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I went to visit a C4S
I saw this and gave up
Now I'm not sure that was a good decision, it's fixable. on the other hand, it denotes a lack of care on the part of the owner.
the price was around 90,000€ for 120,000km
On one side "rewelded" but not correctly, on the other side it is broken.
That is not a giant deal. Depending on what the rest of the car looks like, that is a common repair item and not a showstopper. Clearly done incorrectly but I wouldn't pass on an otherwise nice car solely because of that.
I went to visit a C4S
I saw this and gave up
Now I'm not sure that was a good decision, it's fixable. on the other hand, it denotes a lack of care on the part of the owner.
the price was around 90,000€ for 120,000km
On one side "rewelded" but not correctly, on the other side it is broken.
That seems like a good decision to me for sure. If only this is visible, the question is how many more surprises are lurking underneath. For this kind of budget many decent and well maintained cars can be found as well.
I went to visit a C4S
I saw this and gave up
Now I'm not sure that was a good decision, it's fixable. on the other hand, it denotes a lack of care on the part of the owner.
the price was around 90,000€ for 120,000km
On one side "rewelded" but not correctly, on the other side it is broken.
I don't agree that it shows lack of care by the owner - it shows there are many garages/specialists who will claim they know how to fix such an issue, but just want your money.
Some (especially now elderly) 993 owners do not have depth of technical knowledge - they will trust a garage to fix things for them.
You'd really need to balance this single (and tiny) issue with the condition of the rest of the car.
If you think you are going to find a 993, for sale, that has no issues, then it's the wrong age of car for you.
I went to visit a C4S
I saw this and gave up
Now I'm not sure that was a good decision, it's fixable. on the other hand, it denotes a lack of care on the part of the owner.
the price was around 90,000€ for 120,000km
On one side "rewelded" but not correctly, on the other side it is broken.
Is this car in Belgium, 123,466 km, first registration 09/1996 for EURO 89.850 ?
As far as I know, this is NOT a small thing to fix, if done the right way it will cost more than EURO 1.000.
The fender has to come off. There will also be a future rust issue, most likely sooner or later.
The tin layer needs to be renewed, the picture does show a very poor quick and easy fix.
Keep in mind, a car that was not maintained properly, as seen with the door, might have more and hidden issues along the way.
Most 993 4s with around 120.000 KM will cost between EURO 105 K and EURO 120 K.
As you see in this advert, you have to expect some more usage marks on the seats, on this car not only the driver seat, also the rear seats, which normally look like new as never used. https://www.autoscout24.com/offers/p...search-results
Let me give you a good advise (coming from an experienced dealer), don't just look around in your area, that might be convenient, but it's definitely not the best way to find a classic Porsche 911 / 993.
I'ld be only really careful with Italy, careful search is always advised.
Bestt regards
Dave (from Hamburg)
Last edited by My993_4s_Dave; 01-16-2023 at 04:40 AM.
Why bother yourself any longer with cars in such condition? This '97 4S with 137.000 km's (85,000 miles) on the clock is located in The Netherlands (just around the corner):
OP - something that may be important to you - in Europe, unless you really want a fat behind, I would always look for a NB car with the earlier type 21 gearbox, up to and incl MY96 build. Look at the build sticker to be certain if an MY96 car.
Originally Posted by Peter65
Why bother yourself any longer with cars in such condition? This '97 4S with 137.000 km's (85,000 miles) on the clock is located in The Netherlands (just around the corner):
Certainly you should go and see that car OP, but the photographs are terrible! All arty and taken in full sun, you cannot see anything.
Only one useful photograph for me - engine is running, up to temperature, and yet oil level is not showing. As oil pressure is still above 3 at idle, probably thermostat not quite opened, but worth checking when you visit.
OP - something that may be important to you - in Europe, unless you really want a fat behind, I would always look for a NB car with the earlier type 21 gearbox, up to and incl MY96 build. Look at the build sticker to be certain if an MY96 car.
Certainly you should go and see that car OP, but the photographs are terrible! All arty and taken in full sun, you cannot see anything.
Only one useful photograph for me - engine is running, up to temperature, and yet oil level is not showing. As oil pressure is still above 3 at idle, probably thermostat not quite opened, but worth checking when you visit.
Agree on the pics, they're terrible. My only intention however, was to give an insight that there are more interesting cars on the market to go see and inspect for that kind of budget. But interestingly the OP started this thread with a crappy C2 and meanwhile looks to be interested in a C4S...???
Probably the OP is looking at all local cars on the market - as you say, sensible to visit as many cars as possible (photographs are usually misleading) and then you can compare real cars to try and judge 'value' differences between them.
But as I said - with cars this old, ones for sale are likely to have issues - only the OP can balance what is available on sale today with his/her list of requirements for such a car.... by this I mean gearbox, wheels-driven, NB/WB, paint color, interior color... and then how much work required to get into acceptable condition.
I went to visit a C4S
I saw this and gave up
Now I'm not sure that was a good decision, it's fixable. on the other hand, it denotes a lack of care on the part of the owner.
the price was around 90,000€ for 120,000km
On one side "rewelded" but not correctly, on the other side it is broken.
Keep looking is my advice.
Had this repair done the “right way” probably 6 years now and was $2,000 USD and was my buddy’s shop who performed the work. Half *** repair was done on mine at some point and was clicking and ready to pull from the tack welds from behind like most. A Pillar alone was $880 (center section with the check strap was plasma cut out) at the time plus all the other parts so easily $1,000 in parts. It was a labor intensive job and his welder had 20 plus years experience. I would imagine mirroring my fix would be well over $2,500 Euro now IF you can find a competent shop to perform the work. Some shops won’t even want to do the repair.
OP- The Check strap IS a popular item to need repair, but it's not a deal breaker. If you're gonna own the car for a while, and maybe repaint at some point, get it done then. you CAN drive the car with a broken check strap! How about a link to the listing or more pics of the car? Also, you may want to share your "wish-list" items and budget as this group can obviously point you to cars that are available out there.
Hello,
Thanks all for your reply, advices and informations, very valuable ! :-)
The car was looking nice but had other points not "perfect", paint, seats etc.
I didn't pot the link to the car to not make "shade" to someone.
I do agree that it can be repaired, but at that price I thought that it should not be like this.
The car is now sold.
To be continued :-)
Is this car in Belgium, 123,466 km, first registration 09/1996 for EURO 89.850 ?
This car also seems like the second cheapest around, at least on: https://www.autoscout24.com/lst/pors...id=1a2bosbrrrx
Most 993 4s with around 120.000 KM will cost between EURO 105 K and EURO 120 K.
As you see in this advert, you have to expect some more usage marks on the seats, on this car not only the driver seat, also the rear seats, which normally look like new as never used. https://www.autoscout24.com/offers/p...search-results
Just saw in your profile, you're in Belgium.
Let me give you a good advise (coming from an experienced dealer), don't just look around in your area, that might be convenient, but it's definitely not the best way to find a classic Porsche 911 / 993.
I'ld be only really careful with Italy, careful search is always advised.
Bestt regards
Dave (from Hamburg)
Yes it was that one, gone now.
I saw the nice 993 on your websiite, very nice, but out of my budget :-/
I'm open to buy outside of Belgium, no problem, that said, Prices seems competitive in Belgium in regard of the european market around (except Spain, Italy).
Originally Posted by Peter65
Why bother yourself any longer with cars in such condition? This '97 4S with 137.000 km's (85,000 miles) on the clock is located in The Netherlands (just around the corner):
https://www.elferspot.com/en/car/por...-1997-1185938/
Nice one, in my shortlist. Pics indeed are nice but not very informative.
Originally Posted by orangecurry
OP - something that may be important to you - in Europe, unless you really want a fat behind, I would always look for a NB car with the earlier type 21 gearbox, up to and incl MY96 build. Look at the build sticker to be certain if an MY96 car.
Certainly you should go and see that car OP, but the photographs are terrible! All arty and taken in full sun, you cannot see anything.
Only one useful photograph for me - engine is running, up to temperature, and yet oil level is not showing. As oil pressure is still above 3 at idle, probably thermostat not quite opened, but worth checking when you visit.
So its the G50/21 gearbox, it's not that gearbox in all 993 except 1995 ?
Can you talk a little more about the thing to check in regard to oil pressure ?
Originally Posted by Peter65
Agree on the pics, they're terrible. My only intention however, was to give an insight that there are more interesting cars on the market to go see and inspect for that kind of budget. But interestingly the OP started this thread with a crappy C2 and meanwhile looks to be interested in a C4S...???
At first I looked for C2/C2S indeed, but after a lot of reading, I decided not to restrict only to those, I like fat and narrow buts and the transmission system seems to not interfere that much.
My goal is to find a 993 1996 in good shape, lowest km as possible and in the colors I like, grey/blue/green/bordeau outside, black/white/gray inside maybe dark blue could be ok but not light blue.
I'm tall (196cm) and have two kids (10-12 years old) to fit behind, I've tested 964 with them and the driving position is not good for me, but they have more space. So I want an air cooled, (I've had a 994C4S)
It's an investment and for sunday driving, I will switch to old timer plate in 1996.
Budget is 100.000€ max. I could invest more but I thing it's a good stop.
Originally Posted by orangecurry
Probably the OP is looking at all local cars on the market - as you say, sensible to visit as many cars as possible (photographs are usually misleading) and then you can compare real cars to try and judge 'value' differences between them.
But as I said - with cars this old, ones for sale are likely to have issues - only the OP can balance what is available on sale today with his/her list of requirements for such a car.... by this I mean gearbox, wheels-driven, NB/WB, paint color, interior color... and then how much work required to get into acceptable condition.
I'm good a working on cars and stuffs, so changing seats, driving, wheel, autoradio, detailing etc is easy for me, but finding/taking the car to a specialist to redo both straps correctly for 5000€ (see below), I prefer to dodge.
And I see this strap proble as reckless use of the car, not a good sign. (yes the wind... ok, maybe wind with a foot on the door ;-)
Originally Posted by Gbos1
Keep looking is my advice.
Had this repair done the “right way” probably 6 years now and was $2,000 USD and was my buddy’s shop who performed the work. Half *** repair was done on mine at some point and was clicking and ready to pull from the tack welds from behind like most. A Pillar alone was $880 (center section with the check strap was plasma cut out) at the time plus all the other parts so easily $1,000 in parts. It was a labor intensive job and his welder had 20 plus years experience. I would imagine mirroring my fix would be well over $2,500 Euro now IF you can find a competent shop to perform the work. Some shops won’t even want to do the repair.
01-15-2023, 06:30 PM
