Carreralicious

Porsche’s warranty is explicit in terms of mileage and number of years of coverage though. If it made it past that warranty period, how is it a lemon? I agree that in theory and for its reputation’s sake, the engine should not eat itself like that, but good luck in trying to get Porsche to cover this. What might have been better is to have purchased an aftermarket warranty that might have covered this for you. Hope it works out.

BNB911

Didn't LN Do videos about Bore scoring, and said "Its from the piston plating coming off"
Please correct me if Im wrong, but im 99% I seen the video in the last week. But I remember them showing the "bad cyl. , and the Bad Piston exterior finish gone or chipped off/away. Verse ones that were good.
And How many are failing under 10%?

No matter the reason, It really sucks. Sorry to hear. Why not drop the $7500.00 motor in and trade up or keep? The cars are hot right now.

cdk4219

Apparently you bought a Porsche thinking it was going to be as reliable as a Toyota Camry? That’s funny.

As for fixing just one cylinder, thats funny too.

BNB911

I dont know about most of the other members here, but I wanted a 200k version of the 911. But my budget allowed for a very clean 2006 997. 52?K miles.
I purchased car knowing about the bore issues, and a rebuild was 25k ish. Who knows what a trans is or if they are even a problem. I drive it like I stole it, ***** to the wall.
Motor goes, giving LN a call. It is what it is, from below described life style of mine.
My middle class problem, is that I have enough money to get me nice expensive USED toys that cost more than I could ever afford new.
But I go into this knowing that I will pay for over time verse day one.
Please do not include me in a class action, I purchased used as is.

The Op, who bought new, noted problems, went out of warranty, now has the problem, Maybee from what I have read. I really hope it all works out!
Just remember you always catch more with Honey than vinegar. Truly wish you the best of luck.

dubsiren

I am here for you….

PV997

I know Baz Hart at Hartech has implicated the coating (it's actually not a plating, that's the problem), not sure if Charles at LNE agrees. Sometime around 2000 - 2001 Mahle switched to a soft polymer coating that is sprayed on as opposed to a hard coating that is attached via electroplating. That soft coating can start to flake and lift off, leaving aluminum to aluminum contact. In Baz's tech report he shows photos of pistons with flaked off coating that they were lucky enough to observe and catch before borescoring started and destroyed the evidence. There are other factors such as silicon particles breaking off the cylinder walls (made using Lokasil) and gouging the coating, not to mention other contributors like the cooling issue with cylinder 6 and not frequent enough oil changes.

In 2009 with the 997.2 Mahle switched back to a harder, plated coating that may scratch a bit it doesn't flake, along with a different monolithic block/cylinder construction (Alusil). It seems to have improved things considerably as borescoring is less frequent (anecdotally), but it isn't perfect unfortunately.

dubsiren

The shop that I talked to said they are seeing more and more 997s come in with scoring and it just a time thing. The engines will all die, no matter what you do.

BNB911

All of them, every last one dies sooner or later! lol Just like us.
I think thats the hardest part, everyone has a reason or cause for the scoring. Regardless of the issue does anyone have a real number on % of cars that fail based off a set miles, or motor. I heard 10%?
Overheating issues,
Pre 2005 was the IMS,
05-08 Bore score, Either way its a huge major problem for the 911/997.1.
09-12? EFI fuel injected no scoring issues yet?
Pick your poison.
years / models may not be exact, but The trend here is that every year or series run model has some problem. Just like Ford, Chevy, Dodge.
At the end of the day for what any of the toys or trucks cost they are all junk. But we still sign the line and turn the key!
Just remember "You can't take it with you."

dubsiren

I think you just helped write Porsche's new marketing slogan…

“Porsche: just assume the car we just sold you won’t make it to 100,000 miles, because, well, we are Porsche….”

Raise the W flag right now, CDK…. You win.

groovzilla

^^Wrong - The 997.2 engines have issues with cylinder wall flaking. Lots of mention on internet and discussed in other Threads.


.

dubsiren

my buddy has a beautiful old 69 BMW. It has had regular service, oil changes, tune ups, driven. Very, very high miles. And has never had an engine rebuild.

That will NEVER happen with ANY 997 as I understand it. If you own a 997, your cylinder walls are eating themselves as we speak. You can drive it, park it, oil it, tune it up, and it won’t make any difference.

The engine is a timebomb.

The logic I am hearing here is, “well, you bought a Porsche, of course it is a timebomb”. This is absolute bull****. Not ALL 911’s are destined for catastrophic engine detonation. Absolutely the opposite. We have all heard the stories of 70s era 911’s with 600k miles on them running just fine.

Look, I am a Porsche fanboy. I love them. I am looking for an old 911 as I type this. But this 997 situation is garbage. They skated through the IMS issue (somehow), but I think in the next 5 years, when we see waves of 997s grenading, it is going to be a problem for them.

Charles Navarro

I spend about a year in my free time researching this topic in depth and put out this paper several years ago. I go over everything that we know of to this point that can contribute to the problem. If you are at all interested, it's a good, albeit, very technical read.

https://lnengineering.com/education/...s-navarro.html

In the Gen 2 cars, Porsche did make changes, but I still have seen both bore scoring and piston seizing which are two separate issues with similar end results. Baz had posted about this in the past where the bores are shrinking at the bottom near the main webs. This is caused by latent stresses in the castings and made worse by the very tight piston to cylinder clearances which we have documented at .0007" cold which is very tight for a forged piston.

BNB911

View Poll Results: Poll: Have you had bore scoring on your 997.1 or 997.2 engine?
Yes, 997.1 (05-08 MY)

107
13.84%
Yes, 997.2 (09-12 MY)

12
1.55%
No, 997.1 (05-08 MY)

422
54.59%
No, 997.2 (09-12 MY)

232
30.01%
Voters: 773. You have already voted on this poll

BNB911

If I break the 997.1 votes from the 997.2 votes:

997.1 Model
Yes Red = 107
NO Yellow = 422. Almost 25% failure rate.


997.2 Model
yes blue 12
no pink 232. Under 10% Failure?


Im tired, so feel free to check my math.

BNB911

Hi Charles, I will be giving you guys a call next week! Please save me a spot for this fall!