therise

I too would be very interested in a kit for an 89 S2, waiting for a check to come in to purchase it at the moment but horsepower and torque gains like that for the price seem pretty damn reasonable.

H2

Raj,

As you know, this is what Carl does for a living...and this kit is just an adaptation of many other successful units that he's made. Once you do a couple dozen, most of the trial and error is behind you. I'm intrigued but want to know more about the strength of the system and all its parts as it fits on this particular car, the 968.

I've seen some of the early twin-screw systems on 928s and there were some pretty flimsy workarounds. I'm guessing all those have been worked out. BTW, none of those tht I've seen were Carl's kits. I've not seen one of his on a car yet but would like to and may travel just to do so.

When details come out and I find out more, I should have a CD maturing at about that time and would be in a position to buy. I'm interested.

H2

Rich Sandor

Carl, is the current tested setup running the injectors at MAXIMUM output? Can the kit be sold, at the same price, with a higher boost setting?

I'm very impressed with everything that you are doing, but at the end of the day, I cannot justify spending $5400cdn to get 50hp, even considering the overall increase is useable power gains.

I would be more likely to buy the kit at that price if I could run it at higher boost settings to make more power. I have a little more faith in the stock 968 internals than most people.

savvas944

it should be appreciated , that Carl has spend so much time to develop a kit that would give a hike over of what has been available so far, which is not much .only upgraded chips and filters.and a bit more pressure at the injectors.which may have worked to 10-12 usd /bhp.

Arguably a projected cost of 4,400 usd without shipping for extra 50 BHP works about, about 88 usd /bhp
and it is close to a conversion cost of the 968 3 litre TURBO ENGINE including donor turbo parts and brand new 104 mm turbo pistons and rings, std k26 /8 OR BIGGER TURBO(NEW)AND S/H INTERCOOLER.,plus heliarc the turbo manifold to the 968 manifold, and new dme/klr chips.

i have done such a conversion on an engine here, and the costs were just over 5,000 usd including an engine rebuilt kit from the states.the engine has been tested on a 944 turbo 1989, and the car can run neck to neck with 911 GT3 .,with a conservative 350 BHP at the wheels ., with tremendous torque curve.
After seeing that ,i am just wondering if it is more rewarding and cost efficient tp go the way of a turbo RS
replica, rather spending 4,400 usd plus extra 300 usd est shipping ,for a bolt on kit , which in my opinion will give an extra 30 h.p over a good chip and air filter job., on a car worth 8000 to 11.000 usd.

now if this nice kit was more cost effective, the niche can work and perhaps a lot of 968 owners could see it that way too. At this stage personally i dont.

Obviously a price is made up from the basic cost ,mark up and on the projected sales.
iF a group buy is organised , perhaps could it be beneficial to you , to offer say a signifigant discount
as a whole for the production run.

Just thinking out loud.

Carl Fausett

Rich,

Before I suggest dropping a pulley size to get more boost, I'd intercool the unit instead. The cooler intake air temp is more dense and HP goes up as a result - without adding more PSI.
I would try that first, its safer.

Yes, the Raptor we used in this application is certainly capable of more, we use it to feed 5.0 Liter Porsche 928's. You can see it is making boost at 2700 rpm already, so it has plenty of capacity for this engine.

So, in theory, we could rop a pulley size, increase injectors to 24, 30 or 40 lb hr, intercooler it, and go again. I would expect results to be about 40 HP higher.

(PS: we know from experience with the LH-Jetronic system that it will accept 24 lb and 30 lb injectors in substitute for the OEM 19 lb units without modification. No changes. The largest injector a LH-Jet will take without a re-tune is about a 40 lb injector)

Rich Sandor

The one thing you need to understand coming from the 928 world, is that a lot of 968 guys have 944 turbo background. And when you can buy a bolt-on vitesse kit for $4000 which makes ~340rwhp/340rwtrq on a 2.5L engine.. well... it kinda makes one wonder why they would spend $4300 for only 255/255 - out of an engine that's bigger to begin with!

Now, I don't need for anyone to explain WHY this is the case, I'm just saying that it's hard to see the value when you start comparing to other options.

I want to re-iterate that I'm really impressed with the kit, and I'm still considering it, I'd even guinea pig it, but I just want more hp for my money. And I would be hesitant to spend an extra $500 on bigger injectors, or $500 on fabbing an intercooler setup, only to find a small hp increase. (although I was kind of expecting that these would be necessary to get 100+hp/trq improvement, anyways.)

I'm still excited and keen on reading the reports. Keep up the awesome work Carl!!!

H2

You may "951-ize" the 968 for under $5K but you'll never really achieve the performance of the factory 968 turbo. not even close. I'm guessing that Carl's supercharger will be a nice compromise. No? And, if you want to go further with intercooler, etc, that's an option for you.

I'd like to see the 968 considerably outperform the 951. This would be possible with Carl's kit, eh?

H2

Eric_Oz_S2

Personally, I think the kit is pretty good value. I would spend another $300 on a used 951 intercooler (or other make that would fit) and maybe $200 on some used 951 injectors. I'm sure you could get +100hp in this case. I don't see the argument of putting a 951 engine in a 968 (or S2 for that matter) - as in my opinion you would then just buy a 951 wouldn't you?

The kit is about improving what is available with a minimum amount of work and with no changes to the internals.

To me it seems good value. If there was such a kit (albeit with an intercooler) for an S2 - count me in (hint hint Carl).

Miles968

Hats off to Carl!! It looks like a great set-up at a reasonable price too! I have been around long enough to see other mods come and go. Our cars are difficult to extract additional hp from. I don't think Porcshe 'left much on the bench". I seriously doubt you could come close to the cost with a turbo conversion even doing all the labor yourself. Let alone the time difference of a bolt-on mod vs a complete rebuild of the engine from piston compression up/out! I think the supercharger is going to be a great kick in the pants bang for the buck our aging cars could use!

All the best, just my 2 cents,




ps. I do think you can come close or even excede the factory turbo specs but it wasn't cheap or easy in my case.................

Jfrahm

This seems like a good value to me. I do not know where people are getting 3.0 turbo setups for similar money. A 2.5l turbo conversion might be done for $5k if you bought a donor car and did all the work yourself. A lot of work. A 3.0l turbo or for that matter a v8 conversion is more like $10k if you do some serious scrounging and lots of labor, to $20k for most people.

What I like about this kit is that it's easy and upgradeable in the future. Intercooling, chips, injectors, E85, etc. you could head for 350HP over the next few years.

-Joel.

Damian in NJ

Actually, factory 968 Turbo S cars were limited in boost, and hp was only 305-most everyone I've seen who's done a conversion are above that.

Moook

First off. Well done Carl on getting this "kit" together so fast...

My only negative would be to say that in my eyes this kit needs to produce 300bhp or slightly more to make it worthwhile, for me at least.
My car is currently producing just over 250bhp. + i have a RR graph to prove...This is with just a few "usual" mods + a live mapped RR car...
Now if i was to bolt on this kit, would i get significantly more.??????
I personaly think these cars would be FAB with 300+bhp..[Reliable] that is...

Eric_Oz_S2

As I suggested earlier - add an intercooler, bigger injectors and (maybe) different pully if that is what you want. Maybe you could ask for the kit to be supplied without the pully and you could source your own smaller version. Used turbo injectors are cheap, used 951 intercooler are cheap (if you can get it to fit). New intercoolers are cheap ($300).

I'd add at least an intercooler anyway - cheap extra hp.

Mark944na86

That, I suspect, is going to be non-trivial.

I'll be very interested to see what your experiments yield, however.

H2

An affordable supercharger is some of the best 968 news I've heard since getting my car. Just adding B&B pipes, boring holes in the airbox, and plugging in a performance chip is not enough. I agree though, that 300HP would be wonderful. But it sounds like it may be attainable at some point.

To turborize the 928 engine is really pricey if done right.

H2