Dear Porsche,
06-27-2018, 08:55 PM
#122
Rennlist Member
I'd be perfectly pleased if Porsche made a new 718 with a 6-cylinder again, available beyond the rumored GT4.
OP I just don't think you need more power than your 981 GT4. It's more fun to drive a "slower" car fast then ...
To many others' point here a Gt4RS would be awesome but its not much use on the street and it would cost $150K+
Sometimes you have to examine if you really need a faster/newer car. I think the bigger issue for Porsche is to keep the main sellers usable and enjoyable on the street without prices getting out of hand - 150K for a Carrera S or even GTS? I'll pass (and did).
OP I just don't think you need more power than your 981 GT4. It's more fun to drive a "slower" car fast then ...
To many others' point here a Gt4RS would be awesome but its not much use on the street and it would cost $150K+
Sometimes you have to examine if you really need a faster/newer car. I think the bigger issue for Porsche is to keep the main sellers usable and enjoyable on the street without prices getting out of hand - 150K for a Carrera S or even GTS? I'll pass (and did).
06-27-2018, 09:47 PM
#123
The problem for auto makers though is each one has to be significantly faster than it’s predecessor and keep up with competitors or people will be like what? Why? Even if it’s crazy faster already and even if making it faster doesn’t make it any more fun to drive fast.
06-27-2018, 10:06 PM
#124
Dmk2 - I know it's the internet - but again, how was your last GT4 lacking and why did you sell it.
What do you want it to be? Or more specifically what does an un-neutered Cayman looklike
The car you appear to want (and it's the mantra of those that feel the Cayman is held back) will have the GT3 rear suspension, GT3 engine and be priced at the same level as the last GT4 release (and PDK-s). Will Porsche build it - possibly as a limited run special e.g. GT4 RS - there is one running around. Will they mainstream it - no why? Because then it will be a mid-engined GT3 and the GT3 already exists.
If if you want high HP mid-engined cars they abound aplenty Audi R8, now with RWD, any number of Lamborghini, Ferrari and McLaren - take your pick. They're all good.
One of of the reasons the Cayman/GT4 is so good is because it's not over cooked - it has balanced performance - they are not slow and they are usable.
Porsche don't need to do much to make the next GT4 special e.g. Add a little more adjustability to the front and rear suspension, increase torque by a small amount and push the curve out further. These two fixes will mitigate most of the gripes about the original (and fix 3rd by having a proper splined joined cog).
Back to the GTS - you (probably) should have got the base - you would have enjoyed that. The piece of the equation you are missing is the track time and as a former instructor you should know on track the GTS is a weapon particularly with RAS. It is this duality that makes it special.
I'm petty comfortable Porsche will get the next GT4 right and I'm very happy with my 991 GTS but then again I did my research before buying it and a consequence was prepared for that duality. Something that is not offered by BMW and Mercedes and something that expands the operational character of the car.
I have a deposit down on the next GT4, largely because having looked at a lot of detail, I know Porsche will make a raft of changes that will make it a much better car - very much a relative concept. Will the internet consider it neutered? probably, but then again its hard to drive a car on the internet.
What do you want it to be? Or more specifically what does an un-neutered Cayman looklike
The car you appear to want (and it's the mantra of those that feel the Cayman is held back) will have the GT3 rear suspension, GT3 engine and be priced at the same level as the last GT4 release (and PDK-s). Will Porsche build it - possibly as a limited run special e.g. GT4 RS - there is one running around. Will they mainstream it - no why? Because then it will be a mid-engined GT3 and the GT3 already exists.
If if you want high HP mid-engined cars they abound aplenty Audi R8, now with RWD, any number of Lamborghini, Ferrari and McLaren - take your pick. They're all good.
One of of the reasons the Cayman/GT4 is so good is because it's not over cooked - it has balanced performance - they are not slow and they are usable.
Porsche don't need to do much to make the next GT4 special e.g. Add a little more adjustability to the front and rear suspension, increase torque by a small amount and push the curve out further. These two fixes will mitigate most of the gripes about the original (and fix 3rd by having a proper splined joined cog).
Back to the GTS - you (probably) should have got the base - you would have enjoyed that. The piece of the equation you are missing is the track time and as a former instructor you should know on track the GTS is a weapon particularly with RAS. It is this duality that makes it special.
I'm petty comfortable Porsche will get the next GT4 right and I'm very happy with my 991 GTS but then again I did my research before buying it and a consequence was prepared for that duality. Something that is not offered by BMW and Mercedes and something that expands the operational character of the car.
I have a deposit down on the next GT4, largely because having looked at a lot of detail, I know Porsche will make a raft of changes that will make it a much better car - very much a relative concept. Will the internet consider it neutered? probably, but then again its hard to drive a car on the internet.
Last edited by groundhog; 06-27-2018 at 11:58 PM.
06-28-2018, 12:34 AM
#125
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
I wouldn't normally go about justifying my decision to let go of my GT4, but given the topic of discussion the question is fair.
It feels like I am about to take a seat in a psychiatrist's office, but lets start at the beginning. I have been looking for an opportunity to tell my story...
In the first week of sixth grade I sat down next to another kid in science class reading Car and Driver. At that point in my life that was a luxury and for a car crazed kid I immediately knew I had found a friend. Sure enough we hit it off.
As it happens his father had an interest in and the means to own every Porsche model being produced at that time. My first time hanging out with this kid at his house was in the garage and that is where we started all of our time together as kids. As we got older his father taught us how to clean and care for the cars, then how to drive them, and then how to drive them as they were intended to be driven. By the time we had licenses we were proficient at safely driving everything from a 944 cabriolet to a 911 Turbo at the limit. We were free to use the cars when they were available as long as we kept them clean, fueled, and cared for. We knew this was a tremendous privilege and didn't abuse it.
In college I spent two to three weekends a month for four years driving at TWS. I cut my teeth, honed my skills, and helped others learn how to do the same. It was a glorious time that came to a stand still as I pursued the rest of my education and training.
When I reached a stage in my life that my first Porsche was on the horizon I had every intent of ordering a 997 Carrera S. My mind was made. That was going to be my first Porsche. Or so I thought. At nearly the same time the 987 Cayman was under development and I became intrigued. I followed everything I could about the car before it was formally presented. I was very intrigued.
On the day I went to place the order for my 997 there was a Midnight Blue Metallic Cayman S demonstrator sitting right out side of the dealership. I walked directly passed it, but paused and got a glance of the rear 3/4 view. It made my heart skip a beat. It made me feel like I was about to cheat on my spouse. There I was going home to my wife, but tempted by another.
I sat down with my sales advisor and configured the Carrera, but kept looking back at the Cayman. My sales advisor took notice and kindly offered a test drive. I was hooked. The mid-engine platform appealed to my left brain. The beauty of a the fixed roof Boxster coupe appealed to my right brain. What felt like a lifetime of waiting for my first 911 transformed into an unyielding desire for the Cayman, and that is what I ordered that day. I own that car to this day. (I didn't previously mention the Cayenne S we also bought along the way because it doesn't influence this discussion, but should illustrate my willingness to try all that Porsche has to offer)
When the first hints of a GT4 became apparent I asked my sales advisor if he could get me an allocation. Although he believed it would be unlikely he would try. What followed was a gift from the Porsche gods. A 918 owner decide to pass along his build slot to me after speaking to my sales advisor. I am not a Porsche VIP customer but was overcome by the generosity of one. If you are reading, thank you.
I specified the car, ordered, and took delivery over the course of 11 months. The wait was worth it. This was the car I had been waiting for. This is the car that I would never sell for any price. I enjoyed every moment of ownership. From taking my wife to dinner in the car, to Hill Country runs, to track time at TWS or MSR this car was fantastic. Even my daughter loved the thing.
However, I quickly became accustomed to the ease with which I could drive the car. It was pure in design and so easy to drive that it was no longer a challenge. The car needed more power. Enough to make it fulfilling at the limit. Enough to make it a nuanced but challenging dance partner, not one that gracefully followed every command.
I began to long for the joy of the old air cooled cars that I fell in love with during my childhood. The shape, the sound of the doors closing, the smell of the interiors, the characteristic sound and smell of the air cooled motors, the poise with which they shifted their weight during transitions...I needed a 911 in my life. I needed more horsepower. The GT4 deserved more power and could easily handle it, but Porsche wasn't making it.
Back I went to my sales advisor. He made it far too easy for me. They took my GT4 back on pre-trade for more than I paid for it and immediately offered a 911 GTS allocation at a discount. Could I logically pass this up? More power with a small difference in price?!?! Lets do it! The deal was further sweetened with the prospect of a GT3 allocation.
So here I am. Trying to compel my fellow enthusiasts that the GT4 deserves to be more than it is.
I am no internet fan boy junky who has no tie to the brand, or performance driving, or even Porsche ownership. I have been a Rennlist member since 2007 and have less than 250 posts. I have gathered useful information about my cars at Rennlist. This tread represents my single greatest activity here. Everything I conveyed here was to push our future cars forward. Progress.
I simply love Porsche sports cars and want to see them at their best. All of them at their best.
It feels like I am about to take a seat in a psychiatrist's office, but lets start at the beginning. I have been looking for an opportunity to tell my story...
In the first week of sixth grade I sat down next to another kid in science class reading Car and Driver. At that point in my life that was a luxury and for a car crazed kid I immediately knew I had found a friend. Sure enough we hit it off.
As it happens his father had an interest in and the means to own every Porsche model being produced at that time. My first time hanging out with this kid at his house was in the garage and that is where we started all of our time together as kids. As we got older his father taught us how to clean and care for the cars, then how to drive them, and then how to drive them as they were intended to be driven. By the time we had licenses we were proficient at safely driving everything from a 944 cabriolet to a 911 Turbo at the limit. We were free to use the cars when they were available as long as we kept them clean, fueled, and cared for. We knew this was a tremendous privilege and didn't abuse it.
In college I spent two to three weekends a month for four years driving at TWS. I cut my teeth, honed my skills, and helped others learn how to do the same. It was a glorious time that came to a stand still as I pursued the rest of my education and training.
When I reached a stage in my life that my first Porsche was on the horizon I had every intent of ordering a 997 Carrera S. My mind was made. That was going to be my first Porsche. Or so I thought. At nearly the same time the 987 Cayman was under development and I became intrigued. I followed everything I could about the car before it was formally presented. I was very intrigued.
On the day I went to place the order for my 997 there was a Midnight Blue Metallic Cayman S demonstrator sitting right out side of the dealership. I walked directly passed it, but paused and got a glance of the rear 3/4 view. It made my heart skip a beat. It made me feel like I was about to cheat on my spouse. There I was going home to my wife, but tempted by another.
I sat down with my sales advisor and configured the Carrera, but kept looking back at the Cayman. My sales advisor took notice and kindly offered a test drive. I was hooked. The mid-engine platform appealed to my left brain. The beauty of a the fixed roof Boxster coupe appealed to my right brain. What felt like a lifetime of waiting for my first 911 transformed into an unyielding desire for the Cayman, and that is what I ordered that day. I own that car to this day. (I didn't previously mention the Cayenne S we also bought along the way because it doesn't influence this discussion, but should illustrate my willingness to try all that Porsche has to offer)
When the first hints of a GT4 became apparent I asked my sales advisor if he could get me an allocation. Although he believed it would be unlikely he would try. What followed was a gift from the Porsche gods. A 918 owner decide to pass along his build slot to me after speaking to my sales advisor. I am not a Porsche VIP customer but was overcome by the generosity of one. If you are reading, thank you.
I specified the car, ordered, and took delivery over the course of 11 months. The wait was worth it. This was the car I had been waiting for. This is the car that I would never sell for any price. I enjoyed every moment of ownership. From taking my wife to dinner in the car, to Hill Country runs, to track time at TWS or MSR this car was fantastic. Even my daughter loved the thing.
However, I quickly became accustomed to the ease with which I could drive the car. It was pure in design and so easy to drive that it was no longer a challenge. The car needed more power. Enough to make it fulfilling at the limit. Enough to make it a nuanced but challenging dance partner, not one that gracefully followed every command.
I began to long for the joy of the old air cooled cars that I fell in love with during my childhood. The shape, the sound of the doors closing, the smell of the interiors, the characteristic sound and smell of the air cooled motors, the poise with which they shifted their weight during transitions...I needed a 911 in my life. I needed more horsepower. The GT4 deserved more power and could easily handle it, but Porsche wasn't making it.
Back I went to my sales advisor. He made it far too easy for me. They took my GT4 back on pre-trade for more than I paid for it and immediately offered a 911 GTS allocation at a discount. Could I logically pass this up? More power with a small difference in price?!?! Lets do it! The deal was further sweetened with the prospect of a GT3 allocation.
So here I am. Trying to compel my fellow enthusiasts that the GT4 deserves to be more than it is.
I am no internet fan boy junky who has no tie to the brand, or performance driving, or even Porsche ownership. I have been a Rennlist member since 2007 and have less than 250 posts. I have gathered useful information about my cars at Rennlist. This tread represents my single greatest activity here. Everything I conveyed here was to push our future cars forward. Progress.
I simply love Porsche sports cars and want to see them at their best. All of them at their best.
Last edited by dmk2; 06-28-2018 at 08:55 PM.
06-28-2018, 01:02 AM
#126
Thanks for the clarification
As to the "I needed more horsepower" statement - do you still believe that to be the case. My own finding over a long period of time is the differences appear large in the 300's and yet small once into the 400s. Hence my feeling a Cayman with ~ 430HP may be as close as one gets to Porsche Nirvana (as long as there is no weight gain). Well thought through power/torque gains along with small changes can collectively add to a big difference in both feel and performance. In my view its something Porsche does well.
Also they really understand their target market e.g. they make large numbers of Carreras and small numbers of GT3s. I think thats why both the Cayman and 911 exist - they reach out to different audiences. Some of us like both, I prefer the look of the Cayman and the intimate experience it offers likewise I like the GT character of the GTS with its sleeper duality - long distance cruiser or a car that can literally explode from a corner.
When you dig into the detail Porsche seem to get it more right than wrong (although I can't stand Macans or Cayennes but appreciate the business case).
There are two items I think Porsche nails far better than others
(1) the seating position and visual lines - the practical positioning of the steering wheel and pedals plus the seats themselves. You get in a Porsche and it feels set up to drive and in that it feels special.
(2) the driving experience itself - whether in a Cayman or a 911 its always good to sublime - again they feel special, this not a placebo effect they actually are - a cayman has the ability to carry tremendous corner speed and the 911 has explosive exit speed.
Unless you're buying Super Cars or niche products you never get the above from another manufacturer. I own a number of Porsche sports cars and routinely try all sorts of other car and yet I keep buying Porsche sports cars - why? because I just can't find anything better.
By the way, the first Porsche I purchased was a Cayman (long time ago and long gone) - I still remember the test drive and repeatedly going round a round about with a huge grin on my face - that feeling has never changed
As to the "I needed more horsepower" statement - do you still believe that to be the case. My own finding over a long period of time is the differences appear large in the 300's and yet small once into the 400s. Hence my feeling a Cayman with ~ 430HP may be as close as one gets to Porsche Nirvana (as long as there is no weight gain). Well thought through power/torque gains along with small changes can collectively add to a big difference in both feel and performance. In my view its something Porsche does well.
Also they really understand their target market e.g. they make large numbers of Carreras and small numbers of GT3s. I think thats why both the Cayman and 911 exist - they reach out to different audiences. Some of us like both, I prefer the look of the Cayman and the intimate experience it offers likewise I like the GT character of the GTS with its sleeper duality - long distance cruiser or a car that can literally explode from a corner.
When you dig into the detail Porsche seem to get it more right than wrong (although I can't stand Macans or Cayennes but appreciate the business case).
There are two items I think Porsche nails far better than others
(1) the seating position and visual lines - the practical positioning of the steering wheel and pedals plus the seats themselves. You get in a Porsche and it feels set up to drive and in that it feels special.
(2) the driving experience itself - whether in a Cayman or a 911 its always good to sublime - again they feel special, this not a placebo effect they actually are - a cayman has the ability to carry tremendous corner speed and the 911 has explosive exit speed.
Unless you're buying Super Cars or niche products you never get the above from another manufacturer. I own a number of Porsche sports cars and routinely try all sorts of other car and yet I keep buying Porsche sports cars - why? because I just can't find anything better.
By the way, the first Porsche I purchased was a Cayman (long time ago and long gone) - I still remember the test drive and repeatedly going round a round about with a huge grin on my face - that feeling has never changed
Last edited by groundhog; 06-29-2018 at 05:37 AM.
06-29-2018, 05:24 AM
#128
IMO there is no "better" car.
It ALL boils down to personal preference. It doesn't matter if the 911 (in whichever variant) has the fastest lap time at xxx track. Who cares?
If one prefers the characteristics of a rear engine car then obviously the 911 fills the need.
If one prefers mid-engine - then Cayman or Boxster is the choice (or another mid-engine brand)
I know our 991RS is better statistically in power, speed, etc. But FOR ME (emphasis on ME!) the GT4 is the "better car". Not because it can outperform the RS but because it's the car I PREFER! I like just about everything about it better than the RS (how the cabin feels, the handling, the shifting). I love the look of the RS (especially the purple paint) and it sounds great but so does the GT4 IMO.
I happen to love the mid-engine and while I appreciate other cars (including rear and front engine) for what they are - I (so far) would rather drive a mid-engine. It's not right/wrong/better/worse. It's just what I LIKE and enjoy the most.
I suppose some folks could say I'm "deficient or defective" because I prefer a mid-engine and that's fine. They can say whatever they want. I make zero judgements about what anyone else prefers to have in their garage.
It seems like there's a lot of discussion trying to prove which is better. It doesn't matter what's on paper or even which one gets the fastest lap at the test track. The bottom line is to buy what you like. I don't really care if Porsche comes up with an "un-neutered" version of the GT4 because I don't really exploit the limits of the car as it is now. Yes I have driven in anger on many tracks, and i've reached the limit of adhesion MANY times, and in a few cases even reached the limit of the car's power/torque/braking. But not very often because it's not how I choose to drive most of the time. I want to have fun. I don't race. I don't use slicks. I want to drive home in one piece with a HUGE smile!
Frankly the Cayman R may have met my needs even better and I still miss that car even though "on paper" the GT4 is superior in every way. What I do love about the GT4 over the R is that transmission. I love shifting the GT4. But if I never got a build slot, and kept the R I'd be just as happy (which brings into question whether I made a smart decision to spend what it cost to get into the GT4 in the first place - but I can't turn back the clock and I have no regrets since I had to make a choice).
One caveat: I fully understand why lap times and test data are important to the sales of the car. There are many reasons. What I mean by the comments above is that those stats aren't important to me because I drive what I prefer. I also know I will never be the "fastest" on the track or elsewhere. My sense of self-preservation usually kicks in at a speed that doesn't allow me to "win" (my personal best is 165 at Pocono in our Lambo which felt solid as a rock but I didn't like the speed and will probably never drive that fast again because I choose NOT to).
To the OP - it's a very interesting discussion and I've enjoyed most of what I've read so far.
Can't we all just get along?
It ALL boils down to personal preference. It doesn't matter if the 911 (in whichever variant) has the fastest lap time at xxx track. Who cares?
If one prefers the characteristics of a rear engine car then obviously the 911 fills the need.
If one prefers mid-engine - then Cayman or Boxster is the choice (or another mid-engine brand)
I know our 991RS is better statistically in power, speed, etc. But FOR ME (emphasis on ME!) the GT4 is the "better car". Not because it can outperform the RS but because it's the car I PREFER! I like just about everything about it better than the RS (how the cabin feels, the handling, the shifting). I love the look of the RS (especially the purple paint) and it sounds great but so does the GT4 IMO.
I happen to love the mid-engine and while I appreciate other cars (including rear and front engine) for what they are - I (so far) would rather drive a mid-engine. It's not right/wrong/better/worse. It's just what I LIKE and enjoy the most.
I suppose some folks could say I'm "deficient or defective" because I prefer a mid-engine and that's fine. They can say whatever they want. I make zero judgements about what anyone else prefers to have in their garage.
It seems like there's a lot of discussion trying to prove which is better. It doesn't matter what's on paper or even which one gets the fastest lap at the test track. The bottom line is to buy what you like. I don't really care if Porsche comes up with an "un-neutered" version of the GT4 because I don't really exploit the limits of the car as it is now. Yes I have driven in anger on many tracks, and i've reached the limit of adhesion MANY times, and in a few cases even reached the limit of the car's power/torque/braking. But not very often because it's not how I choose to drive most of the time. I want to have fun. I don't race. I don't use slicks. I want to drive home in one piece with a HUGE smile!
Frankly the Cayman R may have met my needs even better and I still miss that car even though "on paper" the GT4 is superior in every way. What I do love about the GT4 over the R is that transmission. I love shifting the GT4. But if I never got a build slot, and kept the R I'd be just as happy (which brings into question whether I made a smart decision to spend what it cost to get into the GT4 in the first place - but I can't turn back the clock and I have no regrets since I had to make a choice).
One caveat: I fully understand why lap times and test data are important to the sales of the car. There are many reasons. What I mean by the comments above is that those stats aren't important to me because I drive what I prefer. I also know I will never be the "fastest" on the track or elsewhere. My sense of self-preservation usually kicks in at a speed that doesn't allow me to "win" (my personal best is 165 at Pocono in our Lambo which felt solid as a rock but I didn't like the speed and will probably never drive that fast again because I choose NOT to).
To the OP - it's a very interesting discussion and I've enjoyed most of what I've read so far.
Can't we all just get along?
YUP. Absolutely.
06-29-2018, 09:01 AM
#129
Rennlist Member
The main problem with the 981 in general, is the gearing.
It is just ridiculously too long even by Porsche standards for the street. The GT4 never addressed this. The GT3 and GT4 are street cars that are more track capable. Not the other way around.
The 981S or GTS with PASM and PTV already handled in ways that for me required no improvement. The brakes were already street adequate. Improvements in the GT4 were welcome but not needed.
The minor engine differences in the GT4 in stock form with no gearing changes meant the car does not feel a whole ton faster driving around town.
The cost increase over my optioned 981 S in no way were proportional to the horsepower increase and in this case it was all about horsepower to me.
if they gave it the right gearing and did not neuter the 3.8 I think it would be a different tale.
It is just ridiculously too long even by Porsche standards for the street. The GT4 never addressed this. The GT3 and GT4 are street cars that are more track capable. Not the other way around.
The 981S or GTS with PASM and PTV already handled in ways that for me required no improvement. The brakes were already street adequate. Improvements in the GT4 were welcome but not needed.
The minor engine differences in the GT4 in stock form with no gearing changes meant the car does not feel a whole ton faster driving around town.
The cost increase over my optioned 981 S in no way were proportional to the horsepower increase and in this case it was all about horsepower to me.
if they gave it the right gearing and did not neuter the 3.8 I think it would be a different tale.
06-29-2018, 09:37 AM
#130
The gearing is fine on track and the issue was gearing relative to torque and HP, the disappointment was more the lack of top end relative to gearing.
I do not want short gears for track - for those of you that want a pure street car please pick something else - do not neuter a Porsche with short gears through ignorance.
I do not want short gears for track - for those of you that want a pure street car please pick something else - do not neuter a Porsche with short gears through ignorance.
Last edited by groundhog; 06-29-2018 at 09:59 AM.
06-29-2018, 10:32 AM
#131
My 981 felt slow and had me always wanting more power. It sounded great, but the performance didn't match. The power was all usable...full throttle all the time in mid RPMs was 'normal acceleration.' I can do the same thing in my 911, but the RPMs climb 2-3 much faster and I get up to speed faster. If I wanted, I could use less throttle, but don't see how that would be more fun. If I redline it, I still get to 70 mph at the end of second gear. Everything happens much faster in the 911 and mine is AWD, so it has the traction to use all the power. It's not like a corvette where you're spinning all the time and less power is more fun. I don't see how going slower would make it more fun.
Maybe manual transmission gearing is different, but I don't see how porsche is limiting the GT4. What would be a deal breaker for me is how it hesitates from a stop similar to other porsche NA cars. It's a big lag the turbos don't have. Once you get revved up and going, it's responsive and fast. This is a type of car good for a track and going really fast...not so much for zipping around daily driving or in traffic. I don't think dead spots in the lower RPMs are porsche hinder the car...it's just how NA engines work. The gearing is fine and wouldn't fix it. Some turbos would though.
Maybe manual transmission gearing is different, but I don't see how porsche is limiting the GT4. What would be a deal breaker for me is how it hesitates from a stop similar to other porsche NA cars. It's a big lag the turbos don't have. Once you get revved up and going, it's responsive and fast. This is a type of car good for a track and going really fast...not so much for zipping around daily driving or in traffic. I don't think dead spots in the lower RPMs are porsche hinder the car...it's just how NA engines work. The gearing is fine and wouldn't fix it. Some turbos would though.
06-29-2018, 10:42 AM
#132
With free breathing Beethoven in the back, I wouldn’t want to keep it at low RPM’s for any other reason than to putt around mundanely in traffic.
I do, however think the GT4 gears are artificially long. Perhaps it is more for reasons of making it a better track weapon (as opposed to cleverly using long gearing to make it slower than the 991.1 S) as those with track experience in the car would know better than I. But, on the street, I would like an option for closer gear ratios. The true fun to these visceral N/A motors is winding them up, lots of shifting, and hearing them sing. Too long gearing hinders that. Though yes, on a track it’s more beneficial, and in fairness to Porsche, they’re always focused on pure (track) performance more than they are gimmicks and street “SOTP feel.”
I do, however think the GT4 gears are artificially long. Perhaps it is more for reasons of making it a better track weapon (as opposed to cleverly using long gearing to make it slower than the 991.1 S) as those with track experience in the car would know better than I. But, on the street, I would like an option for closer gear ratios. The true fun to these visceral N/A motors is winding them up, lots of shifting, and hearing them sing. Too long gearing hinders that. Though yes, on a track it’s more beneficial, and in fairness to Porsche, they’re always focused on pure (track) performance more than they are gimmicks and street “SOTP feel.”
06-29-2018, 10:20 PM
#135
I've never seen anything move like that on the Ring. Now every video I watch will look like snails on molasses. Funny, that thing just turned a 5:19 and we often argue on this board about cars being "MASSIVELY" different from one another, when they're within >10 seconds. Puts some perspective into place. The 991 GT3 RS just beat the 918 Spyder on the Ring, and even that is 1 MINUTE AND THIRTY FIVE SECONDS slower than that 919.