docmirror

One of the three of us should grab up the old motor and see what we can do with it. I don't have a chassis to mess with but I wouldn't mind putting the bearing in and do the cleaning. It would be a low cost fix for someone else.

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On another separate note;
BTW, I don't know that anyone has ADVOCATED this approach. If a company gets caught up in a lawsuit after the exceptional pre-qual process, maybe there's a reason.

Andy Ericksen

I didn't want to turn this into Yet Another IMSB Thread, but I am interested to see if/how folks respond to those statements.

I have not decided what IMSB replacement I'm going to use, I was thinking about starting a new thread for that conversation when the time is right.

cds72911

There really isn't any discussion. What's your budget? The LN Retrofit is the right product to use if your budget is tighter, and the LN Solution is the ultimate.

User 63031

The discussion he's alluding to is my statement: LN Retrofit bearings are basically glass bearings that only work in pristine engines with 0 debris in the sump oil ever. Because they are open bearings, they are by definition incompatible with an IMSB-failed engine, period. They cannot withstand any amount of hard contaminants, which is why they may only be installed after extensive pre-qual. (And yes, having any random other part in your engine fail and spewing out metallic debris into the sump oil, will probably take LNE bearings right along with it.)

You can never use LNE bearings as a 'fix'. Only preventative. Rebuilding the engine + installing LNE is not a fix, that's building a new engine and installing LNE as a preventative maintenance bearing in that one.

You need a sealed bearing, and a maintenance interval of <40.000km. The sealed quality bearing itself will cost about 70 bucks and can be bought at a decent hardware store. Don't get fooled by expensive specialized IMSB 'kits' from aftermarket resellers either (*cough* FVD *cough*), those are the same 70$ bearing with 530$ of Porsche-tax slapped on top of it.

Oh if you're going the salvaged motor route, I'd happily buy that old motor off of you as well. Would love to have another pet project, and do some more cleaning + fixing

Prelude Guy

I have spare chassis and engines. I would love to find an engine in the shape his is in just to mess with. Failed IMSB, scored cylinders, etc. As long as it's still running.

All of my blown engines no longer run.

Andy Ericksen

The original engine is not for sale. I'm planning to rebuild it myself as a long term project.

cds72911

Yes, and I think you are off your rocker.

pdxmotorhead

Random thoughts.. I cant even list all the engines transmissions and other heavy equipment
I've run in to where a sealed bearing was the source of "the big one" ...

The majority of all motorcycle engines used open roller or ball bearings for the crank,
12K rpms don't lie.

Almost all transmissions use open ball or roller bearings. Or needle bearings.

Where sealed bearings go to heck is when they have pressure against the seal,
especially with a light an d heavy lube on opposite sides..

Hartech has been removing the seals for years with good results..

User 63031

Great argumentation, buddy. Such a shame that for some lodging insults is their default last resort. Real mature.

Go ask the inventor of these bearings. He won't even deny that those bearings break down when met with debris-laden oil.

cds72911

I do not argue with fools. Every single post you have put on Rennlist (that I've read) is argumentative and contrarian. Why not try adding some value instead of trying to prove to everyone how you are smarter that people who do this for a living. You may well be the first person on whom I test the Rennlist ignore feature.

Prelude Guy

Good info, but one question. Do the engines with these open bearings have inherent design flaws where they eat themselves internally?

Personally, I've never seen an engine with so much debris floating around, and I think that's the major reason for the argument of having a sealed bearing........in the M96!

An open bearing might be the better option.....for uses in applications where hard debris isn't floating in the oil.

User 63031

Go ask LN Engineering. Ask them if their bearings would withstand oil with floating hard debris / metallic grit in it. Or don't, if you're scared of the possibility that I speak the truth. It has nothing to do with being smart, that must just be your own insecurity talking or something, dunno where you got that from. Your insults are immature.

Andy Ericksen

So I pulled the back bumper off The Cheapest Porsche On Craigslist and found this:

AnthonyGS

Certain people here crack me up. In this specific case they say toss a new bearing in it nothing made it past the filter bypass. That filter bypass thing is a hoax....

Then right after that they say you must use a sealed bearing because all of the debris that floats through all M96 engines. And thats also why the companies selling unsealed bearings are awful.... another hoax.

Then they mock other people’s skills in argumentation.... that’s irony for certain.

I’d love to see this engine and car saved too, but spouting off at the mouth (fingers) and calling successful people and their products hoaxes ain’t gonna do it.

We really should make an IMS troll forum and the trolls can moderate it. My M96s are both weeping a bit, need new water pumps, AoSes most likely and I will probably install the solution in the 996 and service the IMSB on the 986. I’m very likely not to post about it here though or share what I learn.

I don’t want to argue with trolls about it non-stop.

pdxmotorhead

if the hard debris,, hurts the bearing LN provides,, you'd think it would lunch the crank/rod/cam bearings as well..
Since they are the same setup.? and with much stuff in the oil,, Cam lobes would get ground up...
Hartech has had great luck pulling the seal and letting them splash oil..

All engines float metal,, especially engines that turn this RPM at the power level,, I work on a lot of different engines,,
open your average motorcycle engine,,.. the bearings out last every thing else and that's in a engine with the clutch
shedding fiber and metal in the oil its entire life.. heck most dirt bike motors are measured in short hours for expected
life under race conditions,, but the bottom end and transmission last the whole season. Same with Sprint engines,,
they drop metal till the oil turns silver when you dump the tank.. Personally I believe the IMS-b is the result of "quality engineering"
the Metzger engines don't really have this problem none of the air cooled engines do either.. But they all flow oil to all the bearings..

Short of a long term destructive testing program nobody can prove the 100% fail cause,,
I have a hard time believing Porsche never did it.. But if the data was bad, why would they publish.. ??
They obviously changed the design,, so they saw some sort of potential improvement..