How many 15-16 gt3's have engine replaced?
#2101
As compared to the GT3, there are less RS, they have less miles on average, and they have less track miles on average. So I don't think it can be concluded that they don't have similar engine issues just because less problems have been reported so far. This of course applies to the bubble-priced R as well, which has manual trans and therefore less protection against over-revs ...
My own GT3 has over 20K miles, and over 6K track miles. The engine hasn't failed yet, but that doesn't mean I don't have reason to be concerned that it will fail during the remaining warranty period. I'd expect to do a rebuild after the warranty ends (and had planned to keep the car for maybe 10+ years), but I don't see doing a rebuild during the warranty period as being reasonable, both because it would risk voiding the warranty and because I think the car should have designed to avoid the cost of a rebuild during the warranty period. I don't think heavily tracked 996 and 997 GT3s weren't routinely rebuilt during their warranty periods.
My own GT3 has over 20K miles, and over 6K track miles. The engine hasn't failed yet, but that doesn't mean I don't have reason to be concerned that it will fail during the remaining warranty period. I'd expect to do a rebuild after the warranty ends (and had planned to keep the car for maybe 10+ years), but I don't see doing a rebuild during the warranty period as being reasonable, both because it would risk voiding the warranty and because I think the car should have designed to avoid the cost of a rebuild during the warranty period. I don't think heavily tracked 996 and 997 GT3s weren't routinely rebuilt during their warranty periods.
#2102
That is certainly a significant enough number.
#2103
The RPMs don't drop at all during upshifts or downshifts. The computer holds the RPMs on upshifts and rev matches on downshifts. Also pdk comes with a dual mass flywheel which is very smooth.
The finger followers lose their DLC due to lack of lubrication and score the cam lobes.
The finger followers lose their DLC due to lack of lubrication and score the cam lobes.
#2104
Originally Posted by squid42
The lower rpm limit. Much of the wear and potential damage from higher rpm is based on kinetic energy, which is square to speed. So a reduction from 9000 to 8700 rpm means a reduction of 7% of all kinetic energy based on rpm.
That is certainly a significant enough number.
That is certainly a significant enough number.
#2105
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The lower rpm limit. Much of the wear and potential damage from higher rpm is based on kinetic energy, which is square to speed. So a reduction from 9000 to 8700 rpm means a reduction of 7% of all kinetic energy based on rpm.
That is certainly a significant enough number.
That is certainly a significant enough number.
#2106
The lower rpm limit. Much of the wear and potential damage from higher rpm is based on kinetic energy, which is square to speed. So a reduction from 9000 to 8700 rpm means a reduction of 7% of all kinetic energy based on rpm.
That is certainly a significant enough number.
That is certainly a significant enough number.
#2107
Regardless of the rebuild schedule, the GT3 engine is eating itself and this is why so many are failing. Finger followers in an engine should not show wear patterns, period...
Engines get rebuilt for ring seal, valve guides, chain guide/tensioner wear or bearing wear (bmw's rod bearings especially for this one).
The issue with the finger followers is well documented at this point and will only start to surface more, unfortunately...
Engines get rebuilt for ring seal, valve guides, chain guide/tensioner wear or bearing wear (bmw's rod bearings especially for this one).
The issue with the finger followers is well documented at this point and will only start to surface more, unfortunately...
Seems each generation from my reading has had issues with terminal failures. The 991 E & F are not alone. Again, they are remedied by PAG and in most cases represent a very small % of total engines. In fact with the E's they replaced all engines even though only a small number failed.
PAG is very protective of their "rep". Rightfully so. These cars are still amazing and predominate at local tracks compared to other high end performance machines for a reason.
#2108
Doesn't the RS have the same bore, but longer stroke? For the same rpm, longer stroke means higher piston speed, so you have to do some math to see how the kinetic energy, stresses, etc. compare when considering both rpm and stroke. I recall this being discussed previously in RL, with the conclusion that GT3 and RS have the same max piston speed.
#2109
#2110
Doesn't the RS have the same bore, but longer stroke? For the same rpm, longer stroke means higher piston speed, so you have to do some math to see how the kinetic energy, stresses, etc. compare when considering both rpm and stroke. I recall this being discussed previously in RL, with the conclusion that GT3 and RS have the same max piston speed.
But the speed of the cam lobe "rubbing" on the finger follower? I bet that whatever is doing the damage there (heat, or stress from repeated impact) is proportional to the square of rpm.
I also wonder about the speed with which the valves move. Valve opening speed should be increasing proportional to rpm increase (which means kinetic energy of the valve is square of rpm). Valve closing speed on the other hand is instead driven by the spring and will not depend on rpm.
I didn't think this through but is it possible that the valve behaves a bit like it is wedged (of course it isn't actually wedged, but something that makes it resist more). And the finger follower presses down on it when it isn't ready to do so when rpms are high?
That is one reason why I would like to get my flippers on a damaged finger follower. I think some easy to do analysis would make us able to tell whether the primary damaging factor is from heat (with normal force and impulse) or from abnormal force. For starters the former would undo some of the annealing. Of course we'd first have to see whether the steel used there is annealed originally. There are reasons why it might not. Those steel geeks can go on and on about that forever.
#2111
I wonder how much of this is related to the time the engine spends at 8000-9000 rpm as compared to a manual car. Some tracks/drivers may result in a lot of time running at high rpms whereas one would have downshifted a manual car earlier or before a corner previously. The pdk makes it much easier to stay around 8500rpm without worrying about hitting the cutoff or miss-shifting. I wonder if Porsche didn't test on shorter high rpm tracks and under-tested this scenario.
Has anyone driven older and current GT3's on the same track and noticed where the average rpms are?
Has anyone driven older and current GT3's on the same track and noticed where the average rpms are?
#2112
I am looking to purchase a 2014 GT3 with 3175 miles. PCNA said the engine was swapped at the hub before delivery to the first owner. Serial has it as a "E" motor. Car has CPO for another 3 years +/-. Should I pass on this car or is it likely fine with the motor swap? I did not read the entire 141 page thread but these motors going up are concerning for long term ownership.
#2115
With CPO warranty, go for it.
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Dundon Motorsports
Gig Harbor, WA
253-200-4454
jamie@dundonmotorsports.com
www.dundonmotorsports.com
Facebook.com/dundonmotorsports
Instagram @dundon_motorsports