Wilder

Given your particular position, if you're the kind of guy who subscribes to the philosophy that starting anything new with the best equipment is the way to go, get RAS. Conversely, if your'e the kind of guy who sees value in getting the most basic equipment to learn with and want to do the hard work early on with the idea that perhaps that will help you master your new undertaking, skip RAS.

Jarm

This is a great logic path, thanks for the suggestion.
Also nice to see another Macan Turbo PP owner!

bzcat

Looks like slate grey full leather.

tourenwagen

Does anyone know if the $0 Standard Checkered Sport Tex seats are heated?

Standard Interior with Checkered Sport-Tex Seat Centers

$0
Included in Leather:

• Seat bolsters (front)
• Seat headrests with embroidered "911" logo in Black
• Steering wheel rim
• Door grab handles
• Door panel armrests
• Center console storage compartment lid
• Gear lever and gear lever boot (manual transmission only)

Wilder

Good for you! Small camp we're in. I love my PP.

toph4242

I know I'm no professional journalist lol... but I will advocate for one slight alteration to this statement: Instead of calling it a twitchiness, I would describe it as "harder to get the back end to swing out because it has more grip and on-rails feel to it... and when you push it harder and are able to get it to break loose, it tries to keep that rigidity so it feels like a mid engine slide vs rear engine slide". The only reason I point this out is because I think in high speed situations most 911 drivers or people familiar with the car know that they can very easily whip the tail out and slide it... The RAS keeps is more on a line through a corner and slides become slightly more stiff rather than light and easily corrected, if that makes sense. The pro drivers that I sat passenger with at Barber Motorsport track in a 911 with RAS made the car do unimaginably fast lap times and their cornering drifts were very very controlled... but the car did not have that same light and playful tail spin out that most would be used to... It was a very fast/controlled and lap time effective slide that allowed them to get back into the power quicker out of the corner vs. correcting their oversteer out of a corner.
I look forward to providing some real world feedback when I get mine... This, again, is not something that I have a TON of track or road time with so I took a leap of faith based on those limited experiences and am hoping for the best.

tourenwagen

I'm just sharing my real world experience on a forum, and I'm not trying to sway anybody one way or another but that line "feeling like I'm losing the back end" is exactly what it felt like to me.

Scared the crap out of me. I'm not a track guy at all, so maybe it works better there but in the wild on a long sweeping left that I knew very well, and that my non-RAS equipped 991.2T could easily take at speed, I lost all confidence in my current 992.

toph4242

Its so interesting the different experiences with this Tech, because my initial reaction to what was being described as "losing the back end" is that the RAS would very much help with this feeling, because it creates that more mid engine weight distribution feel.. i think 911 owners are very familiar with the tail happy feeling, so @tourenwagen you and I both know how to easily correct the car when it starts to do that and we have confidence in how it will react in a Non RAS car... for someone that isn't familiar with the 911 layout, that correction might not come natural to them, so the RAS will keep them on a line and in "control" possibly better than without it... I don't know if im making sense, but I think if we know how a 911 traditionally reacts, RAS is unfamiliar. For someone looking to tighten up the car and prevent too much oversteer, RAS might be the right choice...

The Answer to all of this is PLEASE go find a dealer with both cars, or sign up for a 1-hour experience center test with each if you live close to LA or atlanta before ordering your car... The expense of doing this far outweighs the expense of ordering a 6-figure car not to your liking!!!

Jarm

Absolutely no judgment or anything was intended by my paraphrasing, I appreciate your candor!

tourenwagen

Agreed. I read your response right after writing mine and its very interesting to see the two points of view. Agree with folks trying to get a test drive if you can...

tourenwagen

For sure. Happy to chat offline too if you think it might help.

norcal992

Sharing an update hoping to help someone like me. Do NOT wait for your stupid SA to send the forms. Email PEC and they will settle everything with you directly. I think the form might have to be sent before the car enters production - I almost missed it

Wilder

Yes and no. You have a very good understanding of RAS dynamics but when people express twitchiness at speed, it was in the context of driving at speed in a straight line and perhaps RAS activating unnecessarily. At least that's how I understood it and this comment came from more than one or two sources. On the plus side, that same dynamic has been expressed as responding very fast to inputs when switching lanes quickly. Again, I'm piecing datapoints.

There is no question that RAS makes the car faster. It's simple physics and I suppose the reason Porsche made it standard in all GT cars. However, if you head over to the 997 GT3 forum, tech like RAS is one of the reasons people sold their 991 and 992 GT cars for 996 and 997 GT cars. Like me, they're not looking to be the fastest at this point but to have the most visceral experience and to have the most fun. My GT3 cost me as much as a new one and I chose it over a 992 because I want a raw and analog experience and to feel like I'm driving the car as opposed to feeling like the car is driving me, if that makes sense. It's the same reason I'm not checking RAS on the T.

Before I bought my GT3, I briefly contemplated a GT4. I passed because I very specifically want that feeling that is exclusive to the 911. All Porsches are great but there is only one 911 and it's slowly going away. Porsche keeps moving the engine toward the middle, they add RAS, they add PDCC and, sure, you end up with a much faster, much more sophisticated car but you also loose a lot of that thing that guys like me who have owned several 911s really value.

Ultimately, there's not right or wrong. There's just preference and priorities. I can totally see why people would want RAS. It's why I added it briefly to my build.

time_sink

They didn't let me do any sliding on my test drive, unfortunately And my use case is mostly canyon carving as opposed to track driving. For me it wasn't so much a case of getting the rear to break loose, but simply feeling like the rear end was secure and predictable. I hustled through the same 70 degree turn (starting from slow speed, accelerating through the turn) in my 10 year old base carrera and in the 992 with RAS. In the 10 year old base carrera, the rear end feels firm and predictable. The 992 RAS car did what I asked, but then snapped back into line, which made for an uncomfortable sensation. Felt the same thing on a Taycan with RAS as well.

I will say that the way the 992 with RAS flowed into curves at speed felt awesome. It has a delicate sort of balance to it, whereas my non RAS car would instead saw through the corners (albeit in a 100% honest and predictable way). I dunno, maybe its just me, but that sawing and correction out the other end is just part of the experience, and the feedback the car gives you enables those corrections very easily. Less correction was necessary on the RAS car, but it also felt a bit more disconnected and toy like as a result. I can definitely see achieving higher speeds with RAS, but there's just that little bit of driver-car connection thats lost in the process, which is why I opted against it. Also, while driving on the freeway, I can confirm the sensation MacBoy/Tourenwagen described where the steering feels almost too sensitive in a straight line, but take that with a grain of salt since I drive a 991.1 with a legendarily numb steering.

Thank you to you and Macboy for consistently making me question my decision. It would have been easy to "just go with it" because of the prior decisions I had already made and I'm glad you guys sparked enough doubt that I traveled the 50 miles to go drive the RAS car. The experience of driving it was night and day and made my mind up instantly.

I highly recommend that anyone on the fence go drive the car with RAS before your lock date. If you're unable to, and have only driven 911s without RAS before, leave it off your build. In other words, don't just tick the box because you're happy to spend the money. It makes a MASSIVE difference to the character of the car and you need to be sure you want it before you spec it. I don't understand the folks who claim that it is a subtle thing. It certainly wasn't for me. Maybe I could learn to love it, but I already love the non RAS car.

Perhaps the tl;dr of all of this is that I'm getting old and insufficiently adventurous...lol. Or maybe its the fact that I live in California, and a nearly 10% tax rate discourages experimentation.

toph4242

Totally agree with your last point about people who call it Subtle... for sure a major difference and people need to see what they like before ordering. Those people DONT drive their cars fast or hard enough haha... Joking of course.