X51 kit - 991.2S - Suncoast
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 703
Likes: 7
From: Laguna, CA
As I said, working on trying to get this to work with a base which is I went for a base. It's only a matter of time and Porsche knows it so they are going to get their initial cash grab as they are the only turbo upgrade game in town.
Thread Starter
Banned
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 1,350
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From: Australia
Yeah, that doesn't apply to the X51 kit here. There is no cooling difference and there is no difference other than the software and turbos.
As I said, working on trying to get this to work with a base which is I went for a base. It's only a matter of time and Porsche knows it so they are going to get their initial cash grab as they are the only turbo upgrade game in town.
As I said, working on trying to get this to work with a base which is I went for a base. It's only a matter of time and Porsche knows it so they are going to get their initial cash grab as they are the only turbo upgrade game in town.
Sticky my best guess for you is you will have to go full MOTEC (optimise headers, buy GTS turbos, open race exhaust - turbo back).
If you do this you will be good to go for 600Nm - I have no idea where the knock threshold sits with this engine at higher RPM.
Banned
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 703
Likes: 7
From: Laguna, CA
The software does have an impact on the physicals in terms how and when oil pumps work and the overall cooling strategy in different modes Normal, Sport and Sports+. Obviously I have no way of verifying this. From what I have been told its a complete system wide remap.
Sticky my best guess for you is you will have to go full MOTEC (optimise headers, buy GTS turbos, open race exhaust - turbo back).
Sticky my best guess for you is you will have to go full MOTEC (optimise headers, buy GTS turbos, open race exhaust - turbo back).
I won't do a standalone on this car as the software evolution will allow the factory DME to run upgraded turbos. Porsche can flash it, we'll be able to flash it. Motec is definitely a way to go for those who just can't wait and want to run whatever they want to run.
Drifting
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,467
Likes: 312
From: Midtown Atlanta
Why is it called X51 instead of X50? X51 is the Powerkit that involves different intake manifold, heads, etc. X50 is the Powerkit that involves a pair of larger turbos, larger ICs and tuning maps to make the most of them. I've had both. X50 made more difference but seemed like a rip-off at 18,000 bucks. X51 made barely perceptible difference but seemed like an elegant, time-honored hot-rodders solution that was also a rip-off at 15,000 or whatever it was (I got a deal since it was part of GTS package.)
Thread Starter
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Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 1,350
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From: Australia
and the product description sheet. $7000 is a bargain in Porsche land - warranty plus full remap - plus 50Nm and 30HP across the the full rev range (not just the top end).
For me, it delivers the near perfect Porsche e.g. RWD, PDK, PASM, SC, PSE, RAS, PTV-E, "narrow" body with GTS power (peak 450HP) and torque (550Nm) plus interior designed to my taste and daily requirements
Whats not to like?
Banned
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 703
Likes: 7
From: Laguna, CA
Why is it called X51 instead of X50? X51 is the Powerkit that involves different intake manifold, heads, etc. X50 is the Powerkit that involves a pair of larger turbos, larger ICs and tuning maps to make the most of them. I've had both. X50 made more difference but seemed like a rip-off at 18,000 bucks. X51 made barely perceptible difference but seemed like an elegant, time-honored hot-rodders solution that was also a rip-off at 15,000 or whatever it was (I got a deal since it was part of GTS package.)
The 996 turbo X50 package included larger K24 turbos used on the GT2 and Turbo S. They offered much more headroom.
Racer
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 492
Likes: 132
From: RVA
Curious to know if 1) there is a core charge on the turbos requiring the buyer to return existing turbos as an exchange, and 2) if not required, what value could be placed on the used turbos in the parts world, and 3) are the turbos in the .2 universal or only applicable to Porsche, specifically, the 911?
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Drifting
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,467
Likes: 312
From: Midtown Atlanta
I think it's outstanding that they make the X51 for 7000+ dollars; the $17,895 extra the X50 cost on my 996TT (in 2002 dollars, no less) for the exact same thing that now costs 7500 2017 dollars was obviously a ripoff. And you only got 35hp out of it (although you got just shy of 50 lbsft of torque.)
While I'd never in a million years have considered dropping the $15k for normally aspirated X51 (the HP was nice but you got zero torks out of that kit), half that amount for real torque makes a lot of sense. And the X50 package on my 2002 TT? $24,751 in today's dollars
Porsche guys are stoopid.
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From: South Orange County
For what it is worth;
Dealer list on the GTS DME is $1150 or so
GTS Turbos are around $4500 per side
There does not seem to be any core / core information listed, so this is outright.
The X51 kit at $7500 is a bargain in my opinion.
Also all the hardware of the engine is the same between Base, S, and GTS. Whos to say we can't just order a GTS DME / pair of turbos, adapt the DME to the car, and call it a day? Why can't we just have a tuner flash their performance GTS software over the base or S ecu for even more power (with matching turbochargers)
Any strategies of cooling will be in the code for the S or GTS ecu, though the hardware is the same. This shouldn't matter.
991.2 Carrera, S, GTS turbos are specific to these cars, can't steal turbos from a different 911 or different generation.
Dealer list on the GTS DME is $1150 or so
GTS Turbos are around $4500 per side
There does not seem to be any core / core information listed, so this is outright.
The X51 kit at $7500 is a bargain in my opinion.
Also all the hardware of the engine is the same between Base, S, and GTS. Whos to say we can't just order a GTS DME / pair of turbos, adapt the DME to the car, and call it a day? Why can't we just have a tuner flash their performance GTS software over the base or S ecu for even more power (with matching turbochargers)
Any strategies of cooling will be in the code for the S or GTS ecu, though the hardware is the same. This shouldn't matter.
991.2 Carrera, S, GTS turbos are specific to these cars, can't steal turbos from a different 911 or different generation.
Banned
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 703
Likes: 7
From: Laguna, CA
Yes, I know, I had one. But I'm just saying, the X51 package has always involved a traditional hot-rodder approach to building an "all motor" hopped up car. The X50 has always involved throwing bigger turbos and ICs and SW onto a platform that already has turbos and ICs.
I think it's outstanding that they make the X51 for 7000+ dollars; the $17,895 extra the X50 cost on my 996TT (in 2002 dollars, no less) for the exact same thing that now costs 7500 2017 dollars was obviously a ripoff. And you only got 35hp out of it (although you got just shy of 50 lbsft of torque.)
While I'd never in a million years have considered dropping the $15k for normally aspirated X51 (the HP was nice but you got zero torks out of that kit), half that amount for real torque makes a lot of sense. And the X50 package on my 2002 TT? $24,751 in today's dollars Porsche guys are stoopid.
I think it's outstanding that they make the X51 for 7000+ dollars; the $17,895 extra the X50 cost on my 996TT (in 2002 dollars, no less) for the exact same thing that now costs 7500 2017 dollars was obviously a ripoff. And you only got 35hp out of it (although you got just shy of 50 lbsft of torque.)
While I'd never in a million years have considered dropping the $15k for normally aspirated X51 (the HP was nice but you got zero torks out of that kit), half that amount for real torque makes a lot of sense. And the X50 package on my 2002 TT? $24,751 in today's dollars
Porsche guys are stoopid.Not only is the X51 package an absurd value all the engines and intercoolers are the same. Porsche cutting costs and parts sharing works in our favor for once.
Banned
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 703
Likes: 7
From: Laguna, CA
For what it is worth;
Dealer list on the GTS DME is $1150 or so
GTS Turbos are around $4500 per side
There does not seem to be any core / core information listed, so this is outright.
The X51 kit at $7500 is a bargain in my opinion.
Also all the hardware of the engine is the same between Base, S, and GTS. Whos to say we can't just order a GTS DME / pair of turbos, adapt the DME to the car, and call it a day? Why can't we just have a tuner flash their performance GTS software over the base or S ecu for even more power (with matching turbochargers)
Any strategies of cooling will be in the code for the S or GTS ecu, though the hardware is the same. This shouldn't matter.
991.2 Carrera, S, GTS turbos are specific to these cars, can't steal turbos from a different 911 or different generation.
Dealer list on the GTS DME is $1150 or so
GTS Turbos are around $4500 per side
There does not seem to be any core / core information listed, so this is outright.
The X51 kit at $7500 is a bargain in my opinion.
Also all the hardware of the engine is the same between Base, S, and GTS. Whos to say we can't just order a GTS DME / pair of turbos, adapt the DME to the car, and call it a day? Why can't we just have a tuner flash their performance GTS software over the base or S ecu for even more power (with matching turbochargers)
Any strategies of cooling will be in the code for the S or GTS ecu, though the hardware is the same. This shouldn't matter.
991.2 Carrera, S, GTS turbos are specific to these cars, can't steal turbos from a different 911 or different generation.
I'll report on this ASAP.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 925
Likes: 385
From: Beni Makada District
Not sure - but it definitely says X51 on the invoice and the product description sheet.
$7000 is a bargain in Porsche land - warranty plus full remap - plus 50Nm and 30HP across the the full rev range (not just the top end).
For me, it delivers the near perfect Porsche e.g. RWD, PDK, PASM, SC, PSE, RAS, PTV-E, "narrow" body with GTS power (peak 450HP) and torque (550Nm) plus interior designed to my taste and daily requirements Whats not to like?
and the product description sheet. $7000 is a bargain in Porsche land - warranty plus full remap - plus 50Nm and 30HP across the the full rev range (not just the top end).
For me, it delivers the near perfect Porsche e.g. RWD, PDK, PASM, SC, PSE, RAS, PTV-E, "narrow" body with GTS power (peak 450HP) and torque (550Nm) plus interior designed to my taste and daily requirements
Whats not to like?
Banned
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 703
Likes: 7
From: Laguna, CA