mooty

^ u have to see the cars. i have bought and sold more RS than most dealers. at 147, the car either has issues or the seller is desperate. it is below mkt.

the one on RL i have seen it many times. while no virgin, it is very clean.

mchrono

This begs the question...how do we establish what market is?

There are plenty of "optimistic" asking prices (i.e. dealers sitting on 2011 GT2's).

When a car is sold on RL, or most other outlets, the actual selling price is usually not disclosed.

There is no KBB or NADA type price info for GT2/GT3's. They don't seem to follow a normal depreciation curve!

Dealers have online access to all the auction sales between other dealers across the country.

How do we non-dealers establish market?

nwGTS

It sounds like youre asking others to do work for you.
1) pick up the phone and ask the sellers
2) " " " ask the buyers

this is a low volume market driven mostly by networking (i.e mooty inc).

Start hitting the concrete.

RossP

The bottom line is that "Asking price" is not market value. The only issue (On the surface at least) with that BAT RS car that sold for 147k was that it had a odometer discrepancy from when a emissions place fat fingered the mileage reading. Was it below market? Personally I dont think so. There are a lot of RS cars in the 150-170k range out there that have been sitting for months.

Rick-A-Shay

RS cars don't grow on trees so really not enough volume to establish a market value. I doubt that the difference between a realistic "asking" and "selling" price is very much. What is realistic? That's up to the buyer! For those who can afford, the difference is just small change. Year and condition play an important part. A 7.1 RS will be in a lower price range than an 7.2 RS due to being an older model. A low mileage clean 7.2RS can hit $200k or more based on its build sheet (PTS). Forget what dealers pay, focus on what your budget allows, find a car you like, get a PPI, inspect the car yourself, if needed, buy it and DRIVE it. RE: Auction results......not a good yardstick as emotions run high and some pay way too much!

RossP

100% agree. (Although that does not help the RS value argument here).

sixtyfiver

I agree, comping off the "asking" price is a good indicator of where the market is. I can't see much more than 2-6% discount off the "asking" price and sale amount.

There might be some bargains out there, but there's really no free lunch unless buying from a brother, sister or a rich friend. In most cases bargain cars typically have some underlying issue.

IMO, the Gt3 market has 4 tiers.

If miles are equal, I believe prices could reflect the following.
1. Almost perfect garage queen - 95-100% top level pricing.
2. Above average condition - 90-95%
3. Average condition - 85-90%
4. Abused or story - 70-85%

Mr. Adair

For example on .2 GT3RS's: You can pay 245K for a .2RS bubble wrapped PTS car with 500 miles or you could pay 190K for a one owner very clean car in a desirable color that has 8,000 miles or you could pay 168K for a three owner car that was mechanically perfect with 13,000 miles and is cosmetically 95% that if you want it perfect you may have to put 3-5K back into it to replace clear bra or side skirts or some wheel repair. Yes, it's a wide range. Your pocket book will determine some of this, what car you like, how much work needed etc. Once you have seen 6 cars in person and 100 cars online you will get a better handle on it. I suggest getting one you like, make it your own, make it as perfect as you want and drive the **** out of it. You will love it and do well if you ever part with it...

tasman

I paid towards the top of the market for a 5800 mile two owner gray/red never tracked car. Cosmetically was in very good to excellent/condition. The only thing it did not have which I would have liked was full leather but no biggie in the big scheme. I bought it to drive and thus will likely not be worth as much in long run as mileage will be too high for collector. I did this so I could get a car with "no stories" so I did not have to worry or do a ton of work to it. Got pipes pinned and a few other things and hopefully good to go for years now. Good luck with whatever you buy. I agree with Adair. You get what you pay for. No bad choices you just have to do your homework.



Tal

mooty

when you have 43 GT3/RS purchases since 2011 and looked at over 100+ GT3/RS, u know the mkt.

auction is atypical
if by auction you mean sotherby, RM, goodings. they sell dogs as well as insanely fine examples. and the ppl buying also are very broad: from novice to serious collectors.

if by auction you mean dealer auctions, whole sale prices.
1. most good cars are not in the auctions
2. even if good cars are in these type of auctions, we have no access to it. so it's price is really a guidance of what dealer to dealer trades at.

manitou202

Several of the .2RS I've looked at online have had their transmission removed and/or rebuilt. Have the transmissions been known to have issues? Or is there some sort of regular service that requires removal? Maybe replacing the clutch?

Two examples:

http://www.pmcdetroit.com/detail-201...-16171837.html
https://www.porscheofcoloradosprings...-rs-c-1705.htm

neurotic

i've been on the market for an RS for a long, long time and never came upon any "transmission problems" (but maybe mooty can fill us in)

i suspect most are from heavy, hard track days and "mishaps"

audipwr1

Synchros are soft 2nd gear synchro can go over time.

Almost all cars are very notchy into 2nd after you cross 10 or 20k

Seen quite a few with this, these cars are highly strung and require care and feeding to keep tip top

No different than any other 200k sports car

neurotic

what sort of symptoms should we see?

Mr. Adair

The PMC car has been for sale for a long time. They were very aggressive with me in saying things like make an offer several times. I think it's priced at the bottomish range but I bet it could be bought below 160. I'd expect you to have to spend some money to make that car perfect. Just depends what you want..