GT4 RS in the works? Rumors of a 4.0...
#361
No I still stand by both my comments, 991 GT3 is easier (it's PDK only so goes hand in hand) and also you get closer to pro lap time (because it is easier) it's a simple statement :-) no back pedaling involved.
If you think going from -1 to -3.5 camber gains no time and is just about saving tyres , well that's a whole new thread chat.
If you think going from -1 to -3.5 camber gains no time and is just about saving tyres , well that's a whole new thread chat.
#362
Nordschleife Master
Originally Posted by mrd_spy
No I still stand by both my comments, 991 GT3 is easier (it's PDK only so goes hand in hand) and also you get closer to pro lap time (because it is easier) it's a simple statement :-) no back pedaling involved.
If you think going from -1 to -3.5 camber gains no time and is just about saving tyres , well that's a whole new thread chat.
If you think going from -1 to -3.5 camber gains no time and is just about saving tyres , well that's a whole new thread chat.
I don't run -3.5 camber on any car. If you think alignment on these cars buys you more than a second at most, I've got a bridge to sell you. There are plenty of real drivers and enough real world time with the car has passed that have shown alignment changes on the gt3 have no big improvement in times. Alignments have larger improvements on other brands and cars, but GT cars have been proven to do well out of the box.
I'm way OT at this point. I'll just shut up about this at this point.
Back to the topic on hand: RS. Doesn't look like it's happening this time around. I'll be fine with a GT4 with 4.0L engine but no RS moniker, though!
#363
No I still stand by both my comments, 991 GT3 is easier (it's PDK only so goes hand in hand) and also you get closer to pro lap time (because it is easier) it's a simple statement :-) no back pedaling involved.
If you think going from -1 to -3.5 camber gains no time and is just about saving tyres , well that's a whole new thread chat.
If you think going from -1 to -3.5 camber gains no time and is just about saving tyres , well that's a whole new thread chat.
This seems obvious, though: the faster / more capable the car, the more you need to increase your speeds to take advantage of it, giving you less margin of error for braking zones, turn-in speeds, etc., forcing you to be a better overall driver to drive each at 9/10ths.
Here's a more intuitive example: do you think it's easier to drive a Spec Miata at 9/10ths? They're approaching corners so much slower with less traction issues on exit that you have way more time to think, carefully brake at the proper points, etc.
IMO it is much harder to drive a fast car quickly than a slow car quickly (by relative measure).
#364
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
One thing is a components of a car to meet a goal or demand...one thing is developing a new model with new parts that will probably cannibalize some of your already existing market or not meeting sales due to overlapping with other products. Never the less.....I hope they do build it.
The thread "McClaren Success" on the GT3 forum (link below) is something Porsche should take note of for sure - pushing off your GT Customers to McClaren because you can't meet demand is only hurting Porsche and they may like McClaren so much they don't come back, and then your bottom two suggestions will become a much bigger issue to deal with!
https://rennlist.com/forums/991-gt3-...n-success.html
Its one thing to move your customers around your product line, but something entirely different to lose them altogether because you are not delivering what they want.
#365
Components to meet demand is a valid concern for Porsche to address. However in this case "cannibalize" existing market or not meeting sales due to "overlapping" with other products is simply not an issue. They have not been able to meet demand for the GT3, GT3RS and GT4 - that is the the issue they face and need to address!
The thread "McClaren Success" on the GT3 forum (link below) is something Porsche should take note of for sure - pushing off your GT Customers to McClaren because you can't meet demand is only hurting Porsche and they may like McClaren so much they don't come back, and then your bottom two suggestions will become a much bigger issue to deal with!
https://rennlist.com/forums/991-gt3-...n-success.html
Its one thing to move your customers around your product line, but something entirely different to lose them altogether because you are not delivering what they want.
The thread "McClaren Success" on the GT3 forum (link below) is something Porsche should take note of for sure - pushing off your GT Customers to McClaren because you can't meet demand is only hurting Porsche and they may like McClaren so much they don't come back, and then your bottom two suggestions will become a much bigger issue to deal with!
https://rennlist.com/forums/991-gt3-...n-success.html
Its one thing to move your customers around your product line, but something entirely different to lose them altogether because you are not delivering what they want.
You are talking completely different markets here.
Apples and Oranges.
#366
Burning Brakes
Originally Posted by mrd_spy
No I still stand by both my comments, 991 GT3 is easier (it's PDK only so goes hand in hand) and also you get closer to pro lap time (because it is easier) it's a simple statement :-) no back pedaling involved.
If you think going from -1 to -3.5 camber gains no time and is just about saving tyres , well that's a whole new thread chat.
If you think going from -1 to -3.5 camber gains no time and is just about saving tyres , well that's a whole new thread chat.
#367
Rennlist Member
The 570S base is ~185K, GT3 RS base was ~175K.
To me the former is ugly, although some may be able to stand it, and the latter has wrong engine placement.
To me the former is ugly, although some may be able to stand it, and the latter has wrong engine placement.
#368
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Different fruit for sure, but if you can afford one - you can likely afford the other and as noted in the thread a number are looking at McLaren, because they "can't" get the GT car they want! That is a lost sale and maybe a lost customer!
#369
i did, my lawyer told me to be as confusing as possible.
but joking aside, my advice would definitely be to chat with some connected people at the shows (this week's Werks Reunion by the way was full of higher up PCNA people just milling around acting friendly) and get your secondary, and tertiary confirmations for yourself, I'm serious. I'm by no means an insider.. i just talk to one on a regular basis for other reasons and porsche convo comes up, and I also enjoy the mild detective work of trying to figure out what's coming while attending shows and events... All i can say, is I don't post anything without distinguishing whether it's supposition on my part, or if I know it to be true, I make sure I note that. My credibility is important to me as I have many real friends on this forum, and I get no joy from making **** up. I just do my very best to try to get real info before I go blowing smoke all over the place.
This weekend we are taking some special machinery to the track, focus will be on running a gt4 clubsport vs a 918 spyder (as well as a few others).. some local ATL PCNA people may be present, one in particular... ill see if a smoke signal is warranted again.
but joking aside, my advice would definitely be to chat with some connected people at the shows (this week's Werks Reunion by the way was full of higher up PCNA people just milling around acting friendly) and get your secondary, and tertiary confirmations for yourself, I'm serious. I'm by no means an insider.. i just talk to one on a regular basis for other reasons and porsche convo comes up, and I also enjoy the mild detective work of trying to figure out what's coming while attending shows and events... All i can say, is I don't post anything without distinguishing whether it's supposition on my part, or if I know it to be true, I make sure I note that. My credibility is important to me as I have many real friends on this forum, and I get no joy from making **** up. I just do my very best to try to get real info before I go blowing smoke all over the place.
This weekend we are taking some special machinery to the track, focus will be on running a gt4 clubsport vs a 918 spyder (as well as a few others).. some local ATL PCNA people may be present, one in particular... ill see if a smoke signal is warranted again.
Last edited by ExMB; 03-16-2017 at 07:49 PM.
#370
deleted
#371
Components to meet demand is a valid concern for Porsche to address. However in this case "cannibalize" existing market or not meeting sales due to "overlapping" with other products is simply not an issue. They have not been able to meet demand for the GT3, GT3RS and GT4 - that is the the issue they face and need to address!
The thread "McClaren Success" on the GT3 forum (link below) is something Porsche should take note of for sure - pushing off your GT Customers to McClaren because you can't meet demand is only hurting Porsche and they may like McClaren so much they don't come back, and then your bottom two suggestions will become a much bigger issue to deal with!
https://rennlist.com/forums/991-gt3-...n-success.html
Its one thing to move your customers around your product line, but something entirely different to lose them altogether because you are not delivering what they want.
The thread "McClaren Success" on the GT3 forum (link below) is something Porsche should take note of for sure - pushing off your GT Customers to McClaren because you can't meet demand is only hurting Porsche and they may like McClaren so much they don't come back, and then your bottom two suggestions will become a much bigger issue to deal with!
https://rennlist.com/forums/991-gt3-...n-success.html
Its one thing to move your customers around your product line, but something entirely different to lose them altogether because you are not delivering what they want.
My post was if they actually build the GT4 RS.....the current Porsche models you mention all fall in a specific bracket in PAGs strategy. A GT4RS would be very close to a GT3 in terms of pricing....unless they dilute the RS treatment on the GT4 considerably so if falls right between GT4 and GT3....
#372
people can disagree and argue a point, but it's only a forum and that's my view after loads of time spent on track and with people who can only drive at 80% but love PDK as it gets them to 90% gaining that last 10% are the good driver the last 2% are the pro's
Last edited by mrd_spy; 03-17-2017 at 06:17 AM.
#373
I'm running -3.2 was your quote, -3.2/3.5 lol picking hairs now that's still over double the oem set up ! but no timed gained right you are.
My G meter reading and apex speeds are up over my oem set up !
I still find it hard you think a automatic even though it's in the GT3 is harder to drive than the Manual GT4
see my post above :-) it is to a point maybe you are not getting 100% out of the GT4 yet ;-p , well which is true as you are slower than a pro in a stock car
I have noticed on your vids maybe a trail more to apex would help, (a tad more rotation), you do lean on the camber 100% and hence why you were killing tyres oem.
You must have gained a fair bit of time going from -1.5 to -3.2 due to your style of driving and how much you do act lean on the available Camber.
A racing driver seems to overcome the GT4 understeering shortcoming with more trail I have noticed. where I have noticed you brake less and hoof it in , your cars seem to understeer into the bend than lean on the full camber, rather than rotating the car into a bend.
This is why you are a tad more slower than a pro in the GT3 and view it the way you do, as not trailing enough will make the GT3 slower than the pro more so as even more rotation is needed. again hence why the GT4 is easier to a point of 95% of a time for most people.
Last edited by mrd_spy; 03-17-2017 at 06:21 AM.
#374
Drifting
^Are you a pro racing driver? what series do you compete in?
#375
Rennlist Member
Even pro drivers are 1. not created equal and 2. take time to get to know a car, so the fastest lap might not happen in the first day. I think the 991 GT3 factory 'ring time is 7:25 and sport auto's time was 7:32. While the factory waved their hands and said about 7:40 for the GT4, while sport auto got 7:42. Seems like even sport auto gets closer to the theoretical best time with the GT4.