing can sour people on the whole brand and undermine accumulated goodwill.
That is the biggest stink about all of this, the lack of transparency. Here we have a bunch of people trying to buy some of the most expensive cars Porsche makes and many dealers just don't keep in the loop or try to play games with smoke and mirrors. This kinda thing can sour people on the whole brand and undermine accumulated goodwill.
The following 3 users liked this post by halfmonkey:
06-01-2022, 06:25 PM
#4263
Rennlist Member
TBH, I think people assign themselves too much relevance, when it comes to buying a car. For dealers, its all about the numbers; individuals are largely irrelevant. And they may be 100% "sincere" when they tell you something in May, but the second you walk out the door, you walk out of their awareness and they entirely forget about you; they are worried about the cars/buyers in the dealership that day, and what deals they can make. Especially at the SM level, most of us are generic wallets, walking in and walking out, with no actual identities. I think the notion of "they strung me along and then screwed me over" is more like "they forgot you the moment you left, and shot from the hip when you came back up."
Not everyone is like that, and the whales aren't in this pool. And I am not saying it is right or good or proper. I'm just saying they aren't out to screw YOU over...there just making deals, day to day.
Not everyone is like that, and the whales aren't in this pool. And I am not saying it is right or good or proper. I'm just saying they aren't out to screw YOU over...there just making deals, day to day.
The following users liked this post:
4S Leistung (06-01-2022)
06-01-2022, 06:27 PM
#4264
06-01-2022, 07:19 PM
#4265
Track Day
Xxyion and others here are getting my feelings more-or-less correct. I am perfectly clear that the dealers are separate businesses from Porsche NA and I get how a reseller relationship works. To me, this structure does not absolve Porsche NA or the dealerships... I've run businesses where I was a software reseller. If our customers were unhappy, we would hear from the software provider and they would threaten to cut our reseller status, increase our buy price, or even end the relationship entirely. Our purpose in the chain was to add value to the buyer's experience, not make it worse.
In my opinion, the correct way for Porsche NA to have handled the shortages over the last couple years would have been to more quickly increase MSRP, increase the built-in margin @ MSRP for the dealerships, and aggressively move allocations around as needed to favor dealerships that received positive buyer feedback.
As I see it, my dealer and I had an agreement in principal and they have backed out because the market conditions have provided more profitable alternatives. This scenario happens all the time in all businesses. A well run business will follow through on its promises and fulfill orders, even where they are no longer ideal -- as this protects the brand and the long-term relationship. I placed a Rivian order before they increased their prices. Rivian made headlines when they said they were increasing prices for existing reservations like mine. It took them what... 1-2 days to realize that was a mistake and restore folks like me to our originally agreed-upon price? They told me to expect a car around December and it now looks like I'm going to have my car about 3 months ahead of schedule. They promised it at a price that is no longer profitable for them, but they're still going to sell it to me for that. I will have the option to sell that car the minute I take delivery and make probably a $20-40k profit -- but they aren't using that to renegotiate the deal. My buying experience with Rivian has been outstanding and I'm increasingly becoming a fan of the company, not just the car I'm buying.
Compare my Rivian experience to what's happening with Porsche. The GT4 is a great car -- no one here is disputing that. But this is hands-down the worst car buying experience I've had -- and I've had plenty of bad car buying experiences. This was going to be my first Porsche, but I'm irritated enough that I'm just about ready to walk. I don't want to go down a rabbit hole of why Porsche should care about a customer like me, but it's doubtful that I would not have been converted into a repeat long-term customer if this experience went better. My wife and I actually considered buying a Taycan for our family hauler instead of the Rivian we have on order. We spoke to the dealer and he started talking about markups, bidding to win, and all the other shenanigans I'm going through with the GT4. That one call really helped make the decision to stick with the Rivian much easier.
In my opinion, the correct way for Porsche NA to have handled the shortages over the last couple years would have been to more quickly increase MSRP, increase the built-in margin @ MSRP for the dealerships, and aggressively move allocations around as needed to favor dealerships that received positive buyer feedback.
As I see it, my dealer and I had an agreement in principal and they have backed out because the market conditions have provided more profitable alternatives. This scenario happens all the time in all businesses. A well run business will follow through on its promises and fulfill orders, even where they are no longer ideal -- as this protects the brand and the long-term relationship. I placed a Rivian order before they increased their prices. Rivian made headlines when they said they were increasing prices for existing reservations like mine. It took them what... 1-2 days to realize that was a mistake and restore folks like me to our originally agreed-upon price? They told me to expect a car around December and it now looks like I'm going to have my car about 3 months ahead of schedule. They promised it at a price that is no longer profitable for them, but they're still going to sell it to me for that. I will have the option to sell that car the minute I take delivery and make probably a $20-40k profit -- but they aren't using that to renegotiate the deal. My buying experience with Rivian has been outstanding and I'm increasingly becoming a fan of the company, not just the car I'm buying.
Compare my Rivian experience to what's happening with Porsche. The GT4 is a great car -- no one here is disputing that. But this is hands-down the worst car buying experience I've had -- and I've had plenty of bad car buying experiences. This was going to be my first Porsche, but I'm irritated enough that I'm just about ready to walk. I don't want to go down a rabbit hole of why Porsche should care about a customer like me, but it's doubtful that I would not have been converted into a repeat long-term customer if this experience went better. My wife and I actually considered buying a Taycan for our family hauler instead of the Rivian we have on order. We spoke to the dealer and he started talking about markups, bidding to win, and all the other shenanigans I'm going through with the GT4. That one call really helped make the decision to stick with the Rivian much easier.
06-01-2022, 07:56 PM
#4266
Rennlist Member
You might be counting your Rivian chickens before they hatch. Hope it all works out for you.
06-01-2022, 09:45 PM
#4267
Porsche is the one of the worst buying experiences. Alot of bad buying experiences right now going around in the car universe but porsche was bad even prior to the latest surge of terrible buying experiences.
06-01-2022, 09:50 PM
#4268
Rennlist Member
Xxyion and others here are getting my feelings more-or-less correct. I am perfectly clear that the dealers are separate businesses from Porsche NA and I get how a reseller relationship works. To me, this structure does not absolve Porsche NA or the dealerships... I've run businesses where I was a software reseller. If our customers were unhappy, we would hear from the software provider and they would threaten to cut our reseller status, increase our buy price, or even end the relationship entirely. Our purpose in the chain was to add value to the buyer's experience, not make it worse.
In my opinion, the correct way for Porsche NA to have handled the shortages over the last couple years would have been to more quickly increase MSRP, increase the built-in margin @ MSRP for the dealerships, and aggressively move allocations around as needed to favor dealerships that received positive buyer feedback.
As I see it, my dealer and I had an agreement in principal and they have backed out because the market conditions have provided more profitable alternatives. This scenario happens all the time in all businesses. A well run business will follow through on its promises and fulfill orders, even where they are no longer ideal -- as this protects the brand and the long-term relationship. I placed a Rivian order before they increased their prices. Rivian made headlines when they said they were increasing prices for existing reservations like mine. It took them what... 1-2 days to realize that was a mistake and restore folks like me to our originally agreed-upon price? They told me to expect a car around December and it now looks like I'm going to have my car about 3 months ahead of schedule. They promised it at a price that is no longer profitable for them, but they're still going to sell it to me for that. I will have the option to sell that car the minute I take delivery and make probably a $20-40k profit -- but they aren't using that to renegotiate the deal. My buying experience with Rivian has been outstanding and I'm increasingly becoming a fan of the company, not just the car I'm buying.
Compare my Rivian experience to what's happening with Porsche. The GT4 is a great car -- no one here is disputing that. But this is hands-down the worst car buying experience I've had -- and I've had plenty of bad car buying experiences. This was going to be my first Porsche, but I'm irritated enough that I'm just about ready to walk. I don't want to go down a rabbit hole of why Porsche should care about a customer like me, but it's doubtful that I would not have been converted into a repeat long-term customer if this experience went better. My wife and I actually considered buying a Taycan for our family hauler instead of the Rivian we have on order. We spoke to the dealer and he started talking about markups, bidding to win, and all the other shenanigans I'm going through with the GT4. That one call really helped make the decision to stick with the Rivian much easier.
In my opinion, the correct way for Porsche NA to have handled the shortages over the last couple years would have been to more quickly increase MSRP, increase the built-in margin @ MSRP for the dealerships, and aggressively move allocations around as needed to favor dealerships that received positive buyer feedback.
As I see it, my dealer and I had an agreement in principal and they have backed out because the market conditions have provided more profitable alternatives. This scenario happens all the time in all businesses. A well run business will follow through on its promises and fulfill orders, even where they are no longer ideal -- as this protects the brand and the long-term relationship. I placed a Rivian order before they increased their prices. Rivian made headlines when they said they were increasing prices for existing reservations like mine. It took them what... 1-2 days to realize that was a mistake and restore folks like me to our originally agreed-upon price? They told me to expect a car around December and it now looks like I'm going to have my car about 3 months ahead of schedule. They promised it at a price that is no longer profitable for them, but they're still going to sell it to me for that. I will have the option to sell that car the minute I take delivery and make probably a $20-40k profit -- but they aren't using that to renegotiate the deal. My buying experience with Rivian has been outstanding and I'm increasingly becoming a fan of the company, not just the car I'm buying.
Compare my Rivian experience to what's happening with Porsche. The GT4 is a great car -- no one here is disputing that. But this is hands-down the worst car buying experience I've had -- and I've had plenty of bad car buying experiences. This was going to be my first Porsche, but I'm irritated enough that I'm just about ready to walk. I don't want to go down a rabbit hole of why Porsche should care about a customer like me, but it's doubtful that I would not have been converted into a repeat long-term customer if this experience went better. My wife and I actually considered buying a Taycan for our family hauler instead of the Rivian we have on order. We spoke to the dealer and he started talking about markups, bidding to win, and all the other shenanigans I'm going through with the GT4. That one call really helped make the decision to stick with the Rivian much easier.
06-01-2022, 10:56 PM
#4269
Xxyion and others here are getting my feelings more-or-less correct. I am perfectly clear that the dealers are separate businesses from Porsche NA and I get how a reseller relationship works. To me, this structure does not absolve Porsche NA or the dealerships... I've run businesses where I was a software reseller. If our customers were unhappy, we would hear from the software provider and they would threaten to cut our reseller status, increase our buy price, or even end the relationship entirely. Our purpose in the chain was to add value to the buyer's experience, not make it worse.
In my opinion, the correct way for Porsche NA to have handled the shortages over the last couple years would have been to more quickly increase MSRP, increase the built-in margin @ MSRP for the dealerships, and aggressively move allocations around as needed to favor dealerships that received positive buyer feedback.
As I see it, my dealer and I had an agreement in principal and they have backed out because the market conditions have provided more profitable alternatives. This scenario happens all the time in all businesses. A well run business will follow through on its promises and fulfill orders, even where they are no longer ideal -- as this protects the brand and the long-term relationship. I placed a Rivian order before they increased their prices. Rivian made headlines when they said they were increasing prices for existing reservations like mine. It took them what... 1-2 days to realize that was a mistake and restore folks like me to our originally agreed-upon price? They told me to expect a car around December and it now looks like I'm going to have my car about 3 months ahead of schedule. They promised it at a price that is no longer profitable for them, but they're still going to sell it to me for that. I will have the option to sell that car the minute I take delivery and make probably a $20-40k profit -- but they aren't using that to renegotiate the deal. My buying experience with Rivian has been outstanding and I'm increasingly becoming a fan of the company, not just the car I'm buying.
Compare my Rivian experience to what's happening with Porsche. The GT4 is a great car -- no one here is disputing that. But this is hands-down the worst car buying experience I've had -- and I've had plenty of bad car buying experiences. This was going to be my first Porsche, but I'm irritated enough that I'm just about ready to walk. I don't want to go down a rabbit hole of why Porsche should care about a customer like me, but it's doubtful that I would not have been converted into a repeat long-term customer if this experience went better. My wife and I actually considered buying a Taycan for our family hauler instead of the Rivian we have on order. We spoke to the dealer and he started talking about markups, bidding to win, and all the other shenanigans I'm going through with the GT4. That one call really helped make the decision to stick with the Rivian much easier.
In my opinion, the correct way for Porsche NA to have handled the shortages over the last couple years would have been to more quickly increase MSRP, increase the built-in margin @ MSRP for the dealerships, and aggressively move allocations around as needed to favor dealerships that received positive buyer feedback.
As I see it, my dealer and I had an agreement in principal and they have backed out because the market conditions have provided more profitable alternatives. This scenario happens all the time in all businesses. A well run business will follow through on its promises and fulfill orders, even where they are no longer ideal -- as this protects the brand and the long-term relationship. I placed a Rivian order before they increased their prices. Rivian made headlines when they said they were increasing prices for existing reservations like mine. It took them what... 1-2 days to realize that was a mistake and restore folks like me to our originally agreed-upon price? They told me to expect a car around December and it now looks like I'm going to have my car about 3 months ahead of schedule. They promised it at a price that is no longer profitable for them, but they're still going to sell it to me for that. I will have the option to sell that car the minute I take delivery and make probably a $20-40k profit -- but they aren't using that to renegotiate the deal. My buying experience with Rivian has been outstanding and I'm increasingly becoming a fan of the company, not just the car I'm buying.
Compare my Rivian experience to what's happening with Porsche. The GT4 is a great car -- no one here is disputing that. But this is hands-down the worst car buying experience I've had -- and I've had plenty of bad car buying experiences. This was going to be my first Porsche, but I'm irritated enough that I'm just about ready to walk. I don't want to go down a rabbit hole of why Porsche should care about a customer like me, but it's doubtful that I would not have been converted into a repeat long-term customer if this experience went better. My wife and I actually considered buying a Taycan for our family hauler instead of the Rivian we have on order. We spoke to the dealer and he started talking about markups, bidding to win, and all the other shenanigans I'm going through with the GT4. That one call really helped make the decision to stick with the Rivian much easier.
Demand is very very high for GT cars - understatement - higher than you can immagine. Maybe you should buy a few garden veriety cars first like a Boxter, Carrera, Cayenne Tycan etc. Don't be picky. Buy what they have and what they can sell you. Then sell them back to the dealer when done and let them make money on those cars again. This will help you buy the desirable cars against their customers who already have done the aforementioned who also want GT cars. Seems a bit unreasonable of you to think you deserve a GT car as your first Porsche with their long time customers in line too all banging their doors down. Complaining here does you nothing. Get your wallet out and execute often and be patient.
Last edited by TexasPorschelover; 06-01-2022 at 10:58 PM.
06-01-2022, 11:05 PM
#4270
Track Day
I spoke with the sales manager, but not the GM. He basically said the SA was informing me correctly that they would be taking my lunch money… because that’s what’s they decided to do.
06-01-2022, 11:10 PM
#4271
Drifting
Demand is very very high for GT cars - understatement - higher than you can immagine. Maybe you should buy a few garden veriety cars first like a Boxter, Carrera, Cayenne Tycan etc. Don't be picky. Buy what they have and what they can sell you. Then sell them back to the dealer when done and let them make money on those cars again. This will help you buy the desirable cars against their customers who already have done the aforementioned who also want GT cars. Seems a bit unreasonable of you to think you deserve a GT car as your first Porsche with their long time customers in line too all banging their doors down. Complaining here does you nothing. Get your wallet out and execute often and be patient.
I don't think anyone feels like they "deserve" a GT car as their first Porsche, but more we feel we deserve at least some clarity so we aren't jerked around. Like I said earlier, had the dealership just told him up front months ago when he checked in, that MSRP just wasn't going to happen, he would most likely be driving a GT4 right now.
Also being a long time customer does NOT guarantee you an allocation at all. I'm proof of that. I secured my allocation 2 weeks ago, First time Porsche buyer. I used a broker. I'm pretty sure I skipped a lot of long time Porsche buyers. So them spending all that extra money basically did nothing for them.
The following 4 users liked this post by Xxyion:
06-01-2022, 11:35 PM
#4272
Drifting
Xxyion and others here are getting my feelings more-or-less correct. I am perfectly clear that the dealers are separate businesses from Porsche NA and I get how a reseller relationship works. To me, this structure does not absolve Porsche NA or the dealerships... I've run businesses where I was a software reseller. If our customers were unhappy, we would hear from the software provider and they would threaten to cut our reseller status, increase our buy price, or even end the relationship entirely. Our purpose in the chain was to add value to the buyer's experience, not make it worse.
In my opinion, the correct way for Porsche NA to have handled the shortages over the last couple years would have been to more quickly increase MSRP, increase the built-in margin @ MSRP for the dealerships, and aggressively move allocations around as needed to favor dealerships that received positive buyer feedback.
As I see it, my dealer and I had an agreement in principal and they have backed out because the market conditions have provided more profitable alternatives. This scenario happens all the time in all businesses. A well run business will follow through on its promises and fulfill orders, even where they are no longer ideal -- as this protects the brand and the long-term relationship. I placed a Rivian order before they increased their prices. Rivian made headlines when they said they were increasing prices for existing reservations like mine. It took them what... 1-2 days to realize that was a mistake and restore folks like me to our originally agreed-upon price? They told me to expect a car around December and it now looks like I'm going to have my car about 3 months ahead of schedule. They promised it at a price that is no longer profitable for them, but they're still going to sell it to me for that. I will have the option to sell that car the minute I take delivery and make probably a $20-40k profit -- but they aren't using that to renegotiate the deal. My buying experience with Rivian has been outstanding and I'm increasingly becoming a fan of the company, not just the car I'm buying.
Compare my Rivian experience to what's happening with Porsche. The GT4 is a great car -- no one here is disputing that. But this is hands-down the worst car buying experience I've had -- and I've had plenty of bad car buying experiences. This was going to be my first Porsche, but I'm irritated enough that I'm just about ready to walk. I don't want to go down a rabbit hole of why Porsche should care about a customer like me, but it's doubtful that I would not have been converted into a repeat long-term customer if this experience went better. My wife and I actually considered buying a Taycan for our family hauler instead of the Rivian we have on order. We spoke to the dealer and he started talking about markups, bidding to win, and all the other shenanigans I'm going through with the GT4. That one call really helped make the decision to stick with the Rivian much easier.
In my opinion, the correct way for Porsche NA to have handled the shortages over the last couple years would have been to more quickly increase MSRP, increase the built-in margin @ MSRP for the dealerships, and aggressively move allocations around as needed to favor dealerships that received positive buyer feedback.
As I see it, my dealer and I had an agreement in principal and they have backed out because the market conditions have provided more profitable alternatives. This scenario happens all the time in all businesses. A well run business will follow through on its promises and fulfill orders, even where they are no longer ideal -- as this protects the brand and the long-term relationship. I placed a Rivian order before they increased their prices. Rivian made headlines when they said they were increasing prices for existing reservations like mine. It took them what... 1-2 days to realize that was a mistake and restore folks like me to our originally agreed-upon price? They told me to expect a car around December and it now looks like I'm going to have my car about 3 months ahead of schedule. They promised it at a price that is no longer profitable for them, but they're still going to sell it to me for that. I will have the option to sell that car the minute I take delivery and make probably a $20-40k profit -- but they aren't using that to renegotiate the deal. My buying experience with Rivian has been outstanding and I'm increasingly becoming a fan of the company, not just the car I'm buying.
Compare my Rivian experience to what's happening with Porsche. The GT4 is a great car -- no one here is disputing that. But this is hands-down the worst car buying experience I've had -- and I've had plenty of bad car buying experiences. This was going to be my first Porsche, but I'm irritated enough that I'm just about ready to walk. I don't want to go down a rabbit hole of why Porsche should care about a customer like me, but it's doubtful that I would not have been converted into a repeat long-term customer if this experience went better. My wife and I actually considered buying a Taycan for our family hauler instead of the Rivian we have on order. We spoke to the dealer and he started talking about markups, bidding to win, and all the other shenanigans I'm going through with the GT4. That one call really helped make the decision to stick with the Rivian much easier.
They did not honour their end of the deal.
GT cars are always hot commodities. We are also in unprecedented time ie COVID/ Ukraine/ end of ICE. This just makes them hotter.
Don’t let the poor buying experience sour the brand. Porsche build good cars, that’s why people line up to pay big $$$ for it.
Uufortunately, cars dealers don’t exactly operate like your software business. No disrespect to people in the car business, but car salesman is not exactly known for being honest. There are good ones out there. Unfortunately you did not deal with one.
My old dealer/SA also string me along when the 981 GT4 came out and didn’t deliver. What I did was take my business elsewhere to get my Spyder.
I don’t think time is on your side to wait for an MSRP allocation. I would pay the ADM and custom order one. Once you owned a Porsche, you might be back for more. I won’t be surprised you will end up trading your Rivian for Taycan. The buying experience is important. But at the end of the day, you are driving the vehicle. The buying experience will become distant memory.
06-01-2022, 11:46 PM
#4273
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Guys,
This is a dealer allocation tracker thread.
This thread is to help RL members find allocations.
There is a thread that is dedicated to talking about ADM; so head over there for ADM discussions.
This is a dealer allocation tracker thread.
This thread is to help RL members find allocations.
There is a thread that is dedicated to talking about ADM; so head over there for ADM discussions.
06-02-2022, 09:22 AM
#4274
I mean that just might not be feasible for some people. it certainly isn't for me. Why would I want to buy a car and drive it around for a year that I don't want? Especially with rumors that there will be no more GT4 after 2023. Sure we never know, but very few of us are willing to take that risk. While I can understand building that relationship with the dealership, that also means banking on the fact that, the dealership you bought those cars from, will actually give any benefit. Sometimes they will and sometimes they won't. It will all be on the dealership.
I don't think anyone feels like they "deserve" a GT car as their first Porsche, but more we feel we deserve at least some clarity so we aren't jerked around. Like I said earlier, had the dealership just told him up front months ago when he checked in, that MSRP just wasn't going to happen, he would most likely be driving a GT4 right now.
Also being a long time customer does NOT guarantee you an allocation at all. I'm proof of that. I secured my allocation 2 weeks ago, First time Porsche buyer. I used a broker. I'm pretty sure I skipped a lot of long time Porsche buyers. So them spending all that extra money basically did nothing for them.
I don't think anyone feels like they "deserve" a GT car as their first Porsche, but more we feel we deserve at least some clarity so we aren't jerked around. Like I said earlier, had the dealership just told him up front months ago when he checked in, that MSRP just wasn't going to happen, he would most likely be driving a GT4 right now.
Also being a long time customer does NOT guarantee you an allocation at all. I'm proof of that. I secured my allocation 2 weeks ago, First time Porsche buyer. I used a broker. I'm pretty sure I skipped a lot of long time Porsche buyers. So them spending all that extra money basically did nothing for them.
Last edited by TexasPorschelover; 06-02-2022 at 09:33 AM.
06-02-2022, 11:28 AM
#4275
With everyone talking about GT4/Spyder, you'd think any GTS 4.0 wasn't near unobtainium as well. Although I'm happy that I'll be getting my BGTS soon, my next Porsche will be a...Honda.