Notices
928 Forum 1978-1995
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by: 928 Specialists

Norcal Lemons engine failure UPDATE... :>(

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Nov 28, 2009 | 11:23 PM
  #1  
IcemanG17's Avatar
IcemanG17
Thread Starter
Race Director
 
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 16,271
Likes: 82
From: Stockton, CA
Default Norcal Lemons engine failure UPDATE... :>(

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wm1BlKelA3M

Well I spent the day with "Richard" Wolff and we pulled the engine from the 84 lemons racer.....& we found the #6 was GONE...just a smidge of bearing shell left....#2 wasn't much better but both half's were there....#6 was SO loose you could wiggle it BY HAND....watch the video....its amazing that engine ran at all....
Attached Images
File Type: jpg
DSC05285(2).JPG (54.5 KB, 41 views)
File Type: jpg
DSC05289(2).JPG (105.8 KB, 39 views)
File Type: jpg
DSC05291(2).jpg (121.2 KB, 38 views)
File Type: jpg
DSC05297(2).JPG (135.6 KB, 40 views)
File Type: jpg
DSC05301(2).JPG (89.8 KB, 49 views)
File Type: jpg
DSC05303(2).JPG (83.1 KB, 36 views)
File Type: jpg
DSC05306(2).JPG (132.5 KB, 34 views)
File Type: jpg
DSC05307(2).JPG (99.7 KB, 35 views)
File Type: jpg
DSC05308(2).JPG (93.6 KB, 34 views)
Reply
Old Nov 29, 2009 | 12:52 AM
  #2  
vwdmc16's Avatar
vwdmc16
Instructor
 
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 141
Likes: 0
From: sacramento
Default

ITBS!!!!!!!! we gotta!
Reply
Old Nov 29, 2009 | 01:44 AM
  #3  
S4ordie's Avatar
S4ordie
Not the sharpest tool in the shed
Rennlist Member
 
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 8,856
Likes: 333
From: Chandler, AZ, USA, Earth, Milky Way Galaxy
Default

Wow! So what are the rules about replacing/rebuilding an engine? I know there is a cost limit but even a high mileage runner is a couple thousand.
Reply
Old Nov 29, 2009 | 01:50 AM
  #4  
Mark Anderson's Avatar
Mark Anderson
The Parts Whisperer
Rennlist
Site Sponsor

20 Year Member
 
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 7,243
Likes: 537
From: Anaheim Ca
Default

Sorry to hear about the distruction but as I said I will donate a 4.7 to the project. Maybe if we can get it to hold some oil it will last the weekend.
Reply
Old Nov 29, 2009 | 02:17 AM
  #5  
danglerb's Avatar
danglerb
Nordschleife Master
 
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 8,575
Likes: 5
From: Orange, Cal
Default

So ITB should increase the top rpm power, but isn't that going to break motors faster. Wouldn't a rev limiter be more useful? or a giant accusump type thing?
Reply
Old Nov 29, 2009 | 09:25 AM
  #6  
shmark's Avatar
shmark
Drifting
 
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 2,235
Likes: 2
From: Atlanta
Default

A LeMons rebuild is a bit different from your normal rebuild. Find another engine with a hole through the side, scavenge the bearings from it, install the best ones, button it up and go! But I do recommend fixing the leaks while you're in there.
Reply
Old Nov 29, 2009 | 10:13 AM
  #7  
Imo000's Avatar
Imo000
Captain Obvious
Super User
 
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 22,846
Likes: 348
From: Cambridge, Ontario, Canada
Default

Originally Posted by shmark
A LeMons rebuild is a bit different from your normal rebuild. Find another engine with a hole through the side, scavenge the bearings from it, install the best ones, button it up and go! But I do recommend fixing the leaks while you're in there.

It's not tha teasy, you can't just scavange the bearings. They spun and both the crank and con rods have to be re sized. Material has deposited in both so they are over sized now. Alos, if you find a block with a hole, it likely had a spun bearing too that caused the rod to fail so this makes it useless for this.
Reply
Old Nov 29, 2009 | 03:20 PM
  #8  
mark kibort's Avatar
mark kibort
Rennlist Member
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 29,828
Likes: 218
From: saratoga, ca
Default

did the race times get posted on Mylaps? I didnt see them. that would be interesting to see.
Reply
Rennlist Stories

The Best Porsche Posts for Porsche Enthusiasts

story-0

Talos Takes Your 991 Porsche 911 GT3 to the Next Level for a Cool $1.13 Million

 Verdad Gallardo
story-1

9 Vehicles Porsche Helped Engineer that Aren't Porsches

 Verdad Gallardo
story-2

9 Features and Characteristics That Only Porsche People Understand

 Verdad Gallardo
story-3

I've Written 500 Rennlist Articles: Here's How Porsche Has Changed Along the Way

 Joe Kucinski
story-4

10 Most Unnecessary Porsches Ever Built (And Why We Love Them)

 Verdad Gallardo
story-5

Porsche 911 GT3 S/C vs 718 Spyder RS: 10 Categories, One Winner

 Joe Kucinski
story-6

This Builder Is Turning Heads With Its Slantnose 911 Creation

 Verdad Gallardo
story-7

Porsche 911 GT3 Artisan Edition Pays Homage to Japanese Culture

 Verdad Gallardo
story-8

Porsche Reveals Coupe Variant of the Electric Cayenne With a Fresh Look

 Verdad Gallardo
story-9

10 Porsche Colors That Have More Personality Than Most People

 Verdad Gallardo
Old Nov 30, 2009 | 12:31 AM
  #9  
turbochad's Avatar
turbochad
Rennlist Member
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 259
Likes: 27
From: Denver, CO
Default

If you put ITBs on that car you will get crushed for sure.
Reply
Old Nov 30, 2009 | 01:02 AM
  #10  
docmirror's Avatar
docmirror
Shameful Thread Killer
Rennlist Member
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 19,886
Likes: 151
From: Rep of Texas, N NM, Rockies, SoCal
Default

The pic of the Sawzall in the background says it all about Lemons racing.

I would take some crocus cloth to the crank, find a decent used bearing, grind the rod cap a bit and size the rod end. It's the cheapest way to go, if the crank journal isn't completely hashed. You can even shave a bit of bearing off the end to make up for clearance. More labor, less materials.
Reply
Old Nov 30, 2009 | 02:28 AM
  #11  
IcemanG17's Avatar
IcemanG17
Thread Starter
Race Director
 
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 16,271
Likes: 82
From: Stockton, CA
Default

the crank is badly out of spec....so bad you can literally feel it with your finger....
Reply
Old Nov 30, 2009 | 09:24 AM
  #12  
shmark's Avatar
shmark
Drifting
 
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 2,235
Likes: 2
From: Atlanta
Default

It's only got to run for two days!
Reply
Old Nov 30, 2009 | 09:55 AM
  #13  
Imo000's Avatar
Imo000
Captain Obvious
Super User
 
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 22,846
Likes: 348
From: Cambridge, Ontario, Canada
Default

Originally Posted by docmirror
..........I would take some crocus cloth to the crank, find a decent used bearing, grind the rod cap a bit and size the rod end. It's the cheapest way to go, if the crank journal isn't completely hashed. You can even shave a bit of bearing off the end to make up for clearance. More labor, less materials.
I'm sorry but that would never hold up. The bearing clearances have to be tight and uniform or else oil pressure will go and then bye bye bearing. Either they are all replaced with some good used parts (crank & con rod) or they need to be sent to a machine shop for a proper re grind.
Reply
Old Nov 30, 2009 | 12:41 PM
  #14  
docmirror's Avatar
docmirror
Shameful Thread Killer
Rennlist Member
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 19,886
Likes: 151
From: Rep of Texas, N NM, Rockies, SoCal
Default

Originally Posted by Imo000
I'm sorry but that would never hold up. The bearing clearances have to be tight and uniform or else oil pressure will go and then bye bye bearing. Either they are all replaced with some good used parts (crank & con rod) or they need to be sent to a machine shop for a proper re grind.
Actually, I've done it before on a Fiat engine. If you have plastigauge and access to a rod sizer it's pretty easy. The point is moot because the crank is toast anyway.
Reply
Old Nov 30, 2009 | 02:39 PM
  #15  
vwdmc16's Avatar
vwdmc16
Instructor
 
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 141
Likes: 0
From: sacramento
Default

right and all the crap that is in the engine would be really hard to flush without dissasembling it completly
Reply



All times are GMT -3. The time now is 10:55 PM.

story-0
Talos Takes Your 991 Porsche 911 GT3 to the Next Level for a Cool $1.13 Million

Slideshow: Talos Vehicles has transformed the Porsche 911 GT3 RS into a carbon-bodied, race-inspired machine that costs well over $1 million before the donor car is even included.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-05-19 13:39:04


VIEW MORE
story-1
9 Vehicles Porsche Helped Engineer that Aren't Porsches

Slideshow: Long before engineering consulting became trendy, Porsche was quietly helping other automakers build everything from supercars to economy hatchbacks.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-05-15 12:44:44


VIEW MORE
story-2
9 Features and Characteristics That Only Porsche People Understand

Slideshow: Some brands build cars. Porsche builds traditions, obsessions, and a few habits that stopped making sense decades ago but somehow became part of the charm.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-05-13 18:46:13


VIEW MORE
story-3
I've Written 500 Rennlist Articles: Here's How Porsche Has Changed Along the Way

Slideshow: Six years and 500 Rennlist articles later, these are the biggest changes at Porsche.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-05-11 09:52:55


VIEW MORE
story-4
10 Most Unnecessary Porsches Ever Built (And Why We Love Them)

Slideshow: Some Porsches exist for very specific reasons-others feel like they were built just to see if anyone would notice.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-05-06 18:00:32


VIEW MORE
story-5
Porsche 911 GT3 S/C vs 718 Spyder RS: 10 Categories, One Winner

Slideshow: Choosing between the 911 GT3 S/C and 718 Spyder RS in 10 key categories to determine one surprising winner.

By Joe Kucinski | 2026-05-05 12:51:46


VIEW MORE
story-6
This Builder Is Turning Heads With Its Slantnose 911 Creation

Slideshow: A small Polish tuner has reimagined the Porsche 911 Slantnose for the modern era, blending 1980s nostalgia with widebody tuning culture and serious performance upgrades.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-05-01 10:49:43


VIEW MORE
story-7
Porsche 911 GT3 Artisan Edition Pays Homage to Japanese Culture

Slideshow: Porsche has created a Japan-only 911 GT3 Artisan Edition that blends track-ready hardware with design cues inspired by traditional Japanese craftsmanship.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-04-28 19:37:40


VIEW MORE
story-8
Porsche Reveals Coupe Variant of the Electric Cayenne With a Fresh Look

Slideshow: Porsche's latest electric Cayenne Coupe blends dramatic styling with supercar acceleration, turning the brand's midsize SUV into a 1,139-horsepower flagship.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-04-27 19:39:30


VIEW MORE
story-9
10 Porsche Colors That Have More Personality Than Most People

Slideshow: Porsche's wildest paint colors aren't just shades-they're full-blown personalities on four wheels.

By Verdad Gallardo | 2026-04-27 19:38:13


VIEW MORE