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Congratulations you now own one of the greatest racing engines in production, you're going to have a lot of fun!
I know you love the car, Para82, and I share your enthusiasm or I wouldn't be following this thread, but don't oversell it. The FPC Voodoo engine is exclusive to the GT350 street car--it has not been used in any of the derivative Mustang race cars and won't be. Neither the Shelby FP350S or the Mustang GT4 race cars use the flat-plane crank version of the 5.2L V-8, so it is not really the "greatest racing engine in production."
I know you love the car, Para82, and I share your enthusiasm or I wouldn't be following this thread, but don't oversell it. The FPC Voodoo engine is exclusive to the GT350 street car--it has not been used in any of the derivative Mustang race cars and won't be. Neither the Shelby FP350S or the Mustang GT4 race cars use the flat-plane crank version of the 5.2L V-8, so it is not really the "greatest racing engine in production."
TT
That's false.
The Shelby GT350R-C (the car that competed and won the 2016 IMSA CTSC Championship) used the Flat Plane Crank V8 5.2 engine. Proven pedigree before it even went into production just like Porsche did at one time, a racing champion.
Para: Tweed is 100% correct. The GT350RC did well in general when it actually competed and was running but there is a "reason" they stopped running the fpc 5.2 and why the new Mustang GT4 now uses a Boss 302 drive train taken to 5.2L. If you follow WC and the Continnental series you should know this. I've been in the paddocks and garages and "know" those who "know" and race them. Been there and seen it and was told "why". Good track day engine but ends there. The Boss 302 was a better "race" engine and still is. They went back to it for a good reason.
The Shelby GT350R-C (the car that competed and won the 2016 IMSA CTSC Championship) used the Flat Plane Crank V8 5.2 engine. Proven pedigree before it even went into production just like Porsche did at one time, a racing champion.
Putting aside the fact that the GT350R-C was a precursor to the production GT350 and used a bespoke version of the 5.2L FPC V-8 built and tuned by Roush Yates Engines rather than the production Voodoo engine as used in the GT350, there is a reason that none of the race cars built AFTER the release of the GT350 (and therefore a DERIVATIVE of it) use the FPC V-8, as Waxer says. If the Voodoo is the "best production race engine ever," why aren't they using it anymore?
You will not hear Ford Performance talk about it, and the press reports ignore it, but the basic problem with a FPC V-8 is secondary vibration harmonics. The Ford engineers did as much as they could to overcome this design limitation, but it is basically not a superior design for a race V-8, though it sounds very different and carries a certain marketing cachet. https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/flat-...ed-stephen-kim
Several professional race engine builders I recently spoke with regarding the pros and cons of a flat-plane crank stated that, given their vibration issues, they had no idea why Ford opted to use one in the new GT350. Others suggested that it was purely for marketing. If there were indeed marketing considerations behind the decision to go flat-plane, kudos to Ford's marketing department. Ford turned “flat-plane crank” into a sexy catch phrase that sounds really impressive to people who know absolutely nothing about engines. Everyone’s talking about the GT350’s flat-plane crank, and you got to hand it to Ford for pulling off one heck of a PR coups that transformed the entire automotive press corps into a flat-plane crank propaganda machine.
Ford's new 5.2L sets new benchmarks in specific output and engine speed for American V-8s. Focusing so much attention on a single component (the crank), which plays a very minor role in its overall achievements, is an insult to the rest of the design work that went into creating this great new engine. Still, I can’t help but feel bad for the engineers at Ford getting snubbed by all this flat-plane nonsense. Someone at Ford designed some badass CNC-ported cylinder heads for the new 5.2L, but no one’s talking about that. Someone at Ford designed the F1-inspired roller finger follower DOHC valvetrain that makes OE pushrod motors look stupid, but no one’s talking about that. Someone at Ford designed the camshaft profiles and a variable valve-timing strategy that—when combined with the phenomenal low-lift airflow of the 5.2L’s four-valve cylinder heads—enables it to produce 24-percent more torque per cubic inch than GM’s 7.0L LS7 (1.36 vs. 1.10), but no one’s talking about that. All of these factors play a far more substantial role in both the 5.2L’s specific output and high-rpm capability than its flat-plane crank, but no one’s talking about that.
Funny, Para has been consistently bumping this thread up and amping the GT350 as he owns one. There is one big problem with the GT350 and it is weight. Magride is the sole reason it is able to hide its mass. It's weight will be an issue on brakes as pads will be chewed up up faster than the Porsche's or Vette's. Did some math and despite the GT3's pads costing more than the GT350. On track, the GT350 will have gone through 3 different sets of pads before its time to change the GT3's simply due to mass.
Great motor from Ford but far from 'one of the greatest' engines ever made. I was at the IMSA races and having talked to Ford, they are not using the Voodoo motor for reasons they cannot fully disclose.
I am thankful Ford gave us the GT350 but its not without its flaws. I believe it has one of the best sounding stock exhausts ever and that's really about it.
As Ford's first try on the Flat Plane Crank, time will tell if these motors will be reliable. Stories forthcoming when warranties are done.
VooDoo motor out according to racing people b/c of above mentioned harmonic vibration that Ferrari was able to overcome in their flat plane v-8. Ford is kind being hush hush but the motor is anything but reliable long term on track!
Some real world data for you guys on the GT350. I was out bombing my stock ZR1 around Motorsport Ranch outside Fort Worth and on my second session, I see a GT350R in my mirror. It was over 95F out so I was watching my engine temps (can't wait for the 991.2 GT3 so I don't have to worry about that anymore). ZR1 can get hot in ambients over 90F when pushed hard for 10+ minutes. Anyway, notice I'm not really losing the Mustang, but he's not really gaining on me either.
Several more laps go by and I finally get a coolant warning so I start a cool down lap and let him go blasting by to finish the session.
I go up and compliment his pace and I ask him about his car, specifically his engine temps. He pulls out an IPad which is connected to a datalogger OBD2. He did switch out all fluids to Motul.
Results? His max oil temp was 268 and coolant 213.
My stock ZR1 that session? 295 oil temp and 260 coolant.
i was very impressed with the Mustang. Ford did a great job apparently with the engine cooling system. Kudos for Ford!
Sadly, he told me later that afternoon he did pop an engine which Ford quickly replaced. He was going over the turn 1 transition at TWS at 150mph near 8000rpm and the bump at the transition caused the engine to rev freely for a split second which is what this guy blames on the engine failure. Dunno, but still a bummer. Seems like very hard driven GT350's may have issues potentially.
The saving grace for the GT350 is cheap factory backed 8 year extended warranties are so cheap that it's laughable. Try getting 8 years of catastrophic powertrain coverage from Porsche and do a price comparison... Just my .02
The below quote was for a used 2017 GT350 (Non R) with 2k miles and not purchased within 12 months from new so you may actually be able to get the price cheaper if within 12 months or less or purchasing new.
*One gotcha is that is the price get's prohibitive if you select R so for that reason alone I would opt for a non-R 2017 and up which includes the track pack with cooling and magneride standard.
Funny, Para has been consistently bumping this thread up and amping the GT350 as he owns one. There is one big problem with the GT350 and it is weight. Magride is the sole reason it is able to hide its mass. It's weight will be an issue on brakes as pads will be chewed up up faster than the Porsche's or Vette's. Did some math and despite the GT3's pads costing more than the GT350. On track, the GT350 will have gone through 3 different sets of pads before its time to change the GT3's simply due to mass.
Great motor from Ford but far from 'one of the greatest' engines ever made. I was at the IMSA races and having talked to Ford, they are not using the Voodoo motor for reasons they cannot fully disclose.
I am thankful Ford gave us the GT350 but its not without its flaws. I believe it has one of the best sounding stock exhausts ever and that's really about it.
As Ford's first try on the Flat Plane Crank, time will tell if these motors will be reliable. Stories forthcoming when warranties are done.
Actually you're wrong, I didn't even post up this thread - someone else did and the people that bump it up are mostly new owners, go back and read it again.
Other than that sounds like you have a lot of experience with the new GT350, how many track days have you done with yours?
Funny, Para has been consistently bumping this thread up and amping the GT350 as he owns one. There is one big problem with the GT350 and it is weight. Magride is the sole reason it is able to hide its mass. It's weight will be an issue on brakes as pads will be chewed up up faster than the Porsche's or Vette's. Did some math and despite the GT3's pads costing more than the GT350. On track, the GT350 will have gone through 3 different sets of pads before its time to change the GT3's simply due to mass.
Great motor from Ford but far from 'one of the greatest' engines ever made. I was at the IMSA races and having talked to Ford, they are not using the Voodoo motor for reasons they cannot fully disclose.
I am thankful Ford gave us the GT350 but its not without its flaws. I believe it has one of the best sounding stock exhausts ever and that's really about it.
As Ford's first try on the Flat Plane Crank, time will tell if these motors will be reliable. Stories forthcoming when warranties are done.
I own a 3000 pound 996gt3 and a gt350 and can second this. No way to hide weight on track.
But, If I could only own one car it would be the gt350. Does everything well.
The 996gt3 is basically only good at one thing. Going around a track flat out.
GT350 puts down some amazing lap times. The engine sounds great. If you stay away from low rpm the vibrations dissapears.
It's a sub 60k dollar car.
Big congrats to Ford for creating this car. We need more trackable street cars in this price bracket.
Don't all current McLarens have a FPC in the Ricardo V8 (which I understand is basically a detuned racing engine)? Is vibration less of a problem in that engine due to better design or perhaps it is simply just much smaller.
07-11-2017, 12:51 PM
