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Part of the charm of Porsche is feeling like you got a deal paying $16K for X51 powerkit 25 extra horsepower that you won't really feel. No one needs to pay five figures for a steel rolex with no complications but its the feeling of being able to overpay along with the minutia that really gets some affluent people going.
The posts denigrating the GTS above are a bit disingenuous. Have either of you two ever driven a GTS 6MT Coupe with RWD? If not, your opinions are not shared by those of us who have.
Dozens of journalists who have driven all versions of the 911 apparently disagree with your assessment.
Virtually every review is an endorsement of the car.
You cannot successfully argue the fact that it is the epitome of the 997 Carrera line. Option an S to hell and back and you still lack the Alcantara, RS Spyder forged wheels, Sport Design bumper, GT2 rockers and WB.
If you like the 997.2 Carrera, it's the sole model with a WB, available RWD NA with 408hp (not claimed) and a 6MT.
The X51 comes with it and sings at high RPM. HP does not come cheap on NA Porsches- the Power Kit is their engineers mod- not a claimed aftermarket gimmick. And the power kit might not be completely from the parts bin...
From a review:
"The GTS is not only rare, but also has a unique power kit – also later used in the 997 Speedster and Sport Classic special editions. The GTS’s power increase produces the same 408 hp result, but is different from the Carrera S X51 kit. Most of the 3.8’s 23-hp increase in the GTS is from a bespoke variable-resonance intake manifold. It utilizes six vacuum-controlled flaps that alter the air’s path to the cylinders at different rpm, optimizing torque and power. Ported and polished cylinder heads, a sport exhaust, and a remapped ECU round out the changes."
And another that might convince one that the GTS is more than the sum of it's parts:
From R&T interview:
At the beginning of April, August Achleitner retired after 36 years at Porsche. He worked first at the chassis department, in the 1980s, then on packaging for the first-generation Boxster and 996-generation 911 in the 1990s. He helped bring the Carrera GT to life. But his most important role at Porsche was as chief engineer for the 911, the car that defines the company.
“These and other engineering choices—including the suspension and driveline calibration of the fantastic 997-generation Carrera GTS, one of the most balanced and satisfying 911s in modern history—were early highlights of Achleitner’s watch.”
I'm loving mine.
Lots more want a RWD LSD 6MT GTS Coupe than are available.
If you have $105K, the PCA car above is- but odds are not for long. Or don't be snookered by the "hype"...go drive whatever you find more economical and/or sensible.
YMMV
Fun motoring in 2024 for all.
Last edited by Liste-Renn; 01-04-2024 at 02:08 AM.
No one is denigrating the GTS - there's no question it's an excellent car. I can even agree that it's probably the epitome of the Carrera line before you step into the Turbo/GT realm.
I've spent time in one, and I've owned (4) 997.2s in varying forms and some 50k miles covered.
Originally Posted by GTSence
One recurring theme I've noticed in reviews is positioning the GTS as a parts bin special.
It constituted instead a carefully considered plunder of the some of the best bits of various other 911s and, indeed, the parts bin.
I'm just trying to reassert that folks are getting bent out of shape because of the very reasonable and documented assertion that the GTS was an assembly of parts that were (mostly) available on lower models.
You could option alcantara and sport design bumper as well as X51 on a Carrera S. You couldn't get all that in a WB with RWD with center lock - but that's where the unique pairing of options end.
Re: The TC leather...there's actually $7115 of it on the Monroney.
IMO it's not unlikable- but it certainly makes a statement (especially with the top down).
Whether it compliments a Grey car is in the eye of the beholder.
At least it's not Can Can Red. (No offense to fans/owners of that shade!)
A (claimed) one-owner, clean CarFax & title, 14K-mile 6MT with an MSRP of $130K and a squeaky clean DME would easily fetch $100K on BaT = $105K, all in, from the buyer. It did fetch $109K, all in, on PCAR- as @PrairieDog pointed out above.
I do appreciate that the forged body-colored HRE wheels fixed the crappy OEM Spyder offsets:
Lowered with Techart springs and a Sharky X-pipe...nice!
And the paint meter readings look legit.
I'd wager RF or GP Motors would this one list for all of $115K, probably more.
Thanks for all the comments guys - I just picked it up on Sunday and have to say, it's a remarkable example. I like many of you have not been a "terracotta" kind of guy. I've owned 14 911's including almost every variant except the 991/992. Recently sold my 718 Spyder which was an awesome machine, but not a 911. I've been a huge fan of the GTS and especially the 997 GTS. Wide rear, 2wd, manual and I've always enjoyed having a drop top 911. My previous 997 was Atlas/Natural which IMO is a beautiful combo. The Terra on this car isn't that far off from that and in person it's quite attractive. I'm installing a painted center console in piano black to create some visual diversification (I had an Atlas painted console in my former 997). It has all the mods I would normally do (and have done previously on my .1 and .2). Adam and his brother Mike at Brooklyn Motors were top notch and I have dealt with so many dealers and a**holes over the years that me saying that says a lot. Will be doing PPF, ceramic coating, Carplay mod (thinking Mr12volt, but pls chime in with your experiences and suggestions), V1 remote setup, grill guards, and formerly stated painted console. Also just ordered the clutch lock ignition switch as she's a bit temperamental already with that issue. BTW - I do have the OEM wheels which are painted Meteor and in as new condition. The HRE's look great with the proper offsets and complement the car nicely.
Thanks for all the comments guys - I just picked it up on Sunday and have to say, it's a remarkable example. I like many of you have not been a "terracotta" kind of guy. I've owned 14 911's including almost every variant except the 991/992. Recently sold my 718 Spyder which was an awesome machine, but not a 911. I've been a huge fan of the GTS and especially the 997 GTS. Wide rear, 2wd, manual and I've always enjoyed having a drop top 911. My previous 997 was Atlas/Natural which IMO is a beautiful combo. The Terra on this car isn't that far off from that and in person it's quite attractive. I'm installing a painted center console in piano black to create some visual diversification (I had an Atlas painted console in my former 997). It has all the mods I would normally do (and have done previously on my .1 and .2). Adam and his brother Mike at Brooklyn Motors were top notch and I have dealt with so many dealers and a**holes over the years that me saying that says a lot. Will be doing PPF, ceramic coating, Carplay mod (thinking Mr12volt, but pls chime in with your experiences and suggestions), V1 remote setup, grill guards, and formerly stated painted console. Also just ordered the clutch lock ignition switch as she's a bit temperamental already with that issue. BTW - I do have the OEM wheels which are painted Meteor and in as new condition. The HRE's look great with the proper offsets and complement the car nicely.
Congrats, now skip all that stuff and order a Sharkwerks center bypass and a DSC sport module and your finished.
Congrats, now skip all that stuff and order a Sharkwerks center bypass and a DSC sport module and your finished.
Thanks - already has the Sharky bypass! Tell me more about the DSC module as I've never used the suspension adjustment in the 997. Has techart/eibach springs installed as well which I've had on previous cars. Will the DSC module make a big difference if not using the "sport" suspension setting? Looks like I also have SmartTop which is a nice bonus (thanks for posting the former sale listing where it's mentioned).
Also quick question - I believe someone here has a listing of how rare these cars are, and especially so in certain combinations. Would imagine Meteor/Terra is very rare, and especially so in a 2wd, manual, cabrio spec. Any insights you can share or access where I can do the research myself? Thanks again.
But it's Porsche marketing at it's finest - push the specification as close to the next model (Turbo or GT3) without giving the actually special (eg. Mezger/Turbo) motors. Want an actually different experience? Pony up the cash.
Rather, bolt on some engine parts to claim more HP which most people will never feel day to day, or make it notably different than a base/S 997.2.
Not that it makes the GTS a bad car - but all individual parts of a GTS could be optioned out on a lower spec base/S. The GTS is just a summation of checkboxes.
No base/S/GTS 997.2 could be optioned to have a Turbo/GT3 engine, however. And that's the difference.
Every Porsche is built from a "parts bin".
And every model is marketed to a specific demographic.
And every model in the line is "summation of check boxes".
Trying hard to find the point you are trying to make...
I think the GTS hits a sweet spot by design- if it appeals to you, odds are the 997 turbo/GT3 engine are not what you are looking for.
I can only speak to myself that for all the quotes you lift to make your case, they are incomplete when the praise for the end result is not included.
We do agree it's the epitome of the Carrera line. Bravo to that. Valuations endorse that notion.
The S is next and the base is in third.
All are great 911s.
Great find. Thanks for posting. Agree with everything the author is saying which is why I just extended my Fidelity warranty another 4 years. Just for the PDK which I think is the only weak link on the GTS if you get that transmission. My two PDK failures are well documented at $20K each but I really enjoy the PDK technology and performance so I'm staying with it.
Always was a manual guy but things evolve. Sometimes for the worse but mostly for the better imo.and the PDK is a good example of how technology bring things to new and unknown territory as I see it.
It's because the 992 is essentially a better 991 so there's no value in hanging onto a 991. The 997 is different from either of them and why 997.2 values are higher than 991.1 values already, and won't be long before they're higher than 991.2 values too.
Agree. I did a review on a 992 Turbo S last month, and addressed the 992 vs 991 issue as well. For me, the 997.2 GTS coupe is my perfect 911 and my "forever car". But the 992 is clearly superior to the 991, in every way. Whereas I never warmed up to the 991, as I cleary spell out in my 997 vs 991 comparison video, the 992, especially in the Turbo and Turbo S form, is a brilliant car and I really, really like it.
01-02-2024, 06:56 PM
