John Mclane

Found this old gem.

https://www.solsticeforum.com/thread...p-revolt.5174/

Maybe we get enough momentum (no dealer pun intended) for this to happen (I know it's delusional):

http://www.motor1.com/news/493595/fo...p-removed/amp/

I say make the ADM very noticeable. Greedy can't be afraid of bad press.

User 81423

Good point good point.. The other dealer I was working with is Newport Porsche - $50k ADM.

BSO

Don't have a horse in this race, but this is market economics at work. Limited supply, eager buyers willing to pay, sounds like the dealers have you by the pelotas.

Mr.Bourne

Heard same today in NorCal. $40k ADM.

DucatiV4S

I received the same level of respect and loyalty form my “never to be used again dealer”. I’m thankful a great buddy in the biz connected me to the proper guy.

EVRGRN

Geez, you would think that at a level where they're selling cars for close to $300K, they would craft a better email and certainly one without a spelling error.
That person should be sent down to selling Chevys until they can refine their skills.

konaforever

Looks like I'm keeping my 991.2 GT3. Was looking to get a 992 GT3 RS, but based on these ADM's, it will be equal or higher for the RS.

ttcbj

I don't mean to hijack this thread, but as someone trying to buy a first Porsche, I find their business model really fascinating:

1. I really respect a good reverse sales process, and they've got one. Reverse sales, for those who haven't heard the term, is used to sell high commitment, high price products by making them hard to get. When someone gets "offered" the product, they are so happy that they don't quibble on price. College is a classic example (by the time you get in to Harvard, you don't want to quibble on price).

2. A reverse sales process requires scarcity, and so much like diamonds, you need to manage the used market (google "Have you ever tried to sell a diamond?" for a fun article on this issue). I think the cost of major service and parts, and also think the highly differentiated nature of the product helps with this, its hard to find a used car with just the options you want.

3. That scarcity necessarily creates a situation where some people might pay more for the car than the MSRP, which (a) transfers money from Porsche corporate to the dealers, since Porsche cannot capture this "excess" scarcity-driven value (b) forces dealers to choose between allocating cars to the highest bidder, and allocating cars based on some vaguely moral principle like "loyalty." Having worked in sales, I will say that it is really really hard to walk away from money that is on the table, even if maybe taking that money isn't in your own best long-term interest. Overall, this seems like a very awkward balance to manage.

This all interests me, but what interests me even more is that Porsche now primarily pays the bills with SUVs, and I don't think SUVs are subject to the same market dynamics. I don't think you can convince people that a Macan is so much better than other SUVs that you should wait 1 year and pay over MSRP to get it. So Porsche dealers are now (I think) running two separate sales models inside their organizations. A reverse-sales process and a traditional sales process. I've noticed that at local dealers, there are no 911s and 718s right now, but there are plenty of Taycans and SUVs.

Anyway, I once read of Las Vegas/gambling "Its not a game, its an industry, 100% chance you loose." If you are upset that you "lost" money in Vegas, you just don't understand the nature of the transaction, but if you understand that you are paying for a form of entertainment, then you won't be disappointed. But as I wait for a new Porsche, I see the scarcity of the sports cars, the difficulty getting an allocation, the possibility of an ADM, etc as just a part of Porsche's business model. And they are really, really good at it. And it's a hard thing to pull off. So, I don't let it bother me. I'll get a car, or I won't, but it's just business.

John Mclane

Like diamonds, they are not scarce. Also like diamonds (see deBeers) a fake scarcity is created by controlling distribution. The car becomes a commodity, attracting "investors" (flippers) mixed up with "collectors" ( quote bc these cars are not unique) and few actual drivers. Cars being treated like appreciating assets and this happens. As long as you don't drive the car you won't break it routine. The dealers print money, less so the factory, which benefits more secondarily by allowing them to profit like this and less with conventional sales.

The whole thing percolates to the used market. At 110k you can see 10+ year old overlapping for no good reason. The pressure on the used market reflects on the new and vice versa.
This could be solved by making as many as possible to overflow the "investors" with or without the factory fighting in the behalf of their customers (Levine with Ford for instance).

Microchip shortage and COVID are not helping.
Posting their ADM prices here won't solve it but for sure is fun and puts things in perspective. 100k is good for a very nice car. If we get enough momentum sharing this thread, it may generate enough bad PR that the dealers would at least be ashamed (I know, I laughed at that too).

Like Jerry Seinfeld said about another car. it's a limited model. Limited to as many as they could sell...

ChrisFL

I don't think anyone is saying its impossible to get one at MSRP. I just got on a list for a touring at MSRP. This happened only because my friend has bought and has referred friends who bought many many porsches from their dealer (in PA). They don't even ask to take any deposits from him because they know him so well. But there are plenty of dealers out there wanting the most of your dollars and seeing what you are willing to spend. My local dealer here in Orlando straight up calls and ask for $50k ADM. $5k deposits on any car you want to order. Probably not going to do too much business with them, but I know there are people out there shelling out some sort of ADM to be the first ones.

touringGT3

Congrats! You are lucky. Was only busting some chops so all good. Goes to show you though that MSRP can be had and there are different ways to get it, granted it doesn't mean it'll be easy. And at the end of the day, it's primarily dependent on dealer business practices.

Norcalgt3

I would wait until you get car in hand. With dealers these days, things are subject to change. I've seen some I've bought multiple MSRP brand new gt cars from start asking for ADM.

touringGT3

Agreed. Until the dealer is contractually obligated to sell you the car things can still change.

maxysx

the Pasadena or the west lake one? This is madness...

maxysx

Let’s all make more monies. It is a luxury toy for us after all.