projekt-h

After having my car back for a full week, I was leaving work Monday night, and my CEL came on when I started the car. No big deal, I figured it might be a generic O2 code, and called the dealer immediately in case it has the 100,000 emissions system warranty that a lot of modern cars carry, and I was at 99,988 at that moment. Their techs were gone at that point, so I went home to just read the code on my scanner and if it wasn't anything serious, clear it and see if it came back. It came through as a P052c..... "Cold Start 'A' Camshaft Position Timing Over-Advanced Bank 2"

Oh. Lovely.

I took it in yesterday on my lunchbreak and (after it taking a while longer than anticipated) they got the same code and said they would be looking into it more, and sending the data off to Porsche. I guess I got lucky since the gentleman who was picking his car up as I was dropping off had just returned his loaner, which they handed over to me. They had me slightly worried when I heard them tell someone on the phone that they wouldn't have a loaner available until the 12th or so, and driving my M3 is now out of the question for me.

I'm not sure if it's a good or bad sign when your service advisor is now comfortable enough with you to send you text message updates instead of calling, but they said today that they didn't have an answer just yet.

deilenberger

I'm not sure where you're located (California may have something entirely different than the rest of the world) - but the usual emissions warranty mandated by the US government is for 24.000 miles or 2 years (whichever comes first), and "specific components" for 80,000 miles, 8 years. I have never heard of one for 100,000 miles. Just wondering where you heard of this, or what cars carry it. I suppose a car with a 100,000 mile warranty would have the emissions systems covered under that warranty..

Just saw - Detroitish - I doubt that Michigan has that long a warranty, but I've been wrong before.

deilenberger

BTW - wonder if they replaced the rather expensive "diamond-washers" (a washer with diamond dust embedded on each side - used to make certain the variocam adjusters stay timed to the camshafts..) or figured they'd reuse them. WC-22 calls for replacement every time the Variocam adjusters are removed/reinstalled.. and the bolt holding it to the camshaft. Not replacing them might result in slipping of the cam timing in relation to the Variocam adjuster... but I would expect it to show as retarded timing.

Oh well - they're getting quite familiar with your engine. A few people have reported the need to have the control valve for the oil circuits on the Variocam adjusters replaced in a short period of time after the adjusters were replaced due to failure. There is a fine pickup screen on these valves that can get plugged if any crap gets into the oil.. and possibly that might be a cause.

I'll be interested in what the resolution is.. please keep us informed.

projekt-h

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All very good info, thank you Don. I may have to see if I can poke some more information out of them.

In regards to the emissions warranty, that's what I understood my previous Focus and Fiesta had, that may have been Ford, though I thought it may be required of newer vehicles... I've mostly only owned older junk so I don't really know there. I know Michigan doesn't require anything... The auto Giants still own the state. We don't even have emissions or safety inspections. You can drive a car that's 60% rust with no exhaust system and the wheels half falling off and the state won't care.

nuisance

I thought this thread could use a smile or two, so here is what happened...

After educating the saleslady about the recall, she came back and said it had been done. Since the dealer is 300 miles away, I asked to see the work order. She answered a day later, and said "OK, now they're saying that a whole new engine was installed". I said "gee that sounds great, can I see the work order on that?". A little later, I got a call from the service manager. He said that actually, the car had been in his shop for a new battery (which has to be somehow mated to the car using the maintenance computer), and that yes, they were still waiting for parts for the recall, and that no new engine was involved. I can just hear the more senior salesmen "Oh, he wants to see the work order? Well, just tell him we put in a new engine! Har Har."

The sad part really is that a Turbo Cayenne would have fit my needs wonderfully, but with lack of support (and really, respect) from Porsche, and the fact that this is not my first run-in with Porsche over after-the-sale support, I bagged the whole idea and yesterday I bought a Honda Ridgeline, new, for less than the seemingly low price ($38K for a 50K mile, one owner Turbo) of the Cayenne.

I wish all of you the best, and hope that Porsche does come through in the end, and also fixes those engines that are ruined. Thank you for this thread!

John

CarGuyNVA

Day 666,958 (or so it seems) and still no Porsche recall letter...... <sigh>

I've been on my dealers wait list since day 1 of the AH08 campaign however, for whatever that's worth.

"Hello Porsche...anyone home?!"

You know, there's a reason I love my Toyotas too, even though they're about as exciting as a toaster.

dapopa9

Was there ever build dates released that show the range of affected Cayenne's? I'm looking at a 01/2012 build CTT but I did the Porsche VIN search and it isn't showing any recalls listed for the vin. Or is there a better link to do a VIN search?

projekt-h

It's been a hell of a week for me, so I haven't been able to update when I found things out. As it went:

Tuesday, 12/12: After sending data to Porsche, the dealership was asked to replace the bolts again, and re-adjust the timing. Bolts were en route

Thursday 12/14: New bolts arrived and installed. Timing re-set and all checked out. Porsche requested they run testing on related sensors and sent data in. Would be informed when answers from data come back.

My Guess: If this system is anything like BMW's Vanos, which it probably is, upon reassembly during the first repair, the tech didn't set the adjusters just right, and tripped the code on cold-start. Probably a specialty jig-type tool for setting cam advancement/retardation that may have not been used, or something interfered with spacing. As it seems right now, this is 100% correlated to the recent cam adjuster replacement, and am expecting 0 out-of-pocket cost to me.

One of my bigger disappointments in all this, is that the past week we've gotten a few solid snowfalls, and while I should be in my Cayenne on a fresh set of Michelin snow tires that are still waiting for me at Discount Tire, I'm in a Macan on all-season sadness rubbers. The Macan has handled it all quite well, which gives me faith in the ability of my Cayenne on proper tires. Even more disappointing, is that I won't get to see the magic 100,000 mile number on my dash. I pulled into the dealer at 99,999 and by my math of watching the decimals on the trip odometer, I was .1 away from 100k. I Suppose I should have circled the block before visiting...

*For what it's worth to any prospective buyers, the base 4 cylinder Macan seems a bit of a waste to me. Under my usual driving conditions and behavior, it's yielded the same fuel economy as the Macan S I had, which is only marginally better than my Cayenne S. You've really gotta give it the boot to get it to go, and it's not a particularly pleasant sounding thing.

I would have went to a different dealer, and contacted Porsche corporate in regards to that one. That's not at all how the sales staff should have handled that, and lying about recall work is baaaaad, especially with how critical this one is and has sullied Porsche's reputation. At least the service manager was honest, but that doesn't make up for the others. They've done pretty well in terms of taking care of me when mine failed, though I'm not without my gripes in regards to the matter. I'd be lying if I said the Ridgeline didn't catch my interest a bit, hope you enjoy it!

Check the NHTSA website. They have a tab where you can enter the VIN. My guess is that an early '12 build is affected and hasn't been remedied.

PTEC

The design of these camshafts and adjusters do not require a diamond washer like the earlier designs. I would guess they didn't complete the timing procedure correctly but a sluggish variocam solenoid is a possibility as well.

deilenberger

The tech bulletin originally released by Porsche for the workshop recall (WC-22) specified in it's parts list the diamond washers - and the service procedure in the service manual also includes reference to the diamond washers. Can you point to someplace that confirms that the washers aren't used?

PTEC

The bulletin for the WC22 parts list does not call for diamond washers, I'm not sure where you're getting that from but you've got bad information. As someone who has probably had 100 of these engines apart in one way or another, I can assure you there is no diamond washer for this application.

deilenberger

I'm on the road at the moment - so I don't have my copies of the documentation that mentions the diamond washers - but I'll try to find them when I get back home in about a month.

CAVU

References to Diamond Washer:

- nothing noted in WC-22
- From AllDataDIY WM 158419 Removing and installing camshaft adjusters has a reference to it " Do not let the diamond washer and other small parts fall into the timing case". The parts diagram does not show the washer.
- From AllDataDIY WM 150719 Removing and installing camshaft timing gear has a reference to it " Do not let the diamond washer and other small parts fall into the timing case". The parts diagram does not show the washer.
- Not for our models but a reference http://workshop-manuals.com/porsche/...fts/page_2015/

- 92A_Katalog has no washer of any type between the M12x1.5x110 Hex screw and the camshaft adjuster
- When I search the dealer's online parts catalog I do not see the M12 bolt 948-105-254-00 (per the 92A_Katalog, and probably somewhere else inthe online catalog) nor washer, but i do note that Porsche has rolled the part number for the camshaft adjuster to 948-105-051-23. https://www.gaudinporscheparts.com/a...at/engine-scat

I think what has happened is that the Porsche workshop manuals have an erroneous note held over from earlier models regarding the diamond washer.

projekt-h

Update from December 21st - So far nothing they have tried has solved this. No metal shavings were found, they tried diagnosing the sensors, which were all fine. Porsche is sending them another cam adjuster to replace the one in question, as the unit may be faulty, but that likely won't be in until after January 2nd.

I'm getting to the point where if that doesn't fix it, I may ask that they speak to Porsche about a full replacement engine. Between the issues, and the wariness left by there even being a possibility of metal shavings, which very well may have been missed by their technicians that I put zero confidence in at this point.

PTEC

FWIW Alldata knows as much about Porsche as I know about astro physics. Its not a great reference.