Paul 996

Yes silly. Look at the picture I sent you from my phone when your car arrived. 996 base nose. Totally legal for SPB but dumb NASA PTD/TTD rules makes it cost you some points.

You may as well install a grappling hook if you want to try and win any tires from me Unless I crash again.

John H

Some historical perspective. Good luck to all! I hope it works out for everyone involved.

NASA and the GTS Challenge fiasco

Streak

Hmm, I guess I do. Never noticed. The no point mod rules say this:

Radiator upgrade/shrouding/fascia modification (drilled or cut holes/slots) that only provides
increased airflow to the radiator or oil/transmission coolers (without aerodynamic or engine
air intake improvement)

I'll have to ask.

You'll crash.

nprichards

PCA copied the rules from POC and then told everyone to kiss their ***, they are doing it their own way. Not surprising that people are pissed and don't want to work with PCA.

M758

The difference between 944 spec and spec boxster is that 944 spec started in NASA. NASA still controls the rules set and PCA adopted NASA's rules. I know that NASA can get a little picky on who has the rights on the rules. For 944 spec however while NASA may "own" the rules we drivers really get pick and choose what we want in them. NASA gets final say so, but mostly only if they see some safety issue or something that could impact sponsorship. For the most part we (NASA 944 racers) run our class in NASA. So for 944 spec at least if you don't like the rules talk to me as I am pretty much they guy who writes them(with driver input of course). If you were to complain to National about 944 spec rules it would come to me anyway.

J richard

Here's my point guys, (I agree with Joe)

AS NASA:

1. forget about "owning" anything or influencing anyone else
2. Have a Class that is open to allow anyone who runs in PCA/POC whatever to be legal
3. Sit back and watch it grow.

what's so complex about this?

The current rules adopted by most all the orgs are VERY close to the same.
Don't need to work with anyone.
The racers will take care of the rest.
The sooner you set the rules the less creep there will be. Time to do this is now!

Done.
Lets race.

Streak

+1,000,000

The cars are built, the rules exist. Start collecting entry fees.

Streak

Here's a different perspective Nick. A perspective from a dues paying member of Nasa. A dues paying member of Nasa who bought a SPB because Nasa and PCA supported the series. Now Nasa doesn't so dues paying members of Nasa who own SPB's have nowhere to race with Nasa.

To add to this perspective, PCA and POC still support the series so Nasa is the odd man out which makes it appear that Nasa was the one unwilling to work with others.

Just so we are clear, I love Nasa and Nasa's race weekends are a blast. Zero complaints. Nothing but smiles. And I can run every month with Nasa 30 minutes from my house. Love me some Nasa race weekends.

Except now Nasa won't support SPB which means there is no opportunity to win Toyo bucks and I have to figure out a class to run in without dumping a bunch of money into my car.

So you want to blame the other series that are actually running SPB? Seems like the other guys were able to craft rules, institute those rules and hold races for SPB's.

You'll need to explain why the guys supporting the series are to blame.

Sterling Doc

There's been no official word on this from NASA. I haven't seen the email referenced, but maybe things aren't done and final on this, yet?

My experience with NASA echoes Joe's. I can remember the 5 series directors of 944 Spec sitting down with Ryan, John, and Jerry and making the case for the class to remain independant around 2008. NASA was starting their push to consolidate smaller classes, so that the classes that remained would have more cars & competition. GTI Cup, Spec Neon, Spec Focus, Spec SE-R, etc. all went away around this time. We brought numbers, showed concrete plans for the future, and a lot of enthusiam for the class. We followed through and grew it nationally, and they've been supportive all along. We've worked through some disagreements, and sometimes the big things took longer than we'd like to change, but we were always able to work it out, like the R-888 issue. Not only are we back on RA-1's, we got the increase in Toyo payouts that we wanted this year.

From my experience, what helped the most in keeping 944 Spec a unique class was having a committed group of leaders/class champions around the country, who could work together to make a coordinated plan to grow the class. I would try and form a coalition of leaders from several NASA regions to form a coherent "voice" to the NASA leadership. I understand the previous attempt at this didn't work, but it sounds like there was some internal dissention in that as well.

One of the things we did to help show the strength of the class was to organize a big event out West in '08, where the class was the strongest, and brought out 30 cars to one event. It helped show the series directors commitment and effectiveness.

I like Spec Boxster, and could see myself there some day, so let me know if I can help.

good hands

Just an outsider looking in with no skin in this argument but this entire thing looks like some kind of power play pissing match to me.
The people who are pissed are the potential NASA customers and they are pissed at NASA.
Why the hell would you get rid of a series of this potential with paying customers ?

Texas2Step

It's much more complicated than that, and your assumption that PCA is the "villain" is pretty far off base.

consolidated

This tussle has been brewing for years. If the old Spec Box board were still online I could direct you to a long evening of reading. I've had a great time racing with NASA Texas, but in GTS2. I argued, like many others, for a consolidated rulebook based on racers input.

The NASA Spec Boxster story starts with the original "owner" of the ruleset, Bill Bodine, his insistence on staggered tires among other things, and subsequently empty grids.

SCCA-SW seems to be doing it right to attract a field, using the PCA ruleset and offering wheel to wheel track time, simple.

Streak

If one SCCA group adopts will they encourage others? I have zero experience with SCCA.

Streak

The rules have been pulled off the Nasa website so I guess it's official!

nprichards

Of all the sanctioning bodies PCA is by far the most difficult and egocentric. I don't see much alignment unless all other sanctioning bodies just do what PCA wants. Maybe that's how it will play out.