Bill N

Hey, Alan, good to see you...Notice I survived the rain OK! Next year, if not sooner!

Bill N

Mais oui!!!

Gary R.

Would work in Saucers also.... there were some real sightsee'ers out there. Sorry I didn't get to meet you Bob, I never saw your car.

RonCT

As Geoffrey suggested - instead of focusing on what went wrong, let's think about what went right. I had a fabulous time and went out in every session and especially enjoyed turning 2:21s and 2:22s in the rain - those PS2s really are something in the cold and wet.

I did see some things that weren't optimal in Saucers, and did not go out in Cups because it was suggested here that based on the fact that my car is bone stock on street tires I should stick with the slower group. As a way to self-examine and learn for next year, based on what you cup guys saw, what do you think? I was running consistent 2:17s in the dry and know I have more room to improve as I learn this car. I felt that perhaps I was contributing to some of the anxiety that many Saucers felt with respect to closing speeds, number of passes, etc. combined with how many cars were in Saucers. I respected the slower cars and gave plenty of room to bumpers, waited patiently, etc. - so I don't sense that anyone would say "that Cobalt 997S was a real pain".

I had some great runs with many Cups that ran in Saucers, but will say that there were a couple that just would not let me pass. One 996 GT3 (Cup) in particular had me on his bumper and then Geoffrey on mine for 2 full laps and just was not going to give way. After 2 laps I gave up, backed off, signaled Geoffrey to pass to try to get through to him, and then the session ended. In hind sight I suppose I should have tried the Cups. Any constructive comments are appreciated.

Driver8

As always a great, well run event. Lots of fun, a ton of track time and a lot of great people.

Here is a link to some photos I took Thursday morning.

http://web.mac.com/aambrosi/iWeb/Sit...0Adv%20DE.html

jford

Ron,
Not neccesarily constructive criiticism, just wanted to say I had fun chasing, and not catching, you during one of the last sessions the second day. I was behind you in the black 993.

Jamie

RonCT

Great photos - the one you got of me is very dramatic! Thanks! Would you mind if I use it as my avatar?

Jamie - I had such a blast chasing and being chased, passing and being passed. Some late, some drama - but all safe and in good fun. Much learning was had by all!

Some fun facts of the event - much from the new TraqMate I'm starting to learn to utilize...

24.5 MPG in transit from central CT (300 miles each way).
9 MPG on track.
1 tank to get there, one back, 1.5 each day on the track = 5 tanks at $50 each.
2/32 of tire wear on PS2s, shoulders worn down pretty bad. Understeer still there post FBL install of GT3 control arms and "street / track" alignment (this is 90% a street car) - camber is about 1.8 front...

24.25 seconds braking best
118 entry speed, 119 exit speed best
1.41 G braking, 0.44 G acceleration
1.62 G left lateral, 1.34 G right
143 MPH top speed, 56 minimum, 88 average
2:17 dry lap, 2:21 wet lap (love those PS2s in the cold / wet)

And still a long way to go...

Geoffrey

Ron, I think that you would do fine running in the Cup group based on your black run group status and the speed at which I you were running. I didn't come up on you as quickly as others for instance. As a comparison, I was running 2:07s in traffic in the Cup group and did not get 1 clear lap which is in the range of what the race prepared cars were running. I primarily went out in the Cup group so as not scare people who are not use to Black/Red run group etiiquette (ie closing speeds, running 2' off the bumper, late/early passes in and out of corners).

This event has changed over time. When our Hudson Valley Region started the event 15 years ago, it was primarily an event where the upper run group drivers, who were mostly instructors and/or racers, could get together and improve driving skills as well as have the opportunity to receive pro instruction which is something that is rare for a more skilled driver. This event gave the "Scottos, Burgers, etc. a venue to improve their skills and learn from people more skilled than they. Today the event is one of the few "open track" events available within PCA and as such, attacts more people including white run drivers as they try to maximize track time for dollars. I think it is this disparity that needs to be addressed if this event continues to invite such a wide diversity of people.

RonCT

Geoffrey - thanks for the feedback. I have a thought to share... How about 3 run groups - Cups, Saucers, and Spoons? That might give Spoons (White and cautious Black) drivers an opportunity for 20 minute sessions on the hour, and give Cups / Saucers the opportunity to run in either or both as they see fit for a total of 40 minutes on the hour.

bobt993

How about Cups, Saucers and Skirts?

Gary R.

Sean F

I'd argue for keeping it just like it is and reviewing the screening process for the entrants. This event is amazing for a bunch of reasons. It's not just the open track time. I learned a ton around the paddock with such a concentration of experienced drivers/racers to talk to. I also found it to be an amazing learning opportunity to be on the track with the cups. It not only forces you to a new level of awareness, but it allows you to try and follow much faster and more talented drivers and learn from their lines/techniques and how they are interacting with the other cups. It was a ton of fun to be on track and watching them dice back and forth before corners. I think if the weather had cooperated a little more, we wouldn't have had as much mixing between the two groups and many of these discussions would not be happening.

Sean F

JL - great to finally meet you and thanks for all the tips. I'm already hard at work

See you at the Clash

Gary Knox

I admit to being one of the "slower" cars in the saucers group (2:30). I DID have a great time, just not quite as great as the previous two years. I'm not intimidated by the faster cars, I DO give a point-by as I'm passing the apex to any and all cars near me - and also late passing signals as I'm nearing a turn if the closing speed is fast. I really appreciate a wave off if the driver is not going to pass, as I don't want an incident at the corner!! My old black 928 did get good exercise, and enjoyed the two days as well!!
I did see several 2-3 wide in turns during the saucers outings, and had several instances where perhaps 5 cars passed when I'd only given 3 or 4 passing signals - perhaps the last 1-2 driver(s) were confused - ha!!
As I contemplated the event, I think it might work well if we had 3 differnt types of "outings" with the two groups. Five outings during each day at 25 minutes for only the saucers, five outings each day at 35 minutes for only the cups, and four outings each day at 30 minutes where both cups and saucers could run. Just a thought for more "discussion" on this forum.
Thanks to all you cup cars for sharing the track with us slow guys. We appreciate courtesy, and safety. Also, for the few seconds we are following you closely enough, perhaps we can learn a little bit.

Gary Knox - just turned 70, so I'm even older than the car!!

Brian P

I was happy to get 350 miles of driving during the 2 days (actually 1.5 as I wimped out during the Wednesday morning rain).