A dentist friend of mine is looking into doing DEs.......
07-08-2008, 08:54 AM
#48
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A couple of initial thoughts. First, try to explain to your friend that there are many Porsches that are for "real men" that aren't 911s 
If he comes in to this hobby / sport with that feeling, he's going to become pretty lonely. There are so many extremely fast Boxsters, Cayman (or is it Caymen?), 944s, etc. out there.
I started with an E46M3 and it was a great car to learn on because of it's 50/50 balance and with proper pads, it's systems were all extremely good. I think in some ways that taught me balance and smoothness such that when I switched to other cars like the 997S, 964, and now GT3, it was a very easy transition.
So I support the concept of something like a Cayman for your friend, though it sounds like he has the mind and budget for a 911. I do know what he is thinking about the Cayman - that it lacks the torque of say a 997 - but that's by design and not easy to change. But wind the Cayman up and you've seen how potent they are at the track...
Assuming it's 911 or bust for your mentor, then I too think a 997S would be a great place to start. I just heard that my previous 997S sold over the long weekend - too bad, that would have been a great car. Basically a stripper, which is just what the Dr. ordered for a combined DE / Street car. The nannies never got involved and the only time it kicked in was cresting the uphill at LRP when the rear got light (and not ever lap, just if I had some side-torque happening). I think instructors might like having that in the beginning - sort of a safety valve until some skill sets build.
No need to go new now that there are so many 997S out there. I'd stick with 06 or 07 as the 05 did have some rear suspension issues (I know somebody now that's battling the dealership because Porsche will not admit the flaw even though they changed the system for 06). I'd think that he could find a nice CPO 06 for $80k or less and have $15k to spend on safety features and then $5k for DE, tires, and maintenance for the first year.
I've watched my son do extremely well in DE in the 997S platform - moved from Green to Yellow in 3 DE events (2x 1 day at LRP and 1x 2 day at WGI). As Rick will confirm, as he posted as much elsewhere here at RL, he's adapted extremely well to the GT3 and had a great 2 day at WGI recently. I'm jealous he'll be on LRP July 19 and I'll only be support crew / photographer.
If he comes in to this hobby / sport with that feeling, he's going to become pretty lonely. There are so many extremely fast Boxsters, Cayman (or is it Caymen?), 944s, etc. out there.I started with an E46M3 and it was a great car to learn on because of it's 50/50 balance and with proper pads, it's systems were all extremely good. I think in some ways that taught me balance and smoothness such that when I switched to other cars like the 997S, 964, and now GT3, it was a very easy transition.
So I support the concept of something like a Cayman for your friend, though it sounds like he has the mind and budget for a 911. I do know what he is thinking about the Cayman - that it lacks the torque of say a 997 - but that's by design and not easy to change. But wind the Cayman up and you've seen how potent they are at the track...
Assuming it's 911 or bust for your mentor, then I too think a 997S would be a great place to start. I just heard that my previous 997S sold over the long weekend - too bad, that would have been a great car. Basically a stripper, which is just what the Dr. ordered for a combined DE / Street car. The nannies never got involved and the only time it kicked in was cresting the uphill at LRP when the rear got light (and not ever lap, just if I had some side-torque happening). I think instructors might like having that in the beginning - sort of a safety valve until some skill sets build.
No need to go new now that there are so many 997S out there. I'd stick with 06 or 07 as the 05 did have some rear suspension issues (I know somebody now that's battling the dealership because Porsche will not admit the flaw even though they changed the system for 06). I'd think that he could find a nice CPO 06 for $80k or less and have $15k to spend on safety features and then $5k for DE, tires, and maintenance for the first year.
I've watched my son do extremely well in DE in the 997S platform - moved from Green to Yellow in 3 DE events (2x 1 day at LRP and 1x 2 day at WGI). As Rick will confirm, as he posted as much elsewhere here at RL, he's adapted extremely well to the GT3 and had a great 2 day at WGI recently. I'm jealous he'll be on LRP July 19 and I'll only be support crew / photographer.
07-08-2008, 09:38 AM
#50
Three Wheelin'
Viewpoint of a semi old guy 46, "noob". I bought a GT3 and almost immediately bought a 951 to track first (no previous track time). I added motons, racers edge stuff and seats after one event, cage after the next. Great car to learn on, suspension and seats help with with getting where I need to be on the track. Total price with trailer and toys well under $100K.
Most important part for me was/is solid instruction and coaching (on and off the track) from successful (racers) instructors in PCA.
Ego can be good, but you have to be humble and "coachable". Whatever you drive.
PS - Climbing all over some knuclehead in a higher horsepower car because his line sucks is my new favorite thing to do.
Green for now.
Most important part for me was/is solid instruction and coaching (on and off the track) from successful (racers) instructors in PCA.
Ego can be good, but you have to be humble and "coachable". Whatever you drive.
PS - Climbing all over some knuclehead in a higher horsepower car because his line sucks is my new favorite thing to do.
Green for now.
07-08-2008, 09:52 AM
#52
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If he wants a 911, you should find someone to take a full race prepped early 911 (big flares, wing, etc. very macho) and put a 912 motor in it. It would take at least a few DE's for him to realize the difference.
07-08-2008, 10:18 AM
#55
Rennlist Member
Paolo - I have just the "HE" man car your friend needs.
A 2005 Turbo S...1 of only 180 coupes brought to the USA. 500 hp (at the WHEELS); sweet Europipe exhaust; lowered with Porsche X73 suspension; Ruf pedals; PCCBs (gen 2); 40k miles. Car looks and drives like new, including the rotors.
Tell him nothing can come close on the straights when he floors it. Just the car your buddy NEEDs.
Bull, Dr Jupeman, 38D and even one of your CVR instructors would vouch for HE-man-ness of this beast...
Call me if he's interested, but don't go by used car book values...I ain't selling this cheap!
A 2005 Turbo S...1 of only 180 coupes brought to the USA. 500 hp (at the WHEELS); sweet Europipe exhaust; lowered with Porsche X73 suspension; Ruf pedals; PCCBs (gen 2); 40k miles. Car looks and drives like new, including the rotors.
Tell him nothing can come close on the straights when he floors it. Just the car your buddy NEEDs.
Bull, Dr Jupeman, 38D and even one of your CVR instructors would vouch for HE-man-ness of this beast...Call me if he's interested, but don't go by used car book values...I ain't selling this cheap!
07-08-2008, 10:35 AM
#56
Lifetime Rennlist Member
07-08-2008, 10:44 AM
#57
Rennlist Member
^ Bull, Sunday Driver - considering that late models Turbos are 4-while drives with assisting nannies, and that GT2s are less forgiving, I thought I'd 'volunteer' my Turbo S for this gent;...)
07-08-2008, 11:01 AM
#58
If he really was an A type person and wanted to be top dog he would drive a capable car that competes well with a 911 and try and still keep his hand in the window
If that fails a new set of slicks on Bobby's turbo can be a back up plan
07-08-2008, 11:15 AM
#59
Rennlist Member
In all seriousness... Have him go talk to Farnbacher about building him a Cayman GTR.. see if they can put a dry-sump GT3 motor in it..
http://www.europeancarweb.com/featur...gtr/index.html
http://www.europeancarweb.com/featur...gtr/index.html
07-08-2008, 11:25 AM
#60
Still plays with cars.
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Member
Paolo - I suggested a 996 GT3 in all seriousness because:
The car is a pleasure to drive on a track and has enough performance to suit anyone.
It is as quick as anything short of a full blown race-car (Cup Car for example) and can still be driven to and from the track.
They are reliable.
They are easy to drive - anyone who claims that a GT3 needs some phenomenal level of skill is posturing in my opinion. A GT3 is easier to drive than at the limit than your 964 for example.
There are no nannies except ABS - learn to drive without PSM etc. Like real cars.
As skills increase the car is still there. many who start in lower performance car quickly find themselves wanting more car. This hardly ever happens with a GT3.
There are a reasonable number available equipped for track at decent prices. They tend to depreciate slowly - a plus down the road.
Regards,
The car is a pleasure to drive on a track and has enough performance to suit anyone.
It is as quick as anything short of a full blown race-car (Cup Car for example) and can still be driven to and from the track.
They are reliable.
They are easy to drive - anyone who claims that a GT3 needs some phenomenal level of skill is posturing in my opinion. A GT3 is easier to drive than at the limit than your 964 for example.
There are no nannies except ABS - learn to drive without PSM etc. Like real cars.
As skills increase the car is still there. many who start in lower performance car quickly find themselves wanting more car. This hardly ever happens with a GT3.
There are a reasonable number available equipped for track at decent prices. They tend to depreciate slowly - a plus down the road.
Regards,