AOW162435

The 5-gallon kerosene container in my shop is pretty damn close to Riviera Blue. I just noticed that.


Andreas

tcsracing1

yup.

The forum is open to all forms of discussion even on the pricing of members selling their car..... favourable or not unfortunately.
(typically as we all know members try not to question selling prices of other members, but it is a natural reflex of the hardcore hobbiest following market trends....)

Discussing a controversial color listed in the marketplace outside of Rennlist and how it relates to resale comparisons of other colors is definitely ok as opposed to discussing pricing of an actual members car listed here for sale....

Rivy blue car market is something buyers and sellers want to know about
So it can be very controversial but educational too...

Arena993

I agree. I have Rivi Blue and to a small group in the know the color is desirable and rare, but to the average buyer it's not deserving of a premium price.

Mike

syzygy

I wouldn't worry about it in this case. I just posted this link because it's a colour that has quite a following and the asking price is a bit 'out there', especially for the presented condition of the car.

It was meant as more of an awareness thing and not a plug for the seller. All comments are welcomed. Ed's and others' comments are bang on, in my opinion.

deadhead1960

I agree with you however there clearly is a double standard going on. A few months ago a RL member posted his RB cab with a severely inflated market price on the 993 forum. A few people (myself included) very respectfully suggested that his price was high while at the same time wished him well and hoped that he sold the car. The response was immediate and harsh and in no uncertain terms it was posted many times that you do not comment on member's pricing strategies, or as one post read, "don't crap on his thread." Here are two examples:


My opinion is that if a member posts something for sale in the members only classified section, comments regarding price, etc., should be sent via pm. However if a member or user posts in the forum sections, then they open themselves up to constructive conversation regarding any topic relating to the item they are selling, including price. Membership status or "being a good guy" or whatever should not equate to a free ride, as many have said or implied.

goofballdeluxe

The only time I ever comment on pricing on a post is when it's either ridiculously high as to offend, or priced perfectly to sell.

Delusional clowns need to be grounded, and realists need to be commended.

Ed Hughes

Deadhead, now that you explain your position, I can't fault this logic:

"My opinion is that if a member posts something for sale in the members only classified section, comments regarding price, etc., should be sent via pm. However if a member or user posts in the forum sections, then they open themselves up to constructive conversation regarding any topic relating to the item they are selling, including price. Membership status or "being a good guy" or whatever should not equate to a free ride, as many have said or implied."

But the fact is, this thread does not apply to your etiquette proposal, as it was a third party posting of a non-affiliated car, presumably being sold by a non-member.

Mark in Baltimore

Okay, since you just can’t seem to let this rest, let’s address some other “inconsistencies”. For instance, although you want to have the right to offer commentary and be able to criticize others’ cars, you strangely get upset when other people find fault with the items you’re selling, even when they have a very valid reason to question the veracity of your advertisement (no, I don't call overpricing a car an issue of honesty).

Here is a case in point where it seems that a 993TT tail that you advertised as OEM was very much in doubt as to whether or not it was an aftermarket product, despite the fact that, in this thread (https://rennlist.com/forums/993-turb...rear-wing.html), you had sold it to a Rennlister who later realized that it was not OEM. Although you eventually resolved the issue, it took considerable Rennlist pressure to force you to do the right thing.

The following quote is directed at Al Z's previous post:

The aforementioned five quotes can be found here: https://rennlist.com/forums/for-sale...condition.html

What I find inconsistent is that you flamed Al Z for his very, very legitimate (i.e. not subjective) concerns about the 993TT tail you were selling as OEM, yet you want the ability to comment about subjective issues such as price?? You’re either consistent or you’re not; which way do you want it? If you want consistency, then you should have no problem with Al Z’s valid comments. This is basic logic.

But, wait; there’s more. In this thread (https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...iles-sold.html), erick72pors questions the ride height of the car you’re selling. You get offended that he would offer such commentary.

So, regarding consistency, which way do you want it? Do you want to be able to criticize another Rennlister’s car, as you claim in this current thread is okay to do, or do you not want another Rennlister to offer disparaging commentary on the cars you sell as you claim in the referenced thread? You’re either consistent or you’re not; which way do you want it?

Further, there is that leeeetle issue of you being a car dealer/curbstoner here on the forums. There are other car dealers on this forum, but they have been far more direct in their enterprises than you have been. Based on the number of PM’s and emails I had received, apparently I was not the only one who found it ironic that you were channeling Bernard Malamud and “defending the faith” and trust of Rennlist, despite the fact that you had billed yourself as a “busy enthusiast” who somehow, some way managed to sell six cars in six months, cars that you had claimed were part of your “personal collection”. Most of the smart people here understood that you scooped up good deals and chose to sell them here. Six cars in six months? Wow, you sure did unload a lot of your “collection”. Where’s the faith and trust in not being direct with people about the cars you sell?

https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...e-911-c2s.html

Hmmmm, here are links to your sales:

2/26/2010: https://rennlist.com/forums/for-sale...ercharger.html

3/23/2010: https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...-29-500-a.html

3/26/2010: https://rennlist.com/forums/for-sale...-92-000-a.html

5/18/2010: https://rennlist.com/forums/911-foru...ebay-sold.html

6/10/2010: https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...iles-sold.html

7/13/2010: https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...96-911-c4.html

(https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...t3-also-2.html)

(Rennlisters should take note that it appears that deadhead1960 has chosen to delete all of his original thread posts where he has sold cars in a vain attempt to cover up his tracks.)

Apparently I'm not the only one who looks askance at such behavior:

You are portraying these cars as your personal cars when nothing could be further from the truth. Many new members incorrectly assume that if a car is being sold by a Rennlister, then there is a reassuring credibility level that the owner has checked the car over carefully, has lived with it for a period of time and is being honest since that member has a supposed reputation in the community. Unfortunately, you have shown that you cannot be sincere when asked about the nature of your business, an approach that would force one to wonder what else you are being cagey about. Many of your answers are quite slippery and not at all forthright (https://rennlist.com/forums/8291471-post14.html, taken from a current thread where a buyer is questioning your credibility (https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...dhead1960.html).

As others have written, if your business is selling cars, whether it’s a hobby enterprise or not, car dealers and flippers have special techniques and tools at their disposal to temporarily or permanently make the car look better. Full disclosure would have been the right thing to do to help the consumer decide if he or she needs to investigate further.

Need more?

In this thread (https://rennlist.com/forums/993-foru...r-matters.html), goofballdeluxe had started a thread on Rennlist membership. Ironic that you would side with "doing the right thing and becoming a member" when you can't even be honest with the board about your status as a car dealer or the products you are trying to sell.


So, for the sake of consistency, how would you prefer it? Would you, as you state here, want the ability to criticize another Rennlister’s car or, as you state in other threads, would you prefer that no one criticize the cars and parts that you sell? Please enlighten the board as to what you think is the right thing to do.

goofballdeluxe

Mark, and you've said I have a way with words? That right there ^^^ would have William Shakespeare AND Perry Mason cleaning your shoes

Cactus

Snaps!!!!

tcsracing1

some CSI stuff there!!

Mark in Baltimore

Thanks, gbd. I've read too many threads here and have bitten my tongue for far too long, electing to say nothing.

I calls it like I sees it; the problem is that I sees it.

deadhead1960

Ed, I hear ya. I was simply trying to point out the way different posts are treated, first person vs. third party.

dave morris

Mark,

Thanks for the heads up. I've recently returned to this forum. Good stuff to know.

TRINITONY

kudos Mark,, btw where have all the old peeps gone, quite a few have vanished....