End is Near: EPA versus Porsche
#32
Race Director
I guess someone forgot to tell the Head of The Dept of Climatology at MIT, Dr Lindzen that his opinion doesn't count, even though he is a possessor of many of those "fancy degrees" of which you referred!
People like you forget that their is an entire research industry built up around anthropogenic global warming and that most of these peoples jobs and livelihoods depend on funding from the political class and therefore take every opportunity to paint a very dire future that can only be soved through more of THEIR research! Not to mention Al Gore and his climate trading scam he has arranged with Goldman Sachs!
http://www.globalwarming.org/2009/11...lobal-warming/
People like you forget that their is an entire research industry built up around anthropogenic global warming and that most of these peoples jobs and livelihoods depend on funding from the political class and therefore take every opportunity to paint a very dire future that can only be soved through more of THEIR research! Not to mention Al Gore and his climate trading scam he has arranged with Goldman Sachs!
http://www.globalwarming.org/2009/11...lobal-warming/
The argument that climate change is a scam because there are so many people who will benefit from conversion to a "green" economy is laughable. What people like you forget, to use your phrase, is that the number of individuals and companies who will benefit if climate change is accepted as fact are dwarfed by the commercial and political interests who will continue to be served if it is not. There is far greater financial incentive to prove that human involvement in climate change is a scam and preserve the status quo than there is to prove that it is real and change is required. This debate, like so many, is driven by money and the really big money is on the side of the doubters. The fact that despite this, the overwhelming preponderance of actual science points the other direction, is telling.
Ideology and scoring cheap points may be served by derogatory references to Al Gore but I don't base my understanding on what any one individual has to say. I'm an engineer by training and a pragmatist. I admit to having a bias, but if it doesn't hold up to observable, reproduceable facts and common sense, I'm willing to change my perspective. Evidence trumps ideology. I see too many people who are unwilling to alter their point of view no matter how much evidence is put before them.
One last thing. Let's do a little risk analysis and look at this issue in a different way. Just for the sake of argument, what if you're wrong, climate change is real, and the dire scenarios come to pass? The results for humans could be catastrophic. Coastal and island flooding, violent weather, plant and animal extinctions, disruption of food production, fresh water shortages, drought, economic losses and displacement of populations on a huge scale. No upside that I can think of and a giant downside.
Now, what if I'm wrong, climate change is a crock or at least humans have no part in it, and there are no dire scenarios. There will be economic shifts and hardships in industries like coal and oil production, traditional transportation, etc. but these can be minimized by a reasonable transition and ultimately alternative jobs and technologies will supplement them. On the upside, we'll no longer be funding repressive regimes and terrorist hotbeds for their oil and the massive amounts of capital that now flow out of our country will stay here. We'll also have laid the groundwork for the ultimate long term sustainability of our energy needs and remain competitive in a global economy. Yeah, if I'm wrong, we will have endured uncomfortable change that maybe we didn't need to make, and worst of all for many, I suspect, is that we will have given in to the "environmentalists". But I just don't see that being nearly as much of a problem as we'll have if you've got it wrong.
Now, back to posting about Porsches......
#33
Rennlist Member
I guess someone forgot to tell the Head of The Dept of Climatology at MIT, Dr Lindzen that his opinion doesn't count, even though he is a possessor of many of those "fancy degrees" of which you referred!
People like you forget that their is an entire research industry built up around anthropogenic global warming and that most of these peoples jobs and livelihoods depend on funding from the political class and therefore take every opportunity to paint a very dire future that can only be soved through more of THEIR research! Not to mention Al Gore and his climate trading scam he has arranged with Goldman Sachs!
http://www.globalwarming.org/2009/11...lobal-warming/
People like you forget that their is an entire research industry built up around anthropogenic global warming and that most of these peoples jobs and livelihoods depend on funding from the political class and therefore take every opportunity to paint a very dire future that can only be soved through more of THEIR research! Not to mention Al Gore and his climate trading scam he has arranged with Goldman Sachs!
http://www.globalwarming.org/2009/11...lobal-warming/
#34
Rennlist Member
This is not the forum for this discussion but I'll venture one last post on the subject. After that, flame on. For every expert who attempts to deconstruct climate change there are literally 10 who believe it is real; according to CNN 97% of climatologists canvassed accept that human activity is primarily responsible.
#35
I think I'll apply for a tax break.
#36
Three Wheelin'
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I think it was more about social unrest in the 70's; uncertain economy (the "Nixon Shock" gold thing), a war the country wasn't really behind - then all the loonies start coming out of the wood work - deja vu. A least we got Hendrix out of the deal - this time, nuthin'
Yabba -dabba-doooo!!!!!
Yabba -dabba-doooo!!!!!
al gore's son, showing us that you can still get all coked up and do 110 mph while saving the planet - in a prius!
#37
As someone who has published scientific peer reviewed papers in my field, and have participated in research with others, something smells very fishy in climate gate.
I have my original data from papers published 20 years ago, as well as ALL supporting and non supporting data. NOTHING is ever "thrown out".
The point of peer review is to be able to take others data, review it, and come to a conclusion that matches or refutes the original work, but give the reasons for your conclusions. Not just because we say so.
I have my original data from papers published 20 years ago, as well as ALL supporting and non supporting data. NOTHING is ever "thrown out".
The point of peer review is to be able to take others data, review it, and come to a conclusion that matches or refutes the original work, but give the reasons for your conclusions. Not just because we say so.
#38
I can see it now 2017 Turbo d
4 Cly Hybrid Turbo 185 hp 0-60 18.8
Top speed downwind
Mpg 62 City No highway driving allowed.
But at least we will look good.
King Obama will have all of us Older Porsche owners with a 3,500 guzzler fine. per 100 miles of driving.
We be posting about our great 2 mile drives that we really enjoyed going to eat a Wheat Grass on Pita
Man future is looking Good and sure has been hot here in Memphis this year already has 6 snow days for kids in school. That doesn't make news but the day we hit 102 in July wow Gore will be saying look the Polar Caps Melted again.
4 Cly Hybrid Turbo 185 hp 0-60 18.8
Top speed downwind
Mpg 62 City No highway driving allowed.
But at least we will look good.
King Obama will have all of us Older Porsche owners with a 3,500 guzzler fine. per 100 miles of driving.
We be posting about our great 2 mile drives that we really enjoyed going to eat a Wheat Grass on Pita
Man future is looking Good and sure has been hot here in Memphis this year already has 6 snow days for kids in school. That doesn't make news but the day we hit 102 in July wow Gore will be saying look the Polar Caps Melted again.
#39
Rennlist Member
Now, what if I'm wrong, climate change is a crock or at least humans have no part in it, and there are no dire scenarios. There will be economic shifts and hardships in industries like coal and oil production, traditional transportation, etc. but these can be minimized by a reasonable transition and ultimately alternative jobs and technologies will supplement them. On the upside, we'll no longer be funding repressive regimes and terrorist hotbeds for their oil and the massive amounts of capital that now flow out of our country will stay here. We'll also have laid the groundwork for the ultimate long term sustainability of our energy needs and remain competitive in a global economy.
#40
Uh, aren't you a decade too late? Hednrix died in '70, though his sister is making millions off of him in the 21st century.
I find it interesting that the world population doesn't seem to be factored into these global warming discussions
I find it interesting that the world population doesn't seem to be factored into these global warming discussions
#42
Nordschleife Master
Please do not take this personally, but you echo precisely the phrasing of the 'eco crowd', by using the word 'believe', because it's just that. The subject became a dogmatic religion, damn the facts.
#43
Still plays with cars.
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Mike - climate change is real. Nobody disputes that, it has been going on for millions of years. It's the man-made part that is at issue since Global Warming and Cooling has been going on forever and long before we burned fossil fuels.
The IPCC (on whose conclusions the EPA decided to decree CO2 a pollutant) has admitted the data was wrong and are investigating. The scientist who led the Climate Change bandwagon has admitted (last week) that the data is wrong and that since 1995 the planet has been cooling.
Before we decided to impose billions of new taxes nobody can afford, it might be wise to have some credible evidence. Sure people believe in climate change - I do too. I also know that it is a naturally occurring phenomenon. What nobody knows is whether human activity has any significant impact on it.
Regards,
The IPCC (on whose conclusions the EPA decided to decree CO2 a pollutant) has admitted the data was wrong and are investigating. The scientist who led the Climate Change bandwagon has admitted (last week) that the data is wrong and that since 1995 the planet has been cooling.
Before we decided to impose billions of new taxes nobody can afford, it might be wise to have some credible evidence. Sure people believe in climate change - I do too. I also know that it is a naturally occurring phenomenon. What nobody knows is whether human activity has any significant impact on it.
Regards,
#44
.org
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Follow the money.
Ask yourself what industries have the most to gain by lessing of pollution requirements.
Ask yourself who has unlimited budgets to fund sympathetic science and the armies of lobbyists and think tanks.
It takes profits of billions and billions...a quarter.
Oil and the Right .
Follow the money.
Ask yourself what industries have the most to gain by lessing of pollution requirements.
Ask yourself who has unlimited budgets to fund sympathetic science and the armies of lobbyists and think tanks.
It takes profits of billions and billions...a quarter.
Oil and the Right .
Follow the money.
#45
Still plays with cars.
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Follow the money.
Ask yourself what industries have the most to gain by lessing of pollution requirements.
Ask yourself who has unlimited budgets to fund sympathetic science and the armies of lobbyists and think tanks.
It takes profits of billions and billions...a quarter.
Oil and the Right .
Follow the money.
Ask yourself what industries have the most to gain by lessing of pollution requirements.
Ask yourself who has unlimited budgets to fund sympathetic science and the armies of lobbyists and think tanks.
It takes profits of billions and billions...a quarter.
Oil and the Right .
Follow the money.