Greg Fishman

[quote]Originally posted by Shank996TT:
<strong>

Greg, You have a lot of nerve with that statement. WHEN...WHEN DID I EVER "BRAG ABOUT MY CARS?"


As far as your challenge or invitation (only you know) to take on the road course.....Grow up nerd. Road racing street cars is not my life, nor does it complete me as an individual. It's a fun event, and it's such a shame people like you attempt to take the fun out of it.</strong><hr></blockquote>


Maybe I confused you with Zach and his posts. if so I am sorry. You may be a great guy but you sure come off as a first class a$#hole.

Grow up nerd... that is funny, how long did it take you to come up with that. You tell Konstantin that he is clueless, even though he probably has spent more time at a race track than you have been alive. I just called you out since you are apparently so in tune with what happens on the race circuits and series. If you know so much come out and run (invitation since it won't be a challenge). And how can I take the fun out of something you don't do??

You need to just go back to CFG's board.

Konstantin

My gott. is it a war here or what? I was so buss to help a friend to install a GT2 engine in his Race RSR that I missed the war on the board ( maybe it is better that I couldn't read all this stuff)

I will not comment any postings here exceppt the one that speaks about cars.

since Rennlist is a sponsor at le Mans this year maybe some of you forgot (or didn't knew) that I had also ofered my sponsoring to rennlist for free at one of our six GT3 Cup car last year at Indy.(actuall at other 5 races in Europe)
The Driver is Stefan Orteli Le Mans winner etc. The one of you that are involved with racing, probably heard the name a few times.

you can check this site for some pics of the last years Indy GP

<a href="http://members.rennlist.com/kkos951/" target="_blank">http://members.rennlist.com/kkos951/</a>

I may be there this year too. You are welcome to visit us and hope we get the championship this year. We are still first at the championship but you never know;-)

Konstantin

Konstantin

[quote]Originally posted by TB993tt:
<strong>
I have just made a post about the Gemballa GTR 750 EVo which claims 850hp (based on a 996tt) it posts a 200 to 300kph time of 12.3s. weighing 1550kg
</strong><hr></blockquote>
@ TB993tt
the Gtr 750 do not has 850 HP. actually it has less than 750 HP the same for the Roock car that has 50 HP than the "name" says.
well even with less than REAL 700 HP you can see that it is realy fast and the numbers are true. I would like to see teh number on the 750 HO Supras etc. Thats why I always say: come with facts and show how fast is your car. Not HP but the TIME is what counts!

anyway I know the guy who worked (and he is a meber ) of the company that made teh Gemballa engine.
As you sure know it is TTP former Lotec. these engine can be also found in some other cars under other names but till now only Gemballa got the high boost engine that exceed the 600 HP
The car will last on teh Autobahn and at the Ring will last too BUT not amny laps. It was enough for a record but nobody thinks that it can last 24 H. it is a street car and not a race car. A car with over 750 Nm Torque will break the strongest trany from a GT Le Mans race car at the ring and this already hapened 2 years ago.
i do not know what kind of Tranies the japanese cars with 1200 HP have but I tell you for sure that you can not drive more than 500 km with the stock or even an upgraded trany from a Supra or even a Porsche at the RING.
Yes the 750 GTR is very fast as you see on the accelaration time but with 1550 kg is not a light weight. From 0-200 km/h you will not notice a differenc eagainst your 520 RS Tuning HP but from 200 to 300 km/h you will notice the difference.
A reliable 996 TT will have about 630 Hp and this will last for many hours at the ring or many years on the street.

I don't know how fast cjv car will be but I expect (from what I heard) with the shorter gear ratio to be as fast as the GTR 750 till it gets to (stock) redline in 6th

Konstantin

Water944t

[quote]Originally posted by Zach Pruett:
<strong>
Gess, quit your whining. Do you need a hug or what? Your jealousy of Ryan is very childish. Yes, it is his fault for being sucessfull and I am sure he is very sorry that you are not.
</strong><hr></blockquote>

The day I measure myself with my checkbook, I hang it all up. I still measure myself by the man I am. The friends that I keep.

It surprises me not that you are oblivious to the fact that you are the lackey I referred to earlier. As far as I am concerned, you owe Kin. an apology as well.

I have my own successful business, 2 incredible kids, a wife who is stll hot after said kids, and every possible thing I could ever need already. Everything else is just material crap, it comes, it goes. I could easily make more money, if I wanted to work more than 25 hours a week. I prefer to be a dad to my kids and tinker with my toys.

If anyone has their priorities skewed, it isnt me.

<img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />

Shank996TT

[quote]Originally posted by Water944t:
<strong>

The day I measure myself with my checkbook, I hang it all up. I still measure myself by the man I am. The friends that I keep.

It surprises me not that you are oblivious to the fact that you are the lackey I referred to earlier. As far as I am concerned, you owe Kin. an apology as well.

I have my own successful business, 2 incredible kids, a wife who is stll hot after said kids, and every possible thing I could ever need already. Everything else is just material crap, it comes, it goes. I could easily make more money, if I wanted to work more than 25 hours a week. I prefer to be a dad to my kids and tinker with my toys.

If anyone has their priorities skewed, it isnt me.

<img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" /> </strong><hr></blockquote>

Oh give it up already. Talk about bragging. Who cares about your "Successful business" And as far as priorities...dont assume that one has to settle for one or the other. You're a quitter if you do. Live it up and have a happy family and all the toys to play with. Having nice toys doesn't mean you don't have priorities in the right place. Don't assume that of others.

Zach is referring to your silly statements made in your posts. Since you brought your kids into the conversation...I surely hope they grow up to be a little more classy than their foul mouthed father. (referring to your foul language used in your posts.)

So hang it up, shut up , and either talk about Porsches or go jump start your VW 924 or as you call it "First Love."

Luke

[quote]Originally posted by Shank996TT:
<strong>

go jump start your VW 924 or as you call it "First Love."</strong><hr></blockquote>

It's funny how most 924 owners have more maturity than you, and the majority of them are still in high school

Zach Pruett

[quote]Originally posted by Water944t:
<strong>
It surprises me not that you are oblivious to the fact that you are the lackey I referred to earlier. As far as I am concerned, you owe Kin. an apology as well. </strong><hr></blockquote>

I do not owe you jack. You were a dumbass and I called you on it, you are just mad because I did.

Water944t

<img src="graemlins/roflmao.gif" border="0" alt="[hiha]" /> <img src="graemlins/roflmao.gif" border="0" alt="[hiha]" /> <img src="graemlins/roflmao.gif" border="0" alt="[hiha]" />

Ok, I guess you got me Cletus. Do you ever feel like a knife-fighter in a room full of steely-eyed gunmen?

I am still very interested in seeing some photos of that amazing collection of cars. Oh, and the Supra too.

I do apologize if my calling you a mouthbreather hurt your feelings, Shank. I honestly wasnt sure you would get the reference. I was a little torqed at your juvenile responses to a guy whose opinion deserves at the least, a bit of respect. But if thats your thing, no problem, hope it serves you well. I wish I had handled my annoyance as well as Konstantin.

<img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />

Christer

I am off back to the 964 board for a couple of days of sanity and adult company.

This thread was amusing but nobody knows what the hell we are even talking about anymore. I can quite easily submit that Zac's 853589hp Supra and Shank's 90000hp Supra will beat my car in a straight line, top speed and any other performance test - hell, most of the cars on this board will do that!

To their defence though, I think it is hard for those 2 to appreciate how hard a track like the 'Ring works a car - especially when you are talking to a couple of guys who are 'big-horsepower drag racers and screw anyone else as they know nothing' types. I have seen TVR Griffiths (5 litre V8, 340hp 340lb/ft and 1020kgs) come off the 'Ring after ONE lap with their brakes frying - literally. But as they admit, they know or care nothing for racing so why don't we just leave the personal insults to these sucessful, charitable 'men'?

TB993tt

My understanding about limitations on real (turbo)horsepower is that once a certain engine configuration is applied which has the potential to produce between 500 and 650 hp (The varying items would be the turbos) it is the heat generated and the ability of the intercoolers to keep the charge air temperature down that determines the reliable hp.
I have no doubt that the Supras mentioned on this thread have the hp quoted, but this hp will only be availble for a limited time during street/drag strip driving or on the chassis dyno with individual runs. As Konstantin was pointing out, when you hold maximum power in top gear for a number of minutes, the high boost nature of these engines will cause massive heat which may blow the engine but at the very least will severely reduce the hp produced during that high speed run. This is one reason why the high boost Jap cars cannot reach the highest top speeds, 'cos they get massive heat soak and go from having 800hp to 400hp. On my 993tt I run a TTP/Cargraphic/FVD intercooler which is bigger but no more efficient than stock. My power was determined on a static dyno at DIN conditions and limited to a maximum intake temperature reached when at maximum revs for an extended period in top gear. If I was to use a GT2 EVO intercooler and revert to pressure sensing induction then my "set up" could yield an easy 570hp - all down to cooling. The HKS intercoolers which a lot of the Jap fraternity use really cannot be compared to the Porsche GT2 EVO unit (for a start it costs $15000) and would not provide the efficiency needed. Konstantin really is correct about proof of "proper" hp being represented by sustained performance figures such as a number of laps of the ring or a sustained maximum speed run. This may be frustrating for you Supra guys who are enjoying your 800hp every day and like to talk about these big numbers, but you're not comparing like with like.

fc-racer

I've watched and read a lot of immaturity in this post and quite frankly, I'm saddened to see it. But, this kind of thing happens from time to time, especially with so many different personalities and priorities on this board.

My reason for writing though isn't to get my two cents in, but to give actual information from a person who has actually raced these types of cars, in fact almost all of the cars that are mentioned in this thread.

I'll start with the Supra. There is no engine that is as easy to upgrade and make fast as this one. I have had the chance to be a part of a 694rwhp build up and the driving characteristics of it. No matter how you cut it, that engine will not survive around a road track at that power level. The brakes will also not survive at that power level. To be honest, to reach that power level, it took a lot of boost and race gas. The car also has horrendous turbo lag, not the kind that you can easily overcome, this is a Mulsanne straight kind of engine, not a Nurburgring kind of engine.

On the track, the Supra is very capable and I bet I can lap around any track at about the same speed as a 996 in a bone stock Supra. Modify the Supra to BPU or BPU+ and I can probably take most 996's around a track and probably match the GT3. Now, the problem comes in long range ability. The Supra's brakes would go before the Porsches and the underhood temps get awfully hot in the Supra on a track day, which ends up heating up the intake charge and the engine responds by pulling back timing. Even autocrossing my teammate's 400hp Supra gets the underhood temps into the oven range!

What about the 911's? Well, they are quirky and in all honesty, their engineering design is quite flawed. The fact that drivers have won in these cars is a testament to the 911 engine, reliability, durability and powerful, long-lasting brakes. I've had the fortune to race a 993 Turbo R. It was and still is the best car I've ever driven. It has virtually no lag, perfectly balanced chassis and endless power. The RUF Turbo R is the ultimate car, it has great reliability, great performance, great driveability and it doesn't have the quirky handling of the 911.

The 944 Turbo S is another interesting car and one of my favourites. It has 300hp with chips, can run with 996's and 993's and it has pretty decent reliablity. It's not as robust as the 911, but it holds its own if maintained properly.

Now, I will give an exmaple of my own personal racecar and what the difference is between a road race car, like the Porsche guys are talking about here vs. a drag race car, like the Supra guys are talking about here.

I have a 1991 Eagle Talon AWD that outaccelerates my Ducati 748 sportbike. It has 400hp out of a 2.0L 4 cylinder motor. I ran the 1/4 mile in 12.0 @ 119mph on snow tires. You can watch the video on the <a href="http://www.vcmc.ca" target="_blank">www.vcmc.ca</a> website. That power level is reached using a TD05-20G turbocharger, kind of old school, but it works. To get that power level, the car requires 25psi (~1.7bar) of boost and 112 octane race fuel.

When I ran Knox Mountain Hillclimb where the car will see sustained long pulls up the steep hills, I had to turn the boost down to 20psi (~1.4bar) to ensure reliablity. The cars like CJV's and the RUF Turbo R and the Roock RST540, they don't have to do that. They can take their 500+hp cars and run the **** out of them all day long on the track, street, hillclimb, dragrace, you name it. Best of all, they can do that on pump gas. Let's be realistic here, can I get detonation free power at 25psi on my engine on 91 octane pump gas? Can you get 600hp on pump gas on the Supra?

I've known Reg Reimer, the guy that ran One Lap for a long, long time. Up here in Canada, we have been tinkering with turbos since 1991 on Japanese cars and we used to share notes about any new development. When I first started working on my Talon, they were running 12.7's in the 1/4 mile, now they're running 8's!!! I've seen a thing or two in those years and I've seen a lot of dyno queens.

In all my years, I've never seen anything above 500hp on the track except for a modified Ferrari F40 and various Porsches survive the true test of surviving until the end of the race or lapping session.

All of the cars mentioned in this thread are great cars, there are a lot of people in this world that dream of owning your cars, think back to when it was your dream car. Maybe then it won't matter what anyone in this thread says.

fc-racer

Shank996TT

[quote]Originally posted by fc-racer:
<strong>There is no engine that is as easy to upgrade and make fast as this one. I have had the chance to be a part of a 694rwhp build up and the driving characteristics of it The car also has horrendous turbo lag, not the kind that you can easily overcome, this is a Mulsanne straight kind of engine, not a Nurburgring kind of engine.

fc-racer</strong><hr></blockquote>


FC Racer, great points, however. Couple of things though. You were talking about lag. Yes, Monster Turbo (Whether its HKS2835 or T66 Ball Bearings) you will have more lag, and lose low end torque. However, those who chose to road race the supra has the convenience of devices such as the EVC EZ not seen in any 996TT (yet) where they can run lower boost on pump gas. This in concert with the twin ball bearing turbo by Innovative for example will have near instant torque..much like the 996TT. Also, you stated the brakes wont last, but you're assuming a modded supra would have what...Stock brakes? What if they converted to 6piston 14" Brembos. Having said that, my point is you can TUNE the supra for road racing. You are comparing a Monster supra at full boost and max HP which is great for the dragstrip, not for the course. There are supras out there only TUNED for road courses.

When we compare the two cars, you also have to take the most important factor into consideration...Cost, because cost is reality! If you set a budget of 120k, I guarantee you, you can build a supra that will destroy a 996TT (since you'll have 5k left for mods for the 996TT.) However if you set a budget of 300k, then perhaps the tables will be turned.

Hey, the subject of this topic was 996TT vs. SupraTT - not necessarily on the road course. What about the streets and highway, where many of us take driving spririted (be honest). Some of you die hard road racers will say "Lets see you in the road course, and we'll see who's better." That is another scenario, however, on the streets and highways, with the exception of those heavily budgeted 996TTs ( I know of only 1) .....The Supras prevail....Dollar for dollar.

But then ask me a question...which would I rather have if given a choice?.....The Porsche! <img src="graemlins/bigok.gif" border="0" alt="[thumbsup]" />

Since this post has so much text, I'd thought I'd add some colorful images...

Zach Pruett

[quote]Originally posted by Water944t:
<strong>I am still very interested in seeing some photos of that amazing collection of cars. Oh, and the Supra too. </strong><hr></blockquote>








Happy now?

Zach Pruett

Greg Fishman

I really like the blue RS replica, did you build to the same specs as the RS, engine , tranny, etc. What is the weight?

Greg