Tom@TPC Racing

You are correct. Sensitivity is how quickly the g force has to change(rate of change) to trigger out of from the Comfort Parameter to the main G Table.

More on page 6, paragraph 3-
http://www.dscsport.com/wp-content/u...ser-Manual.pdf

The DSC Tuning software manual has been available on www.dscsport.com

Croc999

i eventually have stiffen my sway bars and set DSC a bit softer with an objective to get acceptable ride on rough roads but not too much lean in the turns.
it does that now.
but at initial steering wheel turn i'm getting some strange vague feeling. after the car settles in the turn - it feels good.
probably will need to with G Rate...

floatingkiwi

We have had that same feeling here in NZ on our shorter twistier tracks and have been unable to dial it out. We are faster (or just as fast) with the DSC box but the Porsche one feels more predictable. Some of the guys have worked with the dsc guys to try and sort this but we still all report the same feeling.


The only way I can describe it is the car galumphs (bad I know) into the corners as if transitions aren't happening fast enough. Sort of a diagonal unsettled feeling. I believe for us we need equal damping on all 4 corners and not the lower damping on the inner front that you guys find so useful for your longer faster tracks with the DSC box - but I haven't played with this yet.

Tom@TPC Racing

I have experienced the vague feeling you described. For me, that was from a combination of running the Default Rate too low and Sensitivity value to high. Basically running Default Rate too low creates the comfort characteristic of an ultra luxurious limousine, which is fantastic that its achievable on our sports cars using DSC, but with this limo ride also comes the limo-like cornering feel when the Sensitivity value and G Rate Max value is too high. What is happening is the damping is staying too soft for too long. Let's say you are driving on a straight highway and feeling very good over the bumps and expansion joints(which is the characteristic of a limo), then you make quick lane change and there isn't the slight resistance or feel that you'd expect from a sports car(which is also the characteristic of a limo), what is happening is that the peak g force of the lane change and the rate of change of the event is less than Sensitivity and G Rate Max value. Watching my Motec dash the average highway lane change is 0.2g or less. So for example if the G Rate Max is set at 30.0(which equates to 0.3g), a lane change of 0.2g or less will not trigger out of the G Comfort Parameter to the Main G Table, hence, feels like a limo not a sports car.

There's a number of ways to fix this. It can be one or combination of the following:
Increase Default Rate value, for example by 2.0 to 5.0
Decrease Sensitivity value, for example by 3 to 5
Decrease G Rate Max, for example by 5.0

But if you feel that you have the three settings above set perfectly for your personal preference then you could use the STEERING table to add 5% to 10% damping force at only in the boxes for 10-20 degrees of steering. Adding 5% to 10% 10-20 degrees of steering will cover change type events.

For you guys doing advanced level tuning, please keep in mind that while the DSC Sport module and software are very powerful tools and offer tremendous value in performance improvement and comfort, ultimately the limitation is in the OEM shocks. The OEM shocks respond at ~100ms, cannot respond to command during mid-stroke, and the rebound works better than compression. If you want more than what the OEM shocks can produce, you'll need a set of Tractives DDA. Tractives respond to commands 17x faster, respond to command during mid-stroke, and true bi-directional function.

Croc999

Playing with steering are a good idea - perhaps i will try it.
It's tempting but i'm afraid to get lost in too much settings options

I though to start with G Rate to get faster transition to the main table.

As shocks are concerned - since DCS Tractives are out of my price range and probably an overkill for the 98% of street use - i've started to think about Bilsteins B16 Damptronic.

Tom@TPC Racing

I experimented with the STEERING table and liked the results. This is becoming popular especially among the front engine folks using DSC because they need the damping to manage the front engine mass. Works great for mid/rear engine cars as well to provide damping to small/initial steering activity at lower g's.


Don't be afraid. Just save each version of the change and name it. Can always go back. Adding 5% damping to less than 20 degrees of steering angle ain't going to hurt nothing.


What are the G Comfort settings at now?


OEM PASM shocks are made by Bilstein. The reaction time and limitations are the same for OEM and B16. With B16 you get slightly stiffer springs and ride height adjustment. Its a good value for replacing aging OEM shocks and springs but the limitations are still there if you happen to be tuning to the limits.

Petza914

To me, the biggest deficit in the OEM PASM suspension is insufficient rebound dampening which causes that rear end wallowing feel. The Damptronics are much better in this respect t and I've been very happy with mine for the way I use my car. I installed them prior to the DSC module coming out and the ride and handling difference 's stock was night and day. Adding the DSC box was the icing on the cake to really complete the package.

Petza914

These just posted on 6speed - https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/automotive-parts-accessories-sale-wanted/408745-fs-bilstein-damptronic-coilovers-porsche-997-a.html

no affiliation

RJKflyer

Tom - a few questions:

1. You say 10-20 degrees - this is in fact 10 and 20 degrees PER SECOND (so it's rate of turn not actual angle)?
2. Would you add that 5-10% uniformly on L AND R, and Front AND Rear?
3. Would you then either have >20deg/S as 10/10/10/10?

I.e.

Tom@TPC Racing

1. Yes, it is 10 and 20 degrees per second rate of change.

2. Depends on what you are trying to achieve. For example, if you made other settings that results in the front end feeling too soft during a highway lane change and you only want to front end to feel firmer then only add 5% to the fronts dampers. Ultimately the feel is subjective to each's personal preference so you could added 5% to the rear as well to get the feel that you want.

3. It doesn't have to be progressive since greater rate of change of the steering wheel will very likely create enough lateral G force to trigger stiffer damping of the Main G Table.

I would like to add that the topic of STEERING Table came up with a chat with Mike Levitas, who is the developer of DSC technology, he said "even though my experience with the STEERING Table has been positive for highway lane change type situations, this table should only be used if a user cannot do anymore with the G Comfort Parameters."

kpl

I love the way the car is so planted under heavy breaking, and with so much less brake dive, but how could reduce front end lift when accelerating hard out of low speed turns (autocross)? I'm running the "Substantially firmer" file from your site.

Tom@TPC Racing

Glad to hear you love the increased stability from DSC.

To reduce front end lift during throttle exit you could try one of the two things below or combination of both:
1) Increase rear stiffness using Shock Calibration table.
2) Or use the lower portion of the Main G Table that represents acceleration. It is useful to know approx what amount of g force your car is subjected to when tuning this table.

The "Substantially Firmer" labelled file is only relative to the standard file, and only for G Comfort Parameter. It can be made more firm.

Croc999

BTW - i've tried to change rating according to steering wheel angle - didn't like the feeling.
i'm aware that perhaps i'm just imagining - but i couldn't shake it off

So what i did is to configure shock table in a digressive way - so far it looks like a good combination of beeing quick during lane change, not leaning too much in hard corners but still soaking up in acceptable way high speed bumps/dips.

Tom@TPC Racing

Thanks for your feedback. Happy to know that you are using the DSC tuning software to tune for personal preferences.

Well done on the digressive shock calibration! Its quite awesome to be able to do this without have to remove the shocks, take it apart, get hands all oily and buy pistons.

Sneaky Pete

I just installed the controller in time for a track weekend at the Indianapolis Speedway. Being not so computer saavy Tom and Jordan walked me through the read / write / reset process yesterday. It seems simple after they explained it. I loaded the substantially stiff map and couldn't be happier with the reaction of the car.

Tom and Jordan thanks again!! This is a very cool product.