96redLT4

Long time Carrera owner here. I thought it was interesting in the official video where P introduces the 992.2 that they first introduced the non-hybrid base car and then proceeded to sell us on the merits of a far more powerful but heavier and far more complex hybrid variant as the wave of the future. It made me wonder whether they are 'testing the waters' with P enthusiasts to see what the uptake will be. The P Carrera ethos has always been about lightness, nimbleness and doing 'more with less'. Has hybridization/electrification already been decided for the sportiest cars, think GT department? Cramming technology and horsepower into ever heavier cars and then advertising via YouTubers in 1/4 mile and 1/2 mile rolling acceleration tests how 'good' your car is, well that just doesn't seem like the Porsche of old that has made racing history for so long. Thoughts??

detansinn

Motorsports has been going hybrid.
The regulatory environment and fleet CO2 target numbers are also driving it.

Nothing new here.

The reason why the GT3 is still NA is that Porsche sold a bunch of Taycans. There would be no NA GT3 without the Taycan.

Truth be told, with the exception of a handful of states, the US is the only market where these CO2 emissions targets aren’t being taken seriously. Automakers are selling to a global audience. They’re designing products for a global market. Porsche is no different.

96redLT4

Correct, but I thought if you have enough Taycans and hybrid/electric SUVs you could continue to build a smaller number of ICE cars for enthusiasts, think Corvette and Ferrari V12.

aggie57

They’ll keep selling ICE / Hybrid cars as long as the regulators let them. But the next Boxster/Cayman is pure EV so they’re also placing an each way bet.

PSPorsche

Porsche doesn’t want to make heavy cars.

Porsche uses the ".2" refresh cycle to introduce new engine technology.

They use the ".1" new car cycle to introduce a new frame and sheet metal.

I am certain Porsche will reduce the weight of the frame for the 994, as they did when transitioning from the 991 to the 992, where they replaced numerous steel parts with aluminum.

ipse dixit

No

Bluehighways

Nope! The days of ICE powered cars are numbered. Porsche is no exception and is not exempted from this transition from ICE to EV.

Alan Smithee

Will Porsche ever walk back it commitment to hybridization/electrification?

They’ve invested billions, so not likely. They are also investing in synthetic fuel, and they are one of a few manufacturers still making naturally aspirated cars and manual transmissions, so not all of their eggs are in one basket.

But the 992.2 GTS is not a hybrid…no plug, no capability to run electric only. They are marketing it as a hybrid for whatever reason (and marketing their electric cars as turbos for whatever reason), but it’s a ‘mild hybrid’…another term for the next evolution of the ICE…replacing one turbo and belt-driven accessory drives with electric torque fill and ancillaries, and seamless stop/start. Already done with little fanfare and no ‘hybrid’ branding by BMW, Mercedes, Land Rover, and others.

Heavier? Yeah, a bit. But a small battery can be low in the chassis and strategically placed to actually improve handling. More complex? Arguably, but most people opt for PDK…nothing simple about that. Instant power off the line and out of turns? You bet! Better economy/emissions? Maybe on a test cycle…

rk-d

My Defender is an MHEV but you'd hardly know it during operation or in the way it's marketed. The fact that the 911 is now an MHEV is really not that big a deal.

100 something pound penalty is a bummer, but only barely noticeable on cars with even power and on a car with more power and greater responsiveness - will likely not be noticeable at all.

I would not be shocked to hear that the new one ends up feeling like a faster, quicker feeling version of the same car. I think the big philosophical transition was moving away from NA to FI, not adding on an MHEV unit. Once people get real miles on the new car, I'm going to bet they quickly forget the old FI motor. I'm looking forward to checking it out.

yrralis1

Remember when the rest of the world went diesel ? Electrification has been a worldwide effort to skew data by a group of opportunists to mislead the average person into believing that they want to save polar bears , In the meantime they have done nothing to curtail other forms of pollution . Right now gas is cheap, and is readily available , and no one has done anything meaningful to implement an EV infrastructure . In fact even without mass EV look at places like Texas where a cold snap fried the system or California where a heat wave took out theirs . As it is the extra weight load of EV cars will chew up our roads and bridges but one one talks about that .

I have no issue buying an EV if it were a choice but that has not been the case .

detansinn

Gas (93 Octane) is nearing $5/gal in my neck of the woods. That's not cheap.
We regularly do 800-1000 mile trips in our EVs. Sure, there can always be more infrastructure, but there's been meaningful progress in the US in the past couple of years. With my F150 Lightning being able to use both CCS and Tesla Superchargers, it's a pretty great way to cover lots of miles. That electric pickup truck saved me about $6000 (SIX THOUSAND) in gas last year.

Real energy independence is not being forced to pay whatever the gas station feels like charging you that day.
I don't care about the tree hugger stuff. I get to drive around a full size pickup truck that literally costs me nothing to fill up at home. We've got a 16.8kw solar array (ROI trending towards 6-7 years). Our total electric bill last month, which covered charging 3 EVs, running the HVAC units for a large house, was $48 (FORTY EIGHT). As we enter the peak sun season, this month's electric will will be negative -- the electric utility will owe us money, again, fueling our daily drivers, powering our house, and keeping everything awesome.

If you have no issue buying an EV, you should buy one -- heck, you can pick up a used Bolt for $10k. They're the ultimate daily drivers and cost nothing to operate. You won't see a big hit to your electric bill either. If a Bolt is slumming it for you, used Taycans are something approaching free for a used Porsche experience.

None of this means that I have to give up my 3 pedal 911 Targa or my garage full of Ducati's and Harley's. EV ownership is a choice and it's not exclusive one.
Oh, and if you've got cash lying around and want to reduce your tax burden. Take advantage of that 30% tax credit for solar. It's one of the biggest no brainers out there. If your friends start calling you "woke" for solar panels, telling them what your electric bill is with solar will shut that down pretty quick -- energy independence starts at home.

yrralis1

When a friend who owns a Tesla got in my 992 and saw the 531 miles to empty he gulped . I pointed at the three gas stations next to us . It's 3.99 here . When I took an Uber to the doctor and got in his Model Y I asked him if he ever ran out of charge . He got so nervous that he coiled barely answer . He then replied " I hope it never happens" . When hurricane Ian originally was heading to Tampa and took that last moment turn to Ft Myers some tried to get out . Many of the Tesla EV;s ran out of charge .
ICE is just too easy to deny . Plus EV cars are heavy and have more road noise than a Boxster . We haven't even gotten to the time where everything is EV and a household has 5 cars . BTW I live in a city . I could not imagine living in rural place like Montana with an EV .

Even with Porsche playing it wise with a mild hybrid look at the forum pushback . Notice how the Base 992.2 has become the sweet spot for many.

When I look at EV's and see the silly wheels and odd shapes I realize it's all about range . It's hot out and AC makes less range. It's cold out and it takes the charger two hours to heat up the battery just to start . Gain 5 pounds and it's less range .
There is no bargain here and anyone thinks they are saving is reflected in massive depredation. EV's become dated faster than an iPhone .

Worst if all its being forced rather than by choice .

aggie57

You are correct, it is being forced on us. By generations of humans who without considering the consequences pumped trillions of gallons of stored carbon, ran it through their unfiltered mobile generators (a.k.a. Cars), and spewed the unburnt parts back into the very air we depend on to survive.

I’m no greenie but that situation is pretty clear if you take a look at airborne pollution and its cause. Yes, the charging networks are in their infancy and yes EV’s have some way to go in terms of charging and battery capacity but even now for most people they are a practical, easy alternative. Having owned and lived with one for coming up to 2 years I would never buy anything else as a daily driver. Hell, I rent them when traveling and as I write this my rental Hertz Polestar sits outside the hotel in Orlando.

yrralis1

Transportation is only 29 percent of the pollution and it does not just include cars . Heavy duty trucks and buses are also included . Those heavy duty vehicles only comprise 4 percent of thew road yet emit 25 percent of vehicle pollution . Next in line is residential and commercial which comprises MORE than vehicles (31 percent ) . Industry is yet another 30 percent and agriculture makes up the last 10 percent .

Yet when it comes to the forced feeding it's thrown at the individual by legislators who are driving enthusiasts . Mind you that just to build the infrasctrucre would require more pollution . How much more ? It depends how far legislators want to go . Keep in mind that all of us are adults so the time to accomplish anything significant might just outlive us . By then there will be something else to fixate on .

Ikone

Agreed.

My guess is in another decade or two, everyone will look back and realize how much of a mistake this was. Charging infrastructure is one thing, but the production and disposal of batteries is another. Then there is the pollution from the tires due to the weight of the vehicles. But really, if you calculate all cars in the US going EV, it wouldn't even make a difference to the total emissions of the world. What about countries like India? Those rickshas aren't going EV over night and they don't have the infrastructure to support it anyway.

I'm all for technological advances, but electrification is really going backward. There is nothing 'advanced' about an electric motor and a lithium battery.