Did Porsche detuned the 951? Or it was fate? Article inside
08-28-2013, 02:20 PM
#46
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I didn't compare anything, i just posted a magazine article, i personally would not compare the two, why would you conpare the 951 to a beetle or a v8 sedan?
This does bring back memories.
I remember from the automotive press in the early 80’s that Porsche was going for the more modern water-cooled front engine designs and would fade out the rear engine behind the wheels design, which (mostly European) auto journalists had declared dangerous.
Porsche apparently was unaware that the US customers had fallen in love with the 911 looks, so the front engine cars never sold in the numbers they had expected.
Maybe the pricing was part of an attempt to phase the 944T out, since it ended up costing nearly $50k, which in today’s dollars is $94k.
To my eyes the 944T is one of the best looking German cars. My 944T still gets stares and the occasional thumbs up by many owners of modern Porsches.
Laust
I remember from the automotive press in the early 80’s that Porsche was going for the more modern water-cooled front engine designs and would fade out the rear engine behind the wheels design, which (mostly European) auto journalists had declared dangerous.
Porsche apparently was unaware that the US customers had fallen in love with the 911 looks, so the front engine cars never sold in the numbers they had expected.
Maybe the pricing was part of an attempt to phase the 944T out, since it ended up costing nearly $50k, which in today’s dollars is $94k.
To my eyes the 944T is one of the best looking German cars. My 944T still gets stares and the occasional thumbs up by many owners of modern Porsches.
Laust
08-28-2013, 02:42 PM
#47
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It has come down to marketing and perception. Often not very successful cars when new become super desired and collectible on the secondary markets.
The 911 has traits people expect and want to purchase. At the time of the front engine series, the 911 was a complex car to manufacture and retained antiquated technology and pedals mounted to the center, but loaded with what we now call "charm."
In fact, many 951 owners do the same thing when comparing their car to newer Porsches or other cars. Look at the old EFI versus carb debates. Some people seek out older technology. That "charm" is why nowadays people will shun newer cars for antiquated technology in pursuit of a "primal driving experience."
The 944 or 928 series in the 80s was a much more modern and daily livable car (EFI, better HVAC, more cargo space, power steering). For instanced, what year did the 911/930 turbo go EFI over CIS? I think a 930 did not get a 5 speed until 1989. And, air-cooled engines have been gone now for 15 years.
What is with the derogatory references to Volkswagen? That is a part of the debate I do not understand. VW and Porsche have been intertwined since the onset of Porsche. Now, VW owns Porsche (which could be a good thing to eliminate some of the model/mission creep).
In terms of the 951, it seems it was handicapped out of the factory. And, kudos to those that pick up on the fact the Cayman is positioned too perfectly in terms of performance with the model line-up.
Honestly, I always wanted a turbo Porsche and now that I have the 951 my lust for a 930 is diminished completely. However, I consider my 951 more akin to a 911 Carrera than a 930. The 930 is a beautiful, elegant, and terrific car; however, my 951 fits me better (and I like the 951 driving position better, centered pedals are not my thing). I love to drive and the 951 is a great, great ROI on that front. And, I am thankful for the too old to be new, but too new to be old design of the car. There is no interest by me to deal with CIS/carbs, head studs, bad A/C, heat exchangers, thermal reactors, dual plugs, and yadda. The best air-cooled 911s out there seem to be a mis-mash of air cooled parts, not as left the factory cars. I love my 86 951 stock, fuchs included, period.
The 911 has traits people expect and want to purchase. At the time of the front engine series, the 911 was a complex car to manufacture and retained antiquated technology and pedals mounted to the center, but loaded with what we now call "charm."
In fact, many 951 owners do the same thing when comparing their car to newer Porsches or other cars. Look at the old EFI versus carb debates. Some people seek out older technology. That "charm" is why nowadays people will shun newer cars for antiquated technology in pursuit of a "primal driving experience."
The 944 or 928 series in the 80s was a much more modern and daily livable car (EFI, better HVAC, more cargo space, power steering). For instanced, what year did the 911/930 turbo go EFI over CIS? I think a 930 did not get a 5 speed until 1989. And, air-cooled engines have been gone now for 15 years.
What is with the derogatory references to Volkswagen? That is a part of the debate I do not understand. VW and Porsche have been intertwined since the onset of Porsche. Now, VW owns Porsche (which could be a good thing to eliminate some of the model/mission creep).
In terms of the 951, it seems it was handicapped out of the factory. And, kudos to those that pick up on the fact the Cayman is positioned too perfectly in terms of performance with the model line-up.
Honestly, I always wanted a turbo Porsche and now that I have the 951 my lust for a 930 is diminished completely. However, I consider my 951 more akin to a 911 Carrera than a 930. The 930 is a beautiful, elegant, and terrific car; however, my 951 fits me better (and I like the 951 driving position better, centered pedals are not my thing). I love to drive and the 951 is a great, great ROI on that front. And, I am thankful for the too old to be new, but too new to be old design of the car. There is no interest by me to deal with CIS/carbs, head studs, bad A/C, heat exchangers, thermal reactors, dual plugs, and yadda. The best air-cooled 911s out there seem to be a mis-mash of air cooled parts, not as left the factory cars. I love my 86 951 stock, fuchs included, period.
08-28-2013, 03:52 PM
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as to many of my 951/944 collection of books one rings a bell how it talked about the 951 being a big mistake for Porsche. Since it was just to good for the money. it went on to talk about how they should have done like the boxster and leave it as the 944 S being the top model and not a Turbo.
08-28-2013, 04:03 PM
#50
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08-28-2013, 05:02 PM
#51
as to many of my 951/944 collection of books one rings a bell how it talked about the 951 being a big mistake for Porsche. Since it was just to good for the money. it went on to talk about how they should have done like the boxster and leave it as the 944 S being the top model and not a Turbo.
08-28-2013, 05:22 PM
#53
Three Wheelin'
08-28-2013, 06:00 PM
#55
Drifting
No offence taken, I dont know this 928 guy but it seemed like you took a snap at his bait
08-28-2013, 06:42 PM
#56
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Sadly many 944s found for sale in the UK and mainland Europe are complete rust buckets... I am sure they fare much better in the dry Cali climate. However, just like the E30 M3 and the Lancia Delta Integralle or 964, they rust quite badly when living in the damp Western European air or driven on Europe's salted roads in the Winter... Or is that not true again and you know better than us? And one of the main reason 944Ts start at less than $4k in the UK for dogs?
924 was developed by porsche and was one of the most famous designs of harm lagaay, the same guy that was a part of design team for 911, and designed 968, 993, Boxster, Cayenne, 996, Carrera GT.
I bought one "wrong side steering wheel" 44 turbo from UK, and with it I got porsche service invoices for last 10 or so years. Sum of those invoices for 10 years is more than 50k pounds. No major work either. Not exactly 4k.
08-28-2013, 08:12 PM
#57
Drifting
They resist rust for a long time but add salt and rust they will eventually. That's why I bought a garage queen and I try not to use it in the wet and definitely not when there's salt on the roads.
08-28-2013, 08:43 PM
#58
08-28-2013, 09:38 PM
#59
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soltino my friend have you replaced the fuel lines in your 944?
08-28-2013, 10:11 PM
#60
