Loosing my Porsche
04-10-2009, 03:06 AM
#61
Nordschleife Master
She's never seen hand crank windows!I have to tell you though that you must put things in perspective. Crisis happen and priorities must be considered. Your family is first, your possessions last. If you lose your family you lose it all, nothing compares.
BTW... I love crank windows. I rather have them than heavy motors in my doors.
04-10-2009, 03:15 AM
#62
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I think you nailed it...also I hear about putting large down payments on RE...well talk to the guy who put down $100k on a property only to watch it evaporate. $100K on a 6% loan over 30 years is $599 per month...ask that borrower now if he would rather have his payment higher by $600.00 per month or that $100k he put down on the house.
a house is not something you make money from.
a house is a place to live and grow your family.
it's ok to put big down (this is financing, not like leasing a car). when the mkt go upside down on you, hang in there. it will come back in 20-30 years. remember, it's a home, not a money making machine. if you want to invest, invest in income producing property not in your own home. if you made money on your home, that's gravy. dont expect it, then you will be fine.
and if you had small equity and big pmt, when you go upside down, the total effect would be the same as if you had big equity and small pmt, unless you decide to "walk away". i have some philosophical issues with that. i would walk away from investment properties. that's business, you lose money, you declare bankruptcy. no biggie. you go upside down on your home, stick it out. it's your home. when my wife gets sick i dont go out and find a new model. so for me, buying a home, i would pay as much down as i can. 20% is not enough, 40% or more is more like it. your ROE would suck, but again home is NOT an investment. dont be fooled.[/QUOTE]
ppl trying to blame others.
yes the leverage. but that's their business. insurance is all about leverage.
forget CDS, just talk normal car/home/casualty insurance. you think lloyds of london and such are not leveraged? probably a lot worse than 100:1. they bet on probability. if 30 titanic sank in one day, lloyd of london would go belly up. but what's the chance of 30 titanic going down in one day?
that's tough life. i bet everyday that i dont get run over by a semi truck. we knows, i may lose my bet. perhaps i wont be posted tomorrow since i would be under a semi.
04-10-2009, 05:03 AM
#63
I pulled about 35 - 40% of my stock holdings in March of 2007. I was much more heavily invested prior to that. At the time I was not thinking so much about an iminent stock market crash as I was in trying to balance my portfolio risk based upon my age and retirement time horizon. I felt that I was too heavily invested in securities.
When the market continued to rise and not peak until October (or so) of that year I had "sellers remourse" but held firm and now my patience has been rewarded.
So your "observation" that I "didn't invest correctly" is idiotic on its face.
I am not a professinal investor by any means and do not try to time the market. I simply got lucky in selling when I did after having ridden the stock market up since the early nineties. Just dumb luck and I admit it.
Fortunately for me (unlike many other people here including yourself) I don't rely on the vagaries of the real estate and stock market to make a living. I rely, instead, on my profession which is virtually recession proof and has continued to provide me with a very high standard of living. Not boasting but merely providing an asterisk to your inane comments.
Last edited by boolala; 04-10-2009 at 06:20 AM.
04-10-2009, 07:25 AM
#64
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Deanski I feel for you man...I myself am having some financial problems. I am in Real Estate and my income is a 1/3 of what it used to be, although things are picking up. I let my brother take over my lease payments on my 997 for almost 10 mos. He is in the hotel industry and they got hit around Oct. 08 as reservations are only 60% of what they were before. I got the car back in early Oct. and I have been having to make the payments again. The good news is he only put 120 miles on the car in 10 mos.
If there is one thing you will learn especially about leasing is you want to come in with the bare minimum to get you into the car.
In my situation I would have to come in with close to $10k to get out of the car and I am trying to keep my credit remotely reasonable-it has taken a hit, but nothing that can't be recovered in a year or so. My wife had to go back to work, she used to be in the travel industry for a Japanese company. She ended up working as a hostess at a Japanese restaurant after not having to work for 7 years. It kills me to see her going back to work and she hates my car. My payment is almost half the amount of money she brings home a month.
Just keep in mind that you will get one again as things will turn around..and as you can see you aren't the only one going through this right now.
Keep your chin up and be strong and you will be riding high again. I remember the line from Fight Club.."get rid of all your material possessions as they possess you." Something of that sort..yet it is true no matter how it is said.
Dave
If there is one thing you will learn especially about leasing is you want to come in with the bare minimum to get you into the car.
In my situation I would have to come in with close to $10k to get out of the car and I am trying to keep my credit remotely reasonable-it has taken a hit, but nothing that can't be recovered in a year or so. My wife had to go back to work, she used to be in the travel industry for a Japanese company. She ended up working as a hostess at a Japanese restaurant after not having to work for 7 years. It kills me to see her going back to work and she hates my car. My payment is almost half the amount of money she brings home a month.
Just keep in mind that you will get one again as things will turn around..and as you can see you aren't the only one going through this right now.
Keep your chin up and be strong and you will be riding high again. I remember the line from Fight Club.."get rid of all your material possessions as they possess you." Something of that sort..yet it is true no matter how it is said.
Dave
Yes, my wife HATES this car as well and seems to think it stands between her and our relationship. Look, it's my only vice, I do not gamble, go out drinking, "clubing", chasing other women, stay out late etc. I live very moderatly, have a condo and live moderate means.
All I do is drive and detail my car now and then, take her out on trips with it, just try to enjoy it, that's all.
My intention was to purchase it at the end of the lease as I spec's the car for ME, not someone else or to turn it in.
This car is my escape and my reward for long hard work. My father was the same with cars, it was his vice and enjoyment as well long ago. You could asy I'm following his footsteps, but with more issues due to the economy.
Hopefully, I'll find some resolution to this mess.
Deanski
04-10-2009, 07:59 AM
#65
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Thanks Dave and others as well.
Yes, my wife HATES this car as well and seems to think it stands between her and our relationship. Look, it's my only vice, I do not gamble, go out drinking, "clubing", chasing other women, stay out late etc. I live very moderatly, have a condo and live moderate means.
All I do is drive and detail my car now and then, take her out on trips with it, just try to enjoy it, that's all.
My intention was to purchase it at the end of the lease as I spec's the car for ME, not someone else or to turn it in.
This car is my escape and my reward for long hard work. My father was the same with cars, it was his vice and enjoyment as well long ago. You could asy I'm following his footsteps, but with more issues due to the economy.
Hopefully, I'll find some resolution to this mess.
Deanski
Yes, my wife HATES this car as well and seems to think it stands between her and our relationship. Look, it's my only vice, I do not gamble, go out drinking, "clubing", chasing other women, stay out late etc. I live very moderatly, have a condo and live moderate means.
All I do is drive and detail my car now and then, take her out on trips with it, just try to enjoy it, that's all.
My intention was to purchase it at the end of the lease as I spec's the car for ME, not someone else or to turn it in.
This car is my escape and my reward for long hard work. My father was the same with cars, it was his vice and enjoyment as well long ago. You could asy I'm following his footsteps, but with more issues due to the economy.
Hopefully, I'll find some resolution to this mess.
Deanski
Makes perfect sense to me. My wife doesn't really care for any of my cars, I have few vices also, work hard, and she appreciates that if cars are my only vice, she can live with it. Keeping them is lots cheaper than a divorce anyway. I'd rather pay Holberts than a lawyer any day!
04-10-2009, 08:50 AM
#66
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It's odd why wifes have some idea that a car comes between a relationship. To me it's just a vice or hobby for me, that's all, nothing more. It what makes me happy and I enjoy driving it, detailing it etc. Not that I spend hours driving it or detailing it. Just time away from her when she wants time for herself or friends.
I'm not obesssed with it, just hits me that I finally have the ability to own one.
Sure, I hear divorce and threats, but really, it's a car that I enjoy and it makes me feel I accomplished my goal in life. This was one of my goals that I set out long before I met or married.
I've always supported her goals or dreams and cannot understand why everything I shoot for she has an issue with.
Anyway, I know it's "just a car", but it's one that I worked long and hard to obtain and I never give up my dreams for anyone.
Hell, I lost my '69 L-88 Vette long ago so we could purchase a house long ago, now I have to repeat this and for nothing?
Deanski
I'm not obesssed with it, just hits me that I finally have the ability to own one.
Sure, I hear divorce and threats, but really, it's a car that I enjoy and it makes me feel I accomplished my goal in life. This was one of my goals that I set out long before I met or married.
I've always supported her goals or dreams and cannot understand why everything I shoot for she has an issue with.
Anyway, I know it's "just a car", but it's one that I worked long and hard to obtain and I never give up my dreams for anyone.
Hell, I lost my '69 L-88 Vette long ago so we could purchase a house long ago, now I have to repeat this and for nothing?
Deanski
04-10-2009, 09:44 AM
#67
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Very sorry to hear of your situation, Deanski. Unfortunately, there aren't very attractive options for terminating a lease early. I tried to do that with an '02 Boxster, and the choice I was given was to essentially give the car back and continue to make payments, even when I was willing to buy a Carrera with cash. The reason being the dealership is separate from Porsche Financial Services, so the dealership's ability to sell another car is irrelevant to the financing company. I wound up keeping the Boxster until the lease expired, and then purchased my Carrera S with cash. I don't think I would ever lease a car again, for the simple reason that you are essentially stuck with the car for the duration of the lease.
While there are a lot of smart people on this board, I don't think anyone can really offer up a sensible solution. I agree with others that you should not risk your home to keep a luxury item, such as your Porsche. The only option I see is finding someone to take over your lease for the remaining year -- as someone noted, there are some websites that may be helpful. Do you have friends or relatives who may be willing to do that?
While there are a lot of smart people on this board, I don't think anyone can really offer up a sensible solution. I agree with others that you should not risk your home to keep a luxury item, such as your Porsche. The only option I see is finding someone to take over your lease for the remaining year -- as someone noted, there are some websites that may be helpful. Do you have friends or relatives who may be willing to do that?
04-10-2009, 09:50 AM
#68
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Deanski, as you said you never give up on your dreams, this is one dream you have realized. You can now move on to your other dreams and if your future dreams have another P-car in it, you can realize that dream also. You are very fortunate, although you might not see that way at the present, you have another vehicle once you let the P-car go, your health and your family. Maybe the car isn't what you want but it will do until things turn around. Now is the time to pull together with your family, your dreams will still be there tomorrow. Good luck
04-10-2009, 10:12 AM
#69
Race Car
It's odd why wifes have some idea that a car comes between a relationship. To me it's just a vice or hobby for me, that's all, nothing more. It what makes me happy and I enjoy driving it, detailing it etc. Not that I spend hours driving it or detailing it. Just time away from her when she wants time for herself or friends.
I'm not obesssed with it, just hits me that I finally have the ability to own one.
Sure, I hear divorce and threats, but really, it's a car that I enjoy and it makes me feel I accomplished my goal in life. This was one of my goals that I set out long before I met or married.
I've always supported her goals or dreams and cannot understand why everything I shoot for she has an issue with.
Anyway, I know it's "just a car", but it's one that I worked long and hard to obtain and I never give up my dreams for anyone.
Hell, I lost my '69 L-88 Vette long ago so we could purchase a house long ago, now I have to repeat this and for nothing?
Deanski
I'm not obesssed with it, just hits me that I finally have the ability to own one.
Sure, I hear divorce and threats, but really, it's a car that I enjoy and it makes me feel I accomplished my goal in life. This was one of my goals that I set out long before I met or married.
I've always supported her goals or dreams and cannot understand why everything I shoot for she has an issue with.
Anyway, I know it's "just a car", but it's one that I worked long and hard to obtain and I never give up my dreams for anyone.
Hell, I lost my '69 L-88 Vette long ago so we could purchase a house long ago, now I have to repeat this and for nothing?
Deanski
04-10-2009, 10:21 AM
#70
Race Director
are you american?
this country does not understand "saving". so dont preach. if USA understands saving then we wont have the recession.
this country is build on credit.
so once in a blue moon, credit blows up.
some ppl get wiped out. some get lucky.
in the great depression some EXTREMELY wealthy ppl went belly up and not b/c they lived extravagantly. it's the market and it's the american culture.
1/3 of your income on mortgage is considered good in this country. do you know that in some country, we dont spend more than 10% of salary on housing and saving rate is 70-90% of income?
401k is not saving. 401k is a fk'g govt trick
i can go on and on...
finally, the mortgage blow up. many ppl dont understand mortgage, amortization blah blah. they are being swindled by mortgage brokers, real estate brokers. and some times mortgage brokers dont even know what they are selling and underwriters dont know enough about credit. just today, i chewed out no less than 10 underwrites who work for me. they help contribute to the **** we are in.
is it really about saving?
if you saved in 401k or stock market, you are very much fk'd right now.
it's moronic mba like myself who created cmbs, mbs, cdo, credit swaps that no one understands and fk'd up the economy.
it's a system problem not an individual saving prob.
would ANYONE ever dream that RE will drop this much?
would ANYONE ever guess stock would drop 50%?
you can save all you want. you are still fk'd.
i have many friends facing bad situation, and they live in normal condo's driving hondas, dont eat out, they are as frugal as can be and put everything in savings, stocks, bonds, 401k... they are still fk'd.
of course, if you make $10m a year. you lost 60% of your networth, you are ok.
but most ppl do not have that luxury.
this country does not understand "saving". so dont preach. if USA understands saving then we wont have the recession.
this country is build on credit.
so once in a blue moon, credit blows up.
some ppl get wiped out. some get lucky.
in the great depression some EXTREMELY wealthy ppl went belly up and not b/c they lived extravagantly. it's the market and it's the american culture.
1/3 of your income on mortgage is considered good in this country. do you know that in some country, we dont spend more than 10% of salary on housing and saving rate is 70-90% of income?
401k is not saving. 401k is a fk'g govt trick
i can go on and on...
finally, the mortgage blow up. many ppl dont understand mortgage, amortization blah blah. they are being swindled by mortgage brokers, real estate brokers. and some times mortgage brokers dont even know what they are selling and underwriters dont know enough about credit. just today, i chewed out no less than 10 underwrites who work for me. they help contribute to the **** we are in.
is it really about saving?
if you saved in 401k or stock market, you are very much fk'd right now.
it's moronic mba like myself who created cmbs, mbs, cdo, credit swaps that no one understands and fk'd up the economy.
it's a system problem not an individual saving prob.
would ANYONE ever dream that RE will drop this much?
would ANYONE ever guess stock would drop 50%?
you can save all you want. you are still fk'd.
i have many friends facing bad situation, and they live in normal condo's driving hondas, dont eat out, they are as frugal as can be and put everything in savings, stocks, bonds, 401k... they are still fk'd.
of course, if you make $10m a year. you lost 60% of your networth, you are ok.
but most ppl do not have that luxury.
The bottom line is that times are tough, and if you're considering 7/13, you should not be trying to keep the porsche. get it on www.swapaleasae.com or www.leasetrader.com or something immediately. $1000 of extra monthly cash flow could be the difference between bankruptcy and squeaking by.
Can your wife take any job? walmart? some cash flow is better than no cash flow.
Put some old stuff around your house on ebay?
04-10-2009, 01:27 PM
#72
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No. They can't move quick enough.
The problem is that Jim needs action- and FAST.
Come on people, with just $2000 to get the account current, his payment is only $ 715/mo.
1 year left. 10k a year.
NO ONE wants a car of this value for the payment of a E Class?? For ONE year??
And FYI- Porsche Financial does NOT do 'transfers of interest'.
So the car will remain in Jims name, you just make the payments to PFS directly.
NO Brainer!!
The problem is that Jim needs action- and FAST.
Come on people, with just $2000 to get the account current, his payment is only $ 715/mo.
1 year left. 10k a year.
NO ONE wants a car of this value for the payment of a E Class?? For ONE year??
And FYI- Porsche Financial does NOT do 'transfers of interest'.
So the car will remain in Jims name, you just make the payments to PFS directly.
NO Brainer!!
04-10-2009, 02:15 PM
#73
Stoppie,
Do you know if turning in a lease is the same as having the car repo'd for credit purposes? Sounds like OP has bigger fish to fry if he is facing bk, but I am curious about the real impact of walking away from the lease...
Do you know if turning in a lease is the same as having the car repo'd for credit purposes? Sounds like OP has bigger fish to fry if he is facing bk, but I am curious about the real impact of walking away from the lease...
04-10-2009, 03:37 PM
#74
well, yes and no.
a house is not something you make money from.
a house is a place to live and grow your family.
it's ok to put big down (this is financing, not like leasing a car). when the mkt go upside down on you, hang in there. it will come back in 20-30 years. remember, it's a home, not a money making machine. if you want to invest, invest in income producing property not in your own home. if you made money on your home, that's gravy. dont expect it, then you will be fine.
and if you had small equity and big pmt, when you go upside down, the total effect would be the same as if you had big equity and small pmt, unless you decide to "walk away". i have some philosophical issues with that. i would walk away from investment properties. that's business, you lose money, you declare bankruptcy. no biggie. you go upside down on your home, stick it out. it's your home. when my wife gets sick i dont go out and find a new model. so for me, buying a home, i would pay as much down as i can. 20% is not enough, 40% or more is more like it. your ROE would suck, but again home is NOT an investment. dont be fooled.
a house is not something you make money from.
a house is a place to live and grow your family.
it's ok to put big down (this is financing, not like leasing a car). when the mkt go upside down on you, hang in there. it will come back in 20-30 years. remember, it's a home, not a money making machine. if you want to invest, invest in income producing property not in your own home. if you made money on your home, that's gravy. dont expect it, then you will be fine.
and if you had small equity and big pmt, when you go upside down, the total effect would be the same as if you had big equity and small pmt, unless you decide to "walk away". i have some philosophical issues with that. i would walk away from investment properties. that's business, you lose money, you declare bankruptcy. no biggie. you go upside down on your home, stick it out. it's your home. when my wife gets sick i dont go out and find a new model. so for me, buying a home, i would pay as much down as i can. 20% is not enough, 40% or more is more like it. your ROE would suck, but again home is NOT an investment. dont be fooled.
that's just news.
ppl trying to blame others.
yes the leverage. but that's their business. insurance is all about leverage.
forget CDS, just talk normal car/home/casualty insurance. you think lloyds of london and such are not leveraged? probably a lot worse than 100:1. they bet on probability. if 30 titanic sank in one day, lloyd of london would go belly up. but what's the chance of 30 titanic going down in one day?
that's tough life. i bet everyday that i dont get run over by a semi truck. we knows, i may lose my bet. perhaps i wont be posted tomorrow since i would be under a semi.[/QUOTE]
Well that's the other point...people who were buying weren't people who necessarily people who should be buying in the first place. They did it because of the frenzy. The problem is it is taking down the whole economy to a point where people who did put large down payments and thought they have steady employment now find that they don't.
Unfortunately this is just business and part of the cycles that can be had in a dynamic economy such as ours. Big upturns are usually followed by huge corrections. This is part of the game...now the system is cleansing out the bad.
Dave
04-10-2009, 03:43 PM
#75
Thanks Dave and others as well.
Yes, my wife HATES this car as well and seems to think it stands between her and our relationship. Look, it's my only vice, I do not gamble, go out drinking, "clubing", chasing other women, stay out late etc. I live very moderatly, have a condo and live moderate means.
All I do is drive and detail my car now and then, take her out on trips with it, just try to enjoy it, that's all.
My intention was to purchase it at the end of the lease as I spec's the car for ME, not someone else or to turn it in.
This car is my escape and my reward for long hard work. My father was the same with cars, it was his vice and enjoyment as well long ago. You could asy I'm following his footsteps, but with more issues due to the economy.
Hopefully, I'll find some resolution to this mess.
Deanski
Yes, my wife HATES this car as well and seems to think it stands between her and our relationship. Look, it's my only vice, I do not gamble, go out drinking, "clubing", chasing other women, stay out late etc. I live very moderatly, have a condo and live moderate means.
All I do is drive and detail my car now and then, take her out on trips with it, just try to enjoy it, that's all.
My intention was to purchase it at the end of the lease as I spec's the car for ME, not someone else or to turn it in.
This car is my escape and my reward for long hard work. My father was the same with cars, it was his vice and enjoyment as well long ago. You could asy I'm following his footsteps, but with more issues due to the economy.
Hopefully, I'll find some resolution to this mess.
Deanski
I tell my wife I could be at titty bars blowing a gnote there a month on booze, cigs and girls...
The issue is that now that your wife is not working she expects sacrifices to be made. If your wife is not a car person she never will be. My wife is somewhat of a car person (she like the E46M3 I had, thinks I never should have sold it) but doesn't like the PCar for it's flashiness, the fact that it's a Porsche and Speed Yellow to boot. Not to mention the amount of the payment and it's impracticality. Granted I never would have gotten the car if I would have seen things get this bad. It's a decision I have made and I am going to have to live with it. I personally would like to hold on and keep the car and pay it off. I am kind of sick of getting new cars and never owning them.
Anyway..keep your chin up..they are only getting better, if you have to get a new one IMHO it would make it that much more enjoyable for now you know what you had to sacrifice.
Dave