ASK THE COACH
08-14-2014, 04:32 PM
#1682
Still plays with cars.
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08-14-2014, 05:53 PM
#1684
Banned
Re: C1 C2 and C3 - in my car I would enter C1 from mid track at most (not all the way left) using trail braking to rotate the car and making C1 a very late apex and staying full right between C1 and C2. This would give me the best line for C2 and a higher exit speed into the straight section before C3. IF a qualifying lap, I'd pop off the brakes entering C1 to rotate the car and catch the back end with a burst of power - but it is hell on rear tires 
08-15-2014, 12:02 AM
#1685
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I would certainly not recommend entering the Left Hander "mid-track," for optimal exit...
__________________
-Peter Krause
www.peterkrause.net
www.gofasternow.com
"Combining the Art and Science of Driving Fast!"
Specializing in Professional, Private Driver Performance Evaluation and Optimization
Consultation Available Remotely and at VIRginia International Raceway
-Peter Krause
www.peterkrause.net
www.gofasternow.com
"Combining the Art and Science of Driving Fast!"
Specializing in Professional, Private Driver Performance Evaluation and Optimization
Consultation Available Remotely and at VIRginia International Raceway
08-15-2014, 01:02 AM
#1686
Banned
Curious about how you recommend the left-hander should be taken.
08-15-2014, 01:05 AM
#1687
Instructor
Re: C1 C2 and C3 - in my car I would enter C1 from mid track at most (not all the way left) using trail braking to rotate the car and making C1 a very late apex and staying full right between C1 and C2. This would give me the best line for C2 and a higher exit speed into the straight section before C3. IF a qualifying lap, I'd pop off the brakes entering C1 to rotate the car and catch the back end with a burst of power - but it is hell on rear tires
Many thanks,
-C
08-15-2014, 01:35 AM
#1688
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I meant more regarding the "staying full right between C1 and C2" part.
Of course, the pictured C1 section is not the exact mirror-image of the left-hander. Besides, it's debatable where the exact "entry" point of the left-hander is.
Curious about how you recommend the left-hander should be taken.
Of course, the pictured C1 section is not the exact mirror-image of the left-hander. Besides, it's debatable where the exact "entry" point of the left-hander is.
Curious about how you recommend the left-hander should be taken.
I have a very specific ideas on how to take the Left Hander, using landmarks such as the women's restroom door <grin>, the worker station, drivers right and the beginning of the outside radius of the pavement's edge. I'm in the MacInnes, Lopez, Kirkby camp. Enter right of center and delay turn in until the outside edge of the road turns... Scary until you gain confidence in the increasing camber gain and more successfully juxtapose the end of braking, the steering input (which should not change after initial) and throttle pickup...
I find most brake too early (or heaven forbid, coast in...), stay too central in their position (and sometimes worse, LEFT of center) at entry and ride around the inside radius far too early and far too long.
In a powerful car, it's far more important to accelerate fully longer, then brake later, harder and for a shorter period of time than to be equivocal in all inputs.
The Left Hander is a superb exercise in walking the friction circle around the outside edge at entry and towards the positive acceleration before the transition to the right onto No Name. It's SO cool when you do it right!
08-15-2014, 10:15 AM
#1689
Banned
Good, then on the former, I agree with you!
I have a very specific ideas on how to take the Left Hander, using landmarks such as the women's restroom door <grin>, the worker station, drivers right and the beginning of the outside radius of the pavement's edge. I'm in the MacInnes, Lopez, Kirkby camp. Enter right of center and delay turn in until the outside edge of the road turns... Scary until you gain confidence in the increasing camber gain and more successfully juxtapose the end of braking, the steering input (which should not change after initial) and throttle pickup...
I find most brake too early (or heaven forbid, coast in...), stay too central in their position (and sometimes worse, LEFT of center) at entry and ride around the inside radius far too early and far too long.
In a powerful car, it's far more important to accelerate fully longer, then brake later, harder and for a shorter period of time than to be equivocal in all inputs.
The Left Hander is a superb exercise in walking the friction circle around the outside edge at entry and towards the positive acceleration before the transition to the right onto No Name. It's SO cool when you do it right!
I have a very specific ideas on how to take the Left Hander, using landmarks such as the women's restroom door <grin>, the worker station, drivers right and the beginning of the outside radius of the pavement's edge. I'm in the MacInnes, Lopez, Kirkby camp. Enter right of center and delay turn in until the outside edge of the road turns... Scary until you gain confidence in the increasing camber gain and more successfully juxtapose the end of braking, the steering input (which should not change after initial) and throttle pickup...
I find most brake too early (or heaven forbid, coast in...), stay too central in their position (and sometimes worse, LEFT of center) at entry and ride around the inside radius far too early and far too long.
In a powerful car, it's far more important to accelerate fully longer, then brake later, harder and for a shorter period of time than to be equivocal in all inputs.
The Left Hander is a superb exercise in walking the friction circle around the outside edge at entry and towards the positive acceleration before the transition to the right onto No Name. It's SO cool when you do it right!
I am a MacInnes apprentice, btw -- we know each other well. I mostly agree with your recommendations. That, btw, is also the PCA DE instructed line. But there are other schools, as well. That corner is a living, breathing thing changing with temperature, tire grip, HP, brakes, race or qualifying, etc. I've noticed ALMS and other pro race-cars veer more to the left (inside) than that, even on qualifying laps. Take a look at Patrick Long:
Another problem for getting too far out (right) on a busy race day is that this area becomes "in the marbles" and grip falls off very quickly as you leave the cleaner inside.
I love that corner and I agree it's so satisfying when you nail the 3-D grip-ballet just right -- slowly transferring from trail-brake to full gas BEFORE you go full left for the next turn, small breathe, then sling-shot onto No Name with great exit speed (AIM Solo confirming with a great predicted lap time
). It's moments like that keep drawing me back to the track.
08-15-2014, 11:39 AM
#1690
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A small breathe? Hahaha! Not in my car! 
Yes, I know what the pros do (and I have Pats data from other tracks, along with Marc Goosens and a bunch of others), but I think right of center entry, braking later and turning deeper, is still quickest! For almost all drivers...
Hope to see you up there!
Yes, I know what the pros do (and I have Pats data from other tracks, along with Marc Goosens and a bunch of others), but I think right of center entry, braking later and turning deeper, is still quickest!
For almost all drivers...Hope to see you up there!
08-16-2014, 02:15 PM
#1692
Instructor
I'm going out on Monday to give those turns another go. This time I'll remember cards for the camera...
Many thanks for all your help - will try to do you proud.
-C
Many thanks for all your help - will try to do you proud.
-C
08-22-2014, 06:59 PM
#1693
Intermediate
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Hiring a coach
Beyond obvious questions (when, where, costs), what other issues should be addressed prior to hiring a driving (race) coach? Any specific recommendations on evaluating multiple coaches prior to picking one?
Thanks!
Thanks!
08-22-2014, 09:44 PM
#1694
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There are several kinds of coaches, each with pros and cons.
The most common kind is a high level DE driver or instructor who formalizes commercially an arrangement to offer coaching on a per session, per day or per event basis, usually working with multiple drivers at DE or track day events, sometimes club races. Mostly, these folks ride right seat and offer rides in their own cars at events.
The second most common kind is a current or former high level club or "pro" driver who is facile enough to lay down a few benchmark laps for a data comparison in a wide variety of cars and ride right seat to assist in real-time feedback. There may be an introductory level of data involved, and nearly always a simple video review of GoPro or other video footage after the session.
The third offering is a current top level pro (I think of Andrew Davis, Jim Pace, David Murry, Tom Long, Seth Thomas and others) who take on one or two dedicated clients at a particular event and provide data and video as well as occasionally ride along. They're very good and tend to provide more factual information than just their experience....
The fourth offering are people that make a very good living as dedicated driver performance analysts and coaches, familiar with a wide variety of cars, using data and video exclusively and working for multipe days with a client. These are people that aren't looking for a drive and have a proven track record of performance helping intermediate to advanced drivers find time, return to the best execution of fundamental skills and proceed in a measured, objective and incremental way. Maybe two dozen folks in North America, tops.
The first and foremost question needs to be, are your goals and objectives compatible with the coaches? Is the coach dedicated to YOUR program? Is there an objective measure of your performance beyond the subjective valuation obtained by simple observation? How much pre event information do you get? Is there a pre event questionnaire sent to define YOUR goals and outlining your strengths and opportunities for improvement? Ask for references.
Coaching is a very personal thing. The communications style and communications level of the coach can make or break the value of the engagement. Seek a coach that draws YOU out, wants to have YOU explain to THEM where you feel you most want to work and works WITH you on how to get there, while BALANCING risk versus reward.
The mrore a prospective coach is interested in your background, experience and desired goals and objectives, the better sign that is...
Many drivers are quick to glom on to "celebrity" drivers only to find out that they're great drivers, but less than optimal communicators. The goal HAS to be YOUR advancement, YOUR illumination and YOUR development as a driver. Look for those trends in the discussions you have with prospective coaches, first.
BTW, I am NOT soliciting work. I'm full for 2014 and already taking reservations for selected 2016 dates... Yes, 2016!
Good luck! There are plenty of good folks and quite a few that are less so... <grin>
The most common kind is a high level DE driver or instructor who formalizes commercially an arrangement to offer coaching on a per session, per day or per event basis, usually working with multiple drivers at DE or track day events, sometimes club races. Mostly, these folks ride right seat and offer rides in their own cars at events.
The second most common kind is a current or former high level club or "pro" driver who is facile enough to lay down a few benchmark laps for a data comparison in a wide variety of cars and ride right seat to assist in real-time feedback. There may be an introductory level of data involved, and nearly always a simple video review of GoPro or other video footage after the session.
The third offering is a current top level pro (I think of Andrew Davis, Jim Pace, David Murry, Tom Long, Seth Thomas and others) who take on one or two dedicated clients at a particular event and provide data and video as well as occasionally ride along. They're very good and tend to provide more factual information than just their experience....
The fourth offering are people that make a very good living as dedicated driver performance analysts and coaches, familiar with a wide variety of cars, using data and video exclusively and working for multipe days with a client. These are people that aren't looking for a drive and have a proven track record of performance helping intermediate to advanced drivers find time, return to the best execution of fundamental skills and proceed in a measured, objective and incremental way. Maybe two dozen folks in North America, tops.
The first and foremost question needs to be, are your goals and objectives compatible with the coaches? Is the coach dedicated to YOUR program? Is there an objective measure of your performance beyond the subjective valuation obtained by simple observation? How much pre event information do you get? Is there a pre event questionnaire sent to define YOUR goals and outlining your strengths and opportunities for improvement? Ask for references.
Coaching is a very personal thing. The communications style and communications level of the coach can make or break the value of the engagement. Seek a coach that draws YOU out, wants to have YOU explain to THEM where you feel you most want to work and works WITH you on how to get there, while BALANCING risk versus reward.
The mrore a prospective coach is interested in your background, experience and desired goals and objectives, the better sign that is...
Many drivers are quick to glom on to "celebrity" drivers only to find out that they're great drivers, but less than optimal communicators. The goal HAS to be YOUR advancement, YOUR illumination and YOUR development as a driver. Look for those trends in the discussions you have with prospective coaches, first.
BTW, I am NOT soliciting work. I'm full for 2014 and already taking reservations for selected 2016 dates... Yes, 2016!
Good luck! There are plenty of good folks and quite a few that are less so... <grin>
08-22-2014, 10:35 PM
#1695
Intermediate
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