New PCCB and Track days – Facts Feedback Thread
#361
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Will do, I am interested in comparing them on the track -- next day is May 16th. Only have about 50 miles on them so far, not fully bedded in and I can notice it. I've heard all positives from those that run the same car with the steel brakes -- I'll post my opinion.
#365
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After 14,750 total miles and almost 2,100 track miles I decided to switch to the 380 mm OEM cast iron brakes -- the cost, including labor and all OEM components including the red calipers, was less than the cost of two ceramic front rotors.
After we removed the PCCBs from the car, we did a very thorough check of all components and carefully read the carbon density -- the results surprised me and are not entirely consistent with other posts on this thread -- essentially the front rotors had 80% remaining life and the rears had about 85%. Admittedly I am not hard are the brakes and take care to cool them after every track session, and about 2/3s of the track miles were at Lime Rock which is not particularly hard on beds (in my opinion). The car is a 2015 GT3.
After we removed the PCCBs from the car, we did a very thorough check of all components and carefully read the carbon density -- the results surprised me and are not entirely consistent with other posts on this thread -- essentially the front rotors had 80% remaining life and the rears had about 85%. Admittedly I am not hard are the brakes and take care to cool them after every track session, and about 2/3s of the track miles were at Lime Rock which is not particularly hard on beds (in my opinion). The car is a 2015 GT3.
I also am considering replacing my PCCB with OEM steel brakes before the PCCB rotors wear to much.
What do Porsche dealerships consider the lowest % wear on PCCB rotors that they would accept for a trade in and resell?
#366
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
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You cannot just switch to OEM Iron brakes. You also need to change cailpers if you want to run 380mm disks (my understanding).
I looked into this before and the easiest way was to swap to 410mm Iron disks so the yellow calipers would still fit perfectly. Girodisc and RB do sell direct replacement 410mm disks.
Hope this help.
Cheers
Pierre
#367
Former Vendor
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That's correct. Both the rotor diameter and offset are different between pccb and standard brakes.
RB has been shipping iron replacement rotors for pccb more than a year now. Click below links for our new low price.
Iron Replacement:
Iron rotors (410/390mm) replacement:
http://www.racingbrake.com/RB-Iron-R...por-irk-03.htm
We also offer iron rotor compatible brake pads for street and track to fit yellow calipers.
Complete iron brake kit (19" wheels) : 380/380mm rotors with RB 6/4 pot calipers
http://www.racingbrake.com/RB-Iron-R...por-irk-03.htm
Complete iron brake kit (20"+ wheels): 410/390mm rotors with RB 6/4 pot calipers
http://www.racingbrake.com/RB-Calipe...por-irp-01.htm
RB Calipers are with open top for easy pad change - A caliper made for track easy.
CCM Replacement:
If you like pccb and are concerned of the replacement cost, consider the following options:
410/390mm rotors only - Discs made by Surface Transforms/UK for a bolt on installation to yellow pccb calipers.
info@racingbrake.com
Tel: 714-871-6392
RB has been shipping iron replacement rotors for pccb more than a year now. Click below links for our new low price.
Iron Replacement:
Iron rotors (410/390mm) replacement:
http://www.racingbrake.com/RB-Iron-R...por-irk-03.htm
We also offer iron rotor compatible brake pads for street and track to fit yellow calipers.
Complete iron brake kit (19" wheels) : 380/380mm rotors with RB 6/4 pot calipers
http://www.racingbrake.com/RB-Iron-R...por-irk-03.htm
Complete iron brake kit (20"+ wheels): 410/390mm rotors with RB 6/4 pot calipers
http://www.racingbrake.com/RB-Calipe...por-irp-01.htm
RB Calipers are with open top for easy pad change - A caliper made for track easy.
CCM Replacement:
If you like pccb and are concerned of the replacement cost, consider the following options:
410/390mm rotors only - Discs made by Surface Transforms/UK for a bolt on installation to yellow pccb calipers.
http://www.racingbrake.com/RB-CCM-Re...por-crk-01.htm
RB/ST CCM-X replacement discs which are made of continuous fiber and are much stronger and durable than factory pccb, not only they cost 1/2 of dealer cost but they are re-furbishable, costing less than iron ring replacement.
Complete RB-CCM brake kit (394/390mm)* - Discs are same as ZR1 made by Brembo.RB/ST CCM-X replacement discs which are made of continuous fiber and are much stronger and durable than factory pccb, not only they cost 1/2 of dealer cost but they are re-furbishable, costing less than iron ring replacement.
http://www.racingbrake.com/RB-CCB-Sy...ccb-por-01.htm
They may not last as long as RB/ST rotors but the replacement cost is so low (~$1200-$1600)/ea that you don't even have to consider refurbishing them (just like Corvette owners).
*Upgrade to ST discs are available for 394/390mm brake kit.
Compatible brake pads for CCM are available:They may not last as long as RB/ST rotors but the replacement cost is so low (~$1200-$1600)/ea that you don't even have to consider refurbishing them (just like Corvette owners).
*Upgrade to ST discs are available for 394/390mm brake kit.
- Street only - RB XT910
- In between - ZR1 OE pads
- Track only - RB sintered pads
info@racingbrake.com
Tel: 714-871-6392
#368
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Pierre & RB folks, thanks for the info on PCCB rotor replacement. I have been looking at options of replacing the the PCCB rotors only with iron, or changing the brakes to the 380mm standard rotors and calipers as I understand was done by NMM991.
The timing of when to switch the PCCB to iron is what I will have to figure out. I would like to have enough PCCB rotor life remaining so that I have the option of trading the car in and not have the dealer adjust the trade in value for having to replace the PCCB rotors prior to resale.
The timing of when to switch the PCCB to iron is what I will have to figure out. I would like to have enough PCCB rotor life remaining so that I have the option of trading the car in and not have the dealer adjust the trade in value for having to replace the PCCB rotors prior to resale.
#369
Former Vendor
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Understood people have their own plans in regard to how they would use or preserve their brakes, but the good news is RB offers both set up (pccb or iron*) and we make the choice available at any time in case your plan has a change.
*We will soon be releasing 394/390 iron rotor kit which is fully compatible with our RCCB kits (with ZR1 rotors) so you can seamlessly swap between CCM rotors and iron rotors anytime you want - Unlike OE they are two separate set up between pccb and standard iron brake.
*We will soon be releasing 394/390 iron rotor kit which is fully compatible with our RCCB kits (with ZR1 rotors) so you can seamlessly swap between CCM rotors and iron rotors anytime you want - Unlike OE they are two separate set up between pccb and standard iron brake.
#370
Instructor
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What pads are you using? I found pagid RS29 & Girodisc setup to be extremely durable and they would easily work without fade, my tyres (cup 2s) would always overheat first on my 997.2 GT3
#371
#372
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On the race track, the cast iron brakes did not bite as well on the initial braking (hard brake followed by a modulating trail brake) as the PCCBs, the difference to me was pretty significant. However, the overall effectiveness of the brakes was very similar, the cast irons just didn't have the same feel -- very subjective. The cast iron stopped/slowed the car very effectively.
I am using the stock pads for the initial changeover. I will explore options, will look for a slightly more aggressive track pad that is still very useable on the street (and dust free -- good luck!). Hope this helps.
The Racing Brake option (RB/ST CCM-X replacement discs) might be a good one to consider -- up front cost is probably the equivalent of what I paid for the OEM cast iron components (same as Suncoast pricing). But I have not seen much feedback.
#373
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On the race track, the cast iron brakes did not bite as well on the initial braking (hard brake followed by a modulating trail brake) as the PCCBs, the difference to me was pretty significant. However, the overall effectiveness of the brakes was very similar, the cast irons just didn't have the same feel -- very subjective. The cast iron stopped/slowed the car very effectively.
Before I got my GT3, I had a car from another brand, with steel rotors, and brakes had a really high amount of initial-bite compared to GT3's steel brakes.
I'm not saying that PCCB don't have a better initial bite, but that the "brake pressure calibration" is probably the main factor of this feeling.
#374
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I read somewhere that the PCCB brakes have a different "modulation" on how the force is applied. If you put the same pedal pressure on PCCB and steel brakes, the force applied on PCCB rotors will be higher.
Before I got my GT3, I had a car from another brand, with steel rotors, and brakes had a really high amount of initial-bite compared to GT3's steel brakes.
I'm not saying that PCCB don't have a better initial bite, but that the "brake pressure calibration" is probably the main factor of this feeling.
Before I got my GT3, I had a car from another brand, with steel rotors, and brakes had a really high amount of initial-bite compared to GT3's steel brakes.
I'm not saying that PCCB don't have a better initial bite, but that the "brake pressure calibration" is probably the main factor of this feeling.
#375
Former Vendor
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I read somewhere that the PCCB brakes have a different "modulation" on how the force is applied. If you put the same pedal pressure on PCCB and steel brakes, the force applied on PCCB rotors will be higher.
Before I got my GT3, I had a car from another brand, with steel rotors, and brakes had a really high amount of initial-bite compared to GT3's steel brakes.
I'm not saying that PCCB don't have a better initial bite, but that the "brake pressure calibration" is probably the main factor of this feeling.
Before I got my GT3, I had a car from another brand, with steel rotors, and brakes had a really high amount of initial-bite compared to GT3's steel brakes.
I'm not saying that PCCB don't have a better initial bite, but that the "brake pressure calibration" is probably the main factor of this feeling.
RB has developed the sintered brake pad which is a 100% metallic compound dedicated for CCM track use. They have been tested in both GTR and Corvette track communities with very satisfactory result, but they are made for ZR1 CCM set up only - Available as in RB-CCM brake kit*.
http://www.racingbrake.com/RB-CCB-Sy...ccb-por-01.htm
We would love to have 991 GT3 track drivers try this set up and compare to factory pccb and iron replacement option, which is what's lacking in Porsche community - Although we have shipped several pccb replacement rotors (ST discs), but we don't get a direct feedback how they compare to pccb.
Main advantage of this kit is the discs are standard Corvette C7 CCM rotors so replacement cost are easily available, and cost is very affordable that you don't even have to consider refurbishing, and they last longer than iron rotors we know this by facts as we offer iron replacement but very few ZR1 owners are replacing them...