Breen

anyone that argues Mclaren quality is in the same universe as Porsche is not a serious person

3-Pedals

Edited my own post : 750S looks like a fabulous ride and in 99% of the daily driving scenarios it will be a better car than anything Porsche has ever made. This comes from a person who chose a 992 GT3RS over 750S. I am very impressed with Mclaren as they provide a very unique experience. I chose not to get the 750S for different reasons that I dont want to get into here. I'm not surprised CH chose 750S over GT3RS.

bobodrink

Mclaren is the faster car! I have had 4 Mclarens in the past and all of them had only minor issues. The biggest problem with Mclarens are that they are built as a time attack/road car instead of an all out endurance track car like the GT3, you can't run them all day. A stock Mclaren can't run a full session on a hot track day or all day like a GT3, they will overheat the cats, transmission will go to limp mode or full on won't give you boost anymore. I can only do about 3-4 laps per session in all of my Mclarens before pitting, anything beyond those laps the car won't like it. You can reduce the issues by giving better fluids and highflow cats to reduce heat, but some dealers will give you problems, some won't.

Mclarens build their cars like F1 cars, they will do everything at the bare minimum to reduce weight to give you max performance, where Porsche is more endurance racing so cars are built to run, but won't give you faster lap times as a 750S or 296. Different philosophies for different customers.

If you want to have the fastest hero one lap on a track day, Mclaren, if you want to run constant lap times GT cars.

Manifold

In terms of the driving experience, I think McLaren makes the best cars. Comparatively, Porsches feel like very well engineered and evolved descendants of the VW bug, whereas McLarens feel like they were designed as performance cars from the ground up.

Some people shy away from McLarens for various reasons - proximity of dealers, reliability concerns, durability concerns, repair costs, small and sparse owner community, drawing unwanted attention, etc. I was one of those people, but now I have a 570 GT and I subjectively think it's the best car overall that I've driven. I'll only sell it to replace it with another McLaren. My McLaren has about 10k miles on it, 2k of them from my driving, and it has been reliable, no issues. Some people seem to have bad luck with McLaren reliability, but most seem to have good luck. It seems to depend on the specific model, the model year, and how much the car has been driven (more is better).

I haven't tracked my McLaren, but I will, though I don't envision using it as an all-day track car. I'll stick with Porsches for that kind of track use, though I haven't found them to be totally reliable nor durable:

- 991.1 GT3 had two engine failures and one transmission failure on track
- 981 GT4 had exhaust system fracture on track
- 992 TTS threw chassis control error codes when pushed hard and faulty fuel gauge resulting in running out of gas and the car dying on track
- Cayman R burned up the rear calipers and engine often overheated until third radiator was added
- One or more dampers went bad in 997.1 C2S and made the car prone to snap oversteer

GrantG

I’ll add the following to your list:
1. No manual gearbox option
2. No NA engine option
3. Steep depreciation
4. No warranty on track, unless visit dealer before and after every event.
5. No Euro Delivery

That being said, I do like driving them (road and track) - just don’t fit my needs and taste as well as Porsche.

Manifold

Responses in bold.

3-Pedals

06viper

Lol this thread makes me laugh. The 750 beats a GT3RS in just about every category there is. It’s in a whole different galaxy actually. As stated, the GT3RS is a very very fast sports car, not a supercar. The 750 is a supercar that is as fast and in some cases faster than hypercars. As suspected, this is a Porsche forum, so naturally people are going to defend the GT3RS I get that. But trying to bring up reliability and depreciation topics which are not true is funny. As I stated earlier in this thread. I have 4 McLarens and a 5th on the way. I have first hand experience of ownership unlike 90% of people on this forum. Reliability is just fine. And in terms of depreciation, last time I checked a 4 year old 765LT still sells wayyyy above MSRP (one just sold at Barrett Jackson for $800k three weeks ago). P1’s are 10+ years old and sell for $1mil + over their original MSRP, shall I go on? So that theory is debunked as well.

People talking about Porsches being the better “endurance” cars when 99% of the people on this forum have never even tracked their 911 and instead take it to the country club on the weekends haha. Me on the other hand track my cars and track them hard. Go to a track day at Laguna Seca, there are more Mclarens there than any other supercar brand by far. There are thousands or Mclarens on the road, they are just as reliable as any other brand. But the few that do have problems, the owners like to come on the forums and talk about how unreliable they are. But the 99% of the other owners and cars on the road are just fine and not complaining.

As stated, the people that usually like to talk trash about the brand don’t own a Mclaren and second can’t afford one. I am all for supporting the brand of supercar who’s currently making the best cars. If another brand starts making the most exotic, fastest, best all around supercar, then I’m all for it! But currently there is no other brand offering what Mclaren does with their cars, and especially the dollar for value $$. Shoot even their entry level models are carbon tub, ultra exotic, carbon panel, lightweight, crazy horsepower, track monsters that are unbelievably easy to daily drive as well. You can get a few years old used 720 for $200k-250k range. Name another car for that price that offers what the 720 does, any car from any brand go ahead. You can’t because there isn’t haha

I can’t tell you the amount of people I know that sold their GT3 or previous generation GT3, GT3RS after driving a Mclaren. Even just a basic 570. They sold their Porsche within weeks and picked up a 570, 720, Artura, 600LT, 765LT, etc and haven’t looked back. And these are hardcore track guys, not guys that take their car to cars and coffee on Saturday mornings haha. All I will say is go to your local Mclaren dealer and drive one around the block, and your life will be changed. I had Mclarens first, so when the 992 GT3 was announced I figured I’d drink the Porsche kool aid and ordered one. And immediately I could tell the only things better about the GT3 was the engine noise and that’s it. Plus the Porsche dealer treats me like crap and adds ADM to all their cars, I get treated like royalty at the Mclaren dealer and have never paid a cent over MSRP for any of my Mclarens.

FYI, The GT3RS is more in line with a 600LT or 620R, not a 750.

3-Pedals

Exotic cars all have exotic car problems. They have fewer dealers to service. They arent as forgiving modding (warranty wise) or DIY maintenance (warranty wise). They arent as durable and reliable (because the companies that make them produce very few of them vs thousands of 911s Porsche makes to iron out all issues fleet testing vehicles catch). Its a totally different experience. Exotic cars will never be like serial produced 911s. I think part of the problem is some people comparing these cars forget that. There is absolutely appeal of owning 1 of 1000 of something and accepting its issues that come with it at face value.

When the RS wing mount has an issue and screws come loose, Porsche goes and redesigns a part just for that problem. When the CF oil tank has a problem with drain plug and it spins free, Porsche goes and issues a TSB and comes out with a new design (albeit not as fast). When Artura fuel lines have a problem, it takes months for Mclaren to even get a part out to dealers. There were people in the mclaren forum who said they have been without their car for 10 weeks. Mclaren will never have the sheer resources and infrastructure of a Porsche. The same issues mclaren can have is present in other exotics. Lamborghini has its own issues. Ferrari has its own issues. F12s still corrode like crazy. 812s have weak door connections to the frame that can require extensive body repairs. The 296 had a lot of problems with earlier cars. Ferrari will not let you change your own oil if you want to keep your warranty. Ferrari will also nickle and dime even after you spend $6500/year on warranty on warranty issues. Mclaren will force you to service the car at a mclaren dealership. They are very picky with this stuff. Porsche is much easier to deal with. Exhaust, tune, this and that. No issues with warranty (as long as modification didnt cause it). No issues finding Porsche dealers across the country.

There are people here even when money is no object, they refuse to accept these exotic car problems and choose a 911. Then there are people where who can only afford a 911 and cant afford a 750S. These are two different groups of people. And I think these groups are talking past each other.

I personally love the way mclarens drive. I couldnt make it happen for myself because at the end of the day I am at a part of my life where I dont have the time and energy to deal with potential problems. 5 years ago, sure yes why not. In 5 years, perhaps yes, but right now work & family take up all of my time. I want to be able to turn the key and drive and not worry about changing my own oil myself or service appointments or parts shortages when my 911 breaks.

By the way the last 765lt in BAT went RNM about $80k below msrp. That car in barett jackson was an outlier that was the result of two people with lots of money trying to outbid each other. I know of multiple 765lt coupes that can be had below msrp with low miles (couple of thousand). So your statement is no longer the case. The depreciation issue of mclarens dont bother me but I was just responding to your comment about the market. I bet you that anyone can sell an RS (even a 991.2) for msrp with 8000 miles. For some people, this is an important factor.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2021-mclaren-765lt-14/

Manifold

This is much less of an issue if you have multiple cars and aren't relying on any one car to be trouble-free.

3-Pedals

I have multiple cars. This isnt so much about being stranded and being without car. Its about having a car that requires too much coordination and thinking about when it can be fixed, whats wrong with it, multiple trips to diagnose, etc. If I was a retired person relying on a passive income stream from real estate/stocks and just chilling with my time, I’d absolutely have a mclaren or two in the stable. But I work long hours and have a family with teenagers. I just dont have the mental capacity to deal with a mclaren. Porsche just works. It has never given me trouble. Now I have owned 5 of them and put over 60,000 miles across all of them. Every issue I had was quickly fixed. I never had to deal with quirks of anything anywhere. Its clear every detail of these cars have been thoroughly designed and thought through by engineers. I like that the oil filter on my gt3 has just enough clearance to fit a oil filter wrench made just for gt3. You dont have to fight with the car to get a wrench on. Every nut and bolt on the car goes back in the way it comes out. I removed the bumper on my gt3 over a dozen times. It still goes back and stays on like it was new. None of my bolts or hardware rusted anywhere.

I am an engineer by trade and have background in mathematics. I look at these cars and I realize if I was asked to design things, I would probably come up with the same stuff germans did. I cannot find any faults with 911s from the way seats are bolted to the floor to the way wiper blades are serviced. Their engineers are just so superior in the way they look at things. I stand by any mclaren and I see many short comings. Its clear not the same amount of thought process went into them. They werent designed to be driven in snow. You should see the gt3rs video in snow. Try doing that in your 570S. Do you think it will survive? I know a person whose coil packs had its connections corrode because he kept his car outdoors during a winter. You can drive a turbo s or a gt3 in greenland for 3 years and it will probably still hit 0-60 in 2.6 seconds in year 4.

Manifold

Some McLarens are very reliable. Just need to find one that is. I’d stay away from the first year of a new model.

Since I got my car used and 5 years old, I saw that it hadn’t had many issues in those years, so I figured it’s probably reliable.

The McLaren has become my preferred winter car because, with PS4S tires, the handling is really good and progressive at temps in the 30s F.

I’m an engineer too. I’ve long admired German, Swiss, and British engineering. Italian, not so much.

AlexCeres

They are both great cars. Dunno why folks get all defensive. The 750 is about $200K more once you spec it nicely (both medium spec and high spec on each car), maybe a pinch less. It should be a lot better. And it is on the street, and dual use. The 3RS at msrp is a ridiculous value for a track only toy.

I just can’t bring myself to dual use a 3RS with ADM over the 750. Basically the same price at that point, and really compromised on the street as just a car.

AlexCeres

so yes you can drive McLarens in the snow just fine, and second, the 3RS isn’t good for your use case either. The active aero, trim, and suspension are a lot more sensitive to damage from road conditions and debris. PEC will let you take a gt3 anywhere. The 3rs is absolutely not allowed on a bunch of the exercises because it’s too sensitive for the kick plate or ice hill. It’s a track car. And those parts are going to be expensive to replace and take a while. Certainly folks have had a lot of fun waiting for lightweight glass replacements.

porsche surely does make the cars you describe, but the 3rs isn’t it.

flsupraguy

The 750s is a phenomenal car, it just lacks emotion like the gt cars do.... Give me a 9k NA engine with a clutch pedal all day long.