While anything is possible and I agree it could happen. Most clubs require passing only on straits and only on one side of the car. Its usually only instructor groups that are allowed passing anywhere, any side. And again, a blinker could accidentally get set off, but I would hope by that level, we are all a bit more aware both as the passer and the passie.
I still hold to the sticking out the window of the arm/hand is a much larger possible safety issue.

Maybe it should be determined by speed or run group? Slower groups give hand signals since they are only at specific locations on the track. Advanced groups that have open passing use blinkers due to much tighter driving distances and higher speeds?

Just sayin.......

 

That's not the norm around here, advanced solo and instructor groups are usually passing anywhere on the track. One organization is switching to passing only on straights in all groups, but I bet they'll lose instructors because of it (including me).

 

Gary, I tip my hat to you. It's quite scary sitting in the right seat with somebody you don't know, especially somebody that seems to have something to prove. I don't know how you guys do it.

 

Sorry, that's what I meant......the instructed groups are regulated to key points on the track for passing and only passenger side. Instructor groups tend to be "open"passing which means anywhere and usually any side with a point.

I don't think I'd participate with a club anymore that didn't allow passing anywhere for instructors. After having raced for 5 years, its all i can do to stay behind a slower car sometimes (sometimes I'm the slower car ) let alone HAVE to wait for a "passing zone".

 

Speaking in terms of the advanced nannies on cars, from a former GT-R owner, they do seem to impede the natural progression of learning car control. I started DE's with my GT-R and did 6-7 weekends before selling it because it is a money pit (carzy mandatory service costs, heavy car=brakes, tires, etc...). During that time I learned to drive it very quickly. I advanced quickly, or so I thought. I always knew that if I made a mistake that the car would save me even with all nannies to race mode. Turning them completely off would log the event into the 'black box' and was grounds for voiding of your warranty if there were ever any issues. I know of one time in particular when I deserved to end up in the gravel trap. The car worked some type of voodoo magic and next thing I knew I was on track and barely missed the apex.

After selling the GT-R and moving to a DE prepped 02 C2 I had a rude awakening. I had to pay infinitely more attention to proper turn ins, apexes, tracking out, track conditions and what the car was telling me. I feel that the 996 has made me an exponentially better driver by making me actually 'drive' it instead of just point and shoot. I still have a tremendous amount to learn.

I do agree that the advanced nannies allow you to be much faster than you have earned the right to be going. They lull the driver into a false sense of security and allow for poor driving precision. Are they nice to have? Sure, I'm sure they save more metal than they bend. But, they certainly inflate more egos than they should.

Just my .02 cents from a former 'that GT-R driver'

 

I'd like to learn what the reasons were; was it bad experience?

 

I think there were a couple factors. There were two serious incidents last season, one resulting in serious injury to an instructor (passing wasn't a factor in that incident). Also, they're making their policy more liberal as far as who can ride along with instructors, but they want to reduce risk by allowing instructors to pass only in straights.

Allowing passing only in straights for advanced drivers and instructors would presumably increase safety, but I wonder if it could lead to frustration, and resulting aggression, which would reduce the safety benefit, maybe even making things less safe overall. It wouldn't be the first time an action intended to improve safety backfired due to unintended consequences.

 

I say keep it based on the driver not his/her ride for the most part. 99% of the reason you are in a group is your skills and heads up levels. There is some reason to group based on speed but low hp cars can and do play well in the upper groups. I drove a 90HP 912 for many years in Potomac Black. Got real good at working the mirrors and getting people past me and no blinkers ether all arm. No one ever forgets and leaves their arm out.

In the past I have seen that most drivers would also ask to bump down if they brought a far lesser car than normal. (I would not want to run the 912 in Red for example.)

 

Some good ideas here.
-C

 

Suncoast and Goldcoast pca have log books for instructed students. and its a great help for the next instructor.

I'd like to see this added to all drovers, with an annual check out ride.

then solo/instructor driver gives their their book to the CI a the beginning of the weekend. if there is a need, comment can be added before returning the book at the end of weekend.

Even better would be to make this a universal shared book for all clubs to access.


my .02

 

Log books are good.
I find that the Clubregistration comments are becoming more helpful to me, especially since I can read them in advance of the event and use them to help me think through my approach.

 

I've been paying a lot of attention and a little research concerning safety and DE's in the last 2 years. Personally, I don't see a great deal happen that is catastrophic. That said, many of these cars can now hit 150 on the straight with a green student on their first day.

I would like see a basic safety equipment mandate that consists of FR clothing, neck brace or hans, tech equipment bar and minimum belts...something along this line.

Street cars just don't catch fire that often...but when they do there is so much flammable material in the interior, it can be bad, real bad. I'm not saying wear a suit, but regular cotton catches fire and burns fairly easy and under armour melts into the skin to the point that it needs surgical removal. (even though I love under armour and how it performs) Not a good scenario, even if rare. Wear something FR and best case, FR with SFI 3.3 underwear rating. At least you have something that won't burn on your body. A base layer will allow a little more time to get out the car without major burns. The absolute worse thing I see is bare skin in a car during a high performance event.

Neck bracing...even if I'm with a student I always wear a brace. How effective is it? I would at least think it is better than nothing. Hans preferred though.

Belts make driving easier and a heck of lot safer. Many track I attend don't have tons of run off...just walls. Walls hurt. (ask me how I know) Belts keeps me almost injury free in crash.

There are guys that have done many many years of driving with no incident. To me, it is worth a few hundred bucks to add a little protection to a really fun sport.

 

I've seen a number of drivers using 4 to 6-pt belts with no head/neck restraint of any kind, whereas most people seem to think 3-pt belts are safer in that case.

Head/neck restraints like the Simpson products, which strap to your torso, appear to be controversial, some saying it's better than nothing, others saying it has no benefit, others saying it could make things worse. Seems that there isn't any solid data, at least that I'm aware of.

 

That's a great point. We need some solid data to depend on here concerning neck restraints and belts. Do you have any references to back up these statements? Not being smart at all here. I'm genuinely interested. Also, a 6 point belt system allows me to drive instead of hold on...that must offer some safety benefit as long as it isn't offset by decreased safety in case of a crash.

 

I wish I had data, those statements are just a summary of what I've seen myself and heard from others. FWIW, I personally use a HANS when 4 to 6-pt belts are available, use 3-pt belts when I can't use the HANS, and don't use the Simpson or similar products when I can't use the HANS. I've never had occasion to test these approaches by being involved in a wreck, and am hoping to keep it that way.