Matt Romanowski

Then be sure to safety wire your drain plug, oil drain, oil filter, all the caps, etc. becuase they can randomly come off too.

onefastviking

Just an FYI so those that haven't seen this can better understand it.

http://sharkwerks.com/porsche/techni...urbo-cars.html

BTW, just about any shop can to this bolt repair or the welding of the pipes, it's just a little labor intense to do thus the cost.

utkinpol

Suing is the way world works today. Toyota/honda/ford/etc do recalls and do fixes on a non-stop basis, for much smaller grade issues. it is a normal part of how any car business operates today.
Porsche has tons of problems with engine design on m96/m97 motors, coolant hoses issue with GT1, sporadic issues with rods braking off on all motors, i had PM from a guy other day who lost motor on his '07 C2S car as 6th cylinder got famous 'U' shaped crack (well known issue on 996 cars) and he used car on a street and never been to a track, ever. worst part of it is - nothing of it has proper coverage and people 'learn' of this **** only AFTER then buy in into certain model, like i did with my C2 car. who could assume that this M96 engine is such a piece of crap, honestly, after you read about 'Porsche' for so long.

So there are issues there. it is just amazing that most people who run those $100K cars prefer to ignore all the obvious facts and just either pay for repairs or just replace them so they could wait for new part to blow like previous one did.
to suggest 'use water' is a true hypocrisy. No motor should be losing up its parts on its own.

There are plenty of pissed off people on 6speed, here on rennlist and on renntech who have had catastrophic motor failures and were forced to pay full price as PCNA refused to cover any of it. If any lawyer would want to start the process it will not take long to find enough material. i am reading those forums for 4 years now and i saw a lot of cases where motor goes due to IMS, then motor goes due to 6th cylinder, on gt3 cars we had just recently street RS to show out rods braking engine case on a street, coolant hoses issue even has its own registry. it is personal choice for any owner what to do with those issues but to start pretending here that issue does not exist like some who responded here is just a hypocrisy. any mechanical issue can be fixed. any badly designed motor can be replaced with a motor of a different design or a whole car can be replaced, it is just how any business works.

and to speak of 'prices' when freaking 4.0 RS with good options already costs above $200K and still blows its coolant hoses at that price mark is ridicolous.

Matt Romanowski

This thread is

utkinpol

Matt, would you like to spend $230K on a 4.0 RS car just to learn from a friend on rennlist that you need to take it to a nearby indi shop to have all hoses welded?

As dealership refuses to do ANY work on those joints on any car that is stil under warranty? They do it just fine on cars that are out of warranty, but on those that are still warranted you will need to wait for hoses to blow to be glued back.

If you interfere with engine on any of those cars that are under warranty - you have very good chance to have subsequent engine related warranty claim to be denied. wanna try it on your own car? it is true there are plenty of people here who do not have issues buying those cars for cash and taking them out of warranty with any mods they want but there are also plenty of regular folks for which $140K GT3 car is a very significant investment. you loose your warranty and in case of any **** you look at full retail price of $60K for a replacement GT1 metzger motor. and it is anything but funny. it is enough money to be concerned about. my 3.6L M96 costs $20k new and may be $10k used so i am trying to find my peace with it considering it an inevitable thing to happen sooner or later when it will spill all its parts on a road but honestly it also pisses me off quite bad. why anybody presumes it is OK to have an IMS bomb in the motor and wait for it to explode? what is OK about it, really?

mglobe

If you're so unhappy, go drive a Camry.

utkinpol

i don`t give a **** to crackass comments like this. it`s my life and my money, i owe nothing to you on how i "shoud" feel about it.
issues with those cars do exist, and factory does nothing other than to silently fix them sometimes optionally forcing people to sign non-disclosure agreements. or more commonly making people to pay full retail for repairs.
i guess if it is what makes you so happy, it is your choice then.

ltc

Suing is the only way to deal with PCNA in matters such as this.
The only downside is that you have to believe in your cause to justify the time and money that you will spend.
So, if you beleive that your principles are all that matters and you have the resources, go forth.
Otherwise, join an existing class action, fix it yourself or sell the car.

Veloce Raptor

Oy vey.

M758

I am going to sue PCNA for my number 2 rod bearing spinning and blowing up my motor.

I am sure they wil jump at that... Hey I spun on my own oil at 90 mph and could have crashed hard.

utkinpol

PCNA reads those forums and all this stuff was discussed quite some times on 9planet, 6speed, renntech, and here too. you look at certain policies at corporate level on how they assess issues and how they resolve them.
that coolant hoses issue is a very typical sample as from mechanical standpoint issue by itself is minor still it gets no resolution. if you think PCNA is not aware of it - you are mistaken.

no matter what happens first thing any service manager at a dealer says to you - no, i have never seen that happening before, those cars are reliable. just ask anybody with a blown motor on any of major forums.

if you need data - speak to any mechanic at any good race shop who was dealing with those cars for 20+ years, they will tell you all about weak spots and they have stats they can share.

jcb-memphis

Thanks.

For the board, I rebuilt my tranny as the 2nd gear pop out issue bit me...that also is not something PCNA cares about. That was 5k at Dougherty's in Philly. Had a now known mod done to fix the design issue there.


So, this is not new stuff to me.....that was a lot less dangerous to others though...this one will end up killing someone. And you say they know about this ....ug.

Doug007

I own a BMW 335i and the high pressure fuel pumps were a major issue with those cars. They would fail left and right, killing power and leaving you stranded. Many considered this a major safety issue since you could easily be rear ended after suddenly loosing power on the highway.

Many people on the boards documented this and BMW knew all about it and did nothing but replace HPFPs under warranty (only to fail again, and again, and again).

Finally a board member managed to get on Good Morning America to publicize the issue. All of a sudden there was a class action settlement and cash for people who had the problems. IMHO, this sort of thing will get Porsche's attention much more than a couple guys threatening lawsuits. It's just very hard to arrange...

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/10/26/a...ms-lawsuits-w/
http://abcnews.go.com/TheLaw/bmw-adm...#.TzqWM1zOV2A/

FWIW, at my first DE at MSR Houston I personally saw two GT3s dump these hoses on track on the same day. Made for an interesting afternoon entering the carousel...

sig_a

I see it this way.

Safety is first. OVR/PCA can require whatever they want to require at HPDE events they host. Requiring water in liquid cooled engines seems smart to me. In fact, more uniform and rigorous pre-event tech inspections would be painful to some but a definite safety plus.

Whose fault and who pays to remedy is secondary. Tight inspections would cut accident risk significantly.

blake

You are missing the point completely... Porsche ADVERTISED the GT3 as a car for the track, and but will not cover the car on the track (equals intended use).

Don't get me wrong - I am a huge proponent of people taking accountability for their actions. I think our legal system is a joke, and I think that most lawsuits are completely frivolous. BUT, I have seen first hand how the legal system works in the business world and how common sense is thrown out the window. If those are the rules (like them or not), I have to abide by them - and protect my assets and my family. According to those rules, Porsche (like BMW with the fuel pump) is in the wrong and exposing themselves to massive liability. And as I stated in a previous post, that liability is now on me personally if I cause a wreck on the track.

Taking your toys and going home is not a very good strategy. Good luck with that.