Gain 100HP with an intake manifold change?? - Cross post from Ferrari Chat
03-21-2016, 06:54 PM
#286
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Just need a ~6L factory big-block intake from something with exactly the same ports. spacing and angles. Tuned for the cam timing and oprating torque range that you want. Fitted up for the injectors you want to use. Short enough to fit under the hood. Able to work with the already perfectly programmed engine management system you will be using. It would be nice if the vacuum hoses plugged right in. And the throttle cable were long enough to reach to wherever the throttle ends up. And fits over the existing coolant piping, block web/bracing. And came in already anodized in cool performance purple, but with a big Porsche shield on it. So all you'd needed to do is wallow out some boltholes with the cordless drill, hammer it in to place a little, and bolt this wonder-piece right on for the 100+ HP boost it gave the donor car it was designed for. And it's only $30!
Damn.... Did you guys just see that???? A pig flew by!
Damn.... Did you guys just see that???? A pig flew by!
03-21-2016, 07:05 PM
#287
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Just need a ~6L factory big-block intake from something with exactly the same ports. spacing and angles. Tuned for the cam timing and oprating torque range that you want. Fitted up for the injectors you want to use. Short enough to fit under the hood. Able to work with the programmable engine management system you will be using. It would be nice if the vacuum hoses plugged right in. And the throttle cable were long enough to reach to wherever the throttle ends up. And fits over the existing coolant piping, block web/bracing. And came in already anodized in cool performance purple, but with a big Porsche shield on it. So all you'd needed to do is wallow out some boltholes with the cordless drill, hammer it in to place a little, and bolt this wonder-piece right on for the 100+ HP boost it gave the donor car it was designed for. And it's only $30!
Damn.... Did you guys just see that???? A pig flew by!
Damn.... Did you guys just see that???? A pig flew by!
im betting you can bolt something over the stock TB and "U" area and bolt it right to carls big plenum and feed his lower manifolds. guaranteed some big HP. sure, we might loose some mid range to low torque, but that comes with the territory, unless you want it to be a street/race bolt on. but bigger is better and that's what you will get with one of the off the shelf intakes and/ or something Carl can fab up in his shop! I got a mustang intake that i might be able to cut up and mate to carl's stuff. the problem is the runners have to take some type of adapter to seal well. i like carls set up a lot more , but it has to be set up for a more stock bolt on approach. I think it can be done!
existing throttle cable, TB and MAF (maybe enlarged too). stock injector set up, but using the 30lb injectors that im already using. (too big for my hp now, but perfect for 450rwhp ). tweak with RRFR and mixture is between 12 and 12.5 from 4500 to 6500rpm and thats good enough for me!
I want to keep it SIMPLE and i think that is the best way
03-21-2016, 07:18 PM
#289
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i dont think its that complicated. forget about operational range, cam timing, etc. any big 500hp intake will work. Greg already proved that on the GT. wrong runners, first pass, nothing right as he said. still made 60hp.
im betting you can bolt something over the stock TB and "U" area and bolt it right to carls big plenum and feed his lower manifolds. guaranteed some big HP. sure, we might loose some mid range to low torque, but that comes with the territory, unless you want it to be a street/race bolt on. but bigger is better and that's what you will get with one of the off the shelf intakes and/ or something Carl can fab up in his shop! I got a mustang intake that i might be able to cut up and mate to carl's stuff. the problem is the runners have to take some type of adapter to seal well. i like carls set up a lot more , but it has to be set up for a more stock bolt on approach. I think it can be done!
existing throttle cable, TB and MAF (maybe enlarged too). stock injector set up, but using the 30lb injectors that im already using. (too big for my hp now, but perfect for 450rwhp ). tweak with RRFR and mixture is between 12 and 12.5 from 4500 to 6500rpm and thats good enough for me!
I want to keep it SIMPLE and i think that is the best way
im betting you can bolt something over the stock TB and "U" area and bolt it right to carls big plenum and feed his lower manifolds. guaranteed some big HP. sure, we might loose some mid range to low torque, but that comes with the territory, unless you want it to be a street/race bolt on. but bigger is better and that's what you will get with one of the off the shelf intakes and/ or something Carl can fab up in his shop! I got a mustang intake that i might be able to cut up and mate to carl's stuff. the problem is the runners have to take some type of adapter to seal well. i like carls set up a lot more , but it has to be set up for a more stock bolt on approach. I think it can be done!
existing throttle cable, TB and MAF (maybe enlarged too). stock injector set up, but using the 30lb injectors that im already using. (too big for my hp now, but perfect for 450rwhp ). tweak with RRFR and mixture is between 12 and 12.5 from 4500 to 6500rpm and thats good enough for me!
I want to keep it SIMPLE and i think that is the best way
If it's that simple, then DO IT! You certainly don't need anyone's permission here. Decide what kind of "Adapters" you need, and have them made. Then bolt on your inake and let us know if it made the numbers you expect. With no other changes, so you can track the changes to just what's caused by the intake.
It's really sad that the engine design group at Porsche was forced to take what was such a promising 8-horns intake and shrink the runners so much. On purpose. Just so their flagship performance car wouldn't be faster than their other flagship performance car.
Or you could go with the proven method used by the current bunch of Euro V8 performance cars. ITB's. Differing runner and bell dimensions for broader power band. MAP and throttle-position sensors. Better and multiple intake temp sensors. A slightly more, um, comprehensive engine management package. Variable valve timing. COP ignition.
Start another list!
03-21-2016, 07:22 PM
#290
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Like anything in life, constant repetition makes up for skill.
I think you turn respectable laps times in your small pond of tracks you've turned a zillion laps at. That doesn't make you a great driver....just a practiced driver.
Mark Anderson could go to any track in the country and turn respectable laps times, with-in one practice session.
He's a great driver.
The sad thing is that your ego, swimming around in your tiny ponds, blurs reality.
If you can come down to Willow, with your brand new tires, and turn 1:25's....like you should (without killing yourself, blowing up the engine, or crashing the car) then you will have credibility.
Of course, like your previous visits to Willow, they will be timing your lap times with an egg timer. However, I'm sure reality will once again be trumped by your ego....and you will rationalize your inevitable failure with some lame excuse.
You are a medium fish in a tiny pond.....not even a big fish. Always have been. Always will be. Get over it.
Back to ignore and peaceful bliss....I'll pay more attention to your distortions of reality, when you get to Willow!
I think you turn respectable laps times in your small pond of tracks you've turned a zillion laps at. That doesn't make you a great driver....just a practiced driver.
Mark Anderson could go to any track in the country and turn respectable laps times, with-in one practice session.
He's a great driver.
The sad thing is that your ego, swimming around in your tiny ponds, blurs reality.
If you can come down to Willow, with your brand new tires, and turn 1:25's....like you should (without killing yourself, blowing up the engine, or crashing the car) then you will have credibility.
Of course, like your previous visits to Willow, they will be timing your lap times with an egg timer. However, I'm sure reality will once again be trumped by your ego....and you will rationalize your inevitable failure with some lame excuse.
You are a medium fish in a tiny pond.....not even a big fish. Always have been. Always will be. Get over it.
Back to ignore and peaceful bliss....I'll pay more attention to your distortions of reality, when you get to Willow!
since you are not an athlete and ive coached a few of the great ones after my time in the sun.... i can safely and credibly say its not hours and hours of practice, its hours and hours of perfect practice.
Mark and i in the same car, ran the same lap times. its a fact.
and it would be that way at any track around, that we haven't gone too.
in fact, i turned faster times in my S4 than he ran running Tilo's blower 928 at buttonwillow, near my first time there! ran as fast as him at the same weight and tires, with 125 less hp at Laguna seca. I even posted the side to side video for you for the same general time period, not many years later as you said.
Now, you are the expert and suddenly, you think i should be running 1:25 at willow springs when the "yard stick" Mark anderson's best lap is a 1:24.1? and on slicks, after running there over and over for 25 years? with 200more HP? . why dont you tell me what these mods are worth at willow springs vs what i have:
1. slicks vs DOTs
2. 4" wider track front and rear
3. bigger wing and huge splitter
4. motons
5. 200 more HP
you are showing a huge lack of racing common sense if you think all those mods are not worth more than 1 second. (with no difference in driver)
you figure out what mark would run without all these mods and ill run that time.
im guessing all that is worth about 4 seconds. 2 for the tires alone and 2 for the HP, and thats being WAY more than fair.
come out there to willow springs may 15th.... ill be out there for the racing weekend in that little "pond".
03-21-2016, 07:29 PM
#291
Rennlist Member
If it's that simple, then DO IT! You certainly don't need anyone's permission here. Decide what kind of "Adapters" you need, and have them made. Then bolt on your inake and let us know if it made the numbers you expect. With no other changes, so you can track the changes to just what's caused by the intake.
It's really sad that the engine design group at Porsche was forced to take what was such a promising 8-horns intake and shrink the runners so much. On purpose. Just so their flagship performance car wouldn't be faster than their other flagship performance car.
Or you could go with the proven method used by the current bunch of Euro V8 performance cars. ITB's. Differing runner and bell dimensions for broader power band. MAP and throttle-position sensors. Better and multiple intake temp sensors. A slightly more, um, comprehensive engine management package. Variable valve timing. COP ignition.
Start another list!
It's really sad that the engine design group at Porsche was forced to take what was such a promising 8-horns intake and shrink the runners so much. On purpose. Just so their flagship performance car wouldn't be faster than their other flagship performance car.
Or you could go with the proven method used by the current bunch of Euro V8 performance cars. ITB's. Differing runner and bell dimensions for broader power band. MAP and throttle-position sensors. Better and multiple intake temp sensors. A slightly more, um, comprehensive engine management package. Variable valve timing. COP ignition.
Start another list!
what im telling you and have for many years, is i dont care about any power below 4500rpm. never go there! its not a street car. or i should say, its all about performance! anyone that cares about performance will use the right gear to get max acceleration! (and power for that speed).
so, that makes things a little easier. variable valve timing... not needed. perfect ECU tuning... not needed (more for better MPG, and finetuning... and fine tuninig that can put an engine on the edge where on the track it can be a problem... happens all the time. my car, leaving 10-15hp on the table is VERY VERY safe. and im sure Erik and Todd appreciate how i have run this engine of mine. but its time to bolt on a few more ponies!
I told you ... if i bolt it on, i suspect it will give as much as Robs tested intake dyno run. about 60hp. if you bot what i suggest on a bone stock S4, im thinking 30hp. put it on a hot cam and big valves, more like 75-80 with out much fuss i would imagine. its my prediction and opinion... i cant believe everyone gets so worked up about it. its going to happen.... someday!
I dont have the technology to make it... but there are those there that can.
I hope i can help it happen with $$ and with ideas.
03-21-2016, 09:08 PM
#292
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I'll take a stab, seeing as he can't remember, doesn't want to remember, or thinks the answer might work against his point. But 2nd in class with 4 entrants...I think...
03-21-2016, 09:13 PM
#293
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Positon 4 on the grid and 15 in the total group.
why so negative. i said it was an unusual weekend. not the usual , 40 car field.
03-21-2016, 09:17 PM
#294
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Sorry. No intention to be negative. You posted a lot of words without answering the question. That's all. When you write 'beat 3 of 4 cars' it can mean second or first.
03-21-2016, 09:32 PM
#295
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03-21-2016, 10:10 PM
#296
Rainman
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Or you could go with the proven method used by the current bunch of Euro V8 performance cars. ITB's. Differing runner and bell dimensions for broader power band. MAP and throttle-position sensors. Better and multiple intake temp sensors. A slightly more, um, comprehensive engine management package. Variable valve timing. COP ignition.
VEMS can do all the above mentioned things...
hell, you could use a VEMS output to have variable length ITB trumpets via actuator...
03-21-2016, 11:16 PM
#297
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Mark...no doubt you are having fun....but to imagine that you are up against the best "pure" racers in the country is simply delusional.... You really are the Don Quixote of 928 racing. Defending the 928 honor against all challengers , ...perhaps I do not understand racing but I do know what it is like to be uncompetitive and so should YOU ! Only you can not admit it...... and by the way Dulcinea is a ***** So you slowed down to let the trans-am car catch you so you could block him in the straights ??? And did the actual front runners LAP you in the race ? So you got some good video of them as they went by ?? Suddenly D E driving seems pretty comparable if the is really no one else out there running at your speeds....and yes I have done hundreds of timed laps Embarrassed lots of people in high dollar cars who were just learning to drive on track. All good fun but not world class by any stretch of the imagination. And Mark I only bring it up because I have found your posts to be very misleading about your relative success on track.....like typical podium finishes ...right if there are ONLY three cars in your class, everyone is a "podium finish" .... When you post that you were" first in class and fourth over al"l makes asking how many a very fair question
And if your delta of improvement was ONLY .4 seconds four tens on a second you need not worry about G loading as that delta is insignificant....as far as loading in the corners and oil starvation. so cue up the song, Dancing with yourself and simply substitute "Racing with yourself" and it all makes sense.
So you slowed down to let the trans-am car catch you so you could block him in the straights ??? And did the actual front runners LAP you in the race ? So you got some good video of them as they went by ?? Suddenly D E driving seems pretty comparable if the is really no one else out there running at your speeds....and yes I have done hundreds of timed laps Embarrassed lots of people in high dollar cars who were just learning to drive on track. All good fun but not world class by any stretch of the imagination. And Mark I only bring it up because I have found your posts to be very misleading about your relative success on track.....like typical podium finishes ...right if there are ONLY three cars in your class, everyone is a "podium finish" .... When you post that you were" first in class and fourth over al"l makes asking how many a very fair questionAnd if your delta of improvement was ONLY .4 seconds four tens on a second you need not worry about G loading as that delta is insignificant....as far as loading in the corners and oil starvation. so cue up the song, Dancing with yourself and simply substitute "Racing with yourself" and it all makes sense.
