#$@! Blew my engine today #&*#@!
#722
Former Vendor
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The sample rate may or may not be enough to actually show you anything. Thats why I use stand alone data loggers, not depending upon OBDII unless I want them too..
#723
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Will be difficult to use a standalone data logger for cam deviation as it's computed by the DME in real-time based on both the cam position sensors and crank position sensor, which are pulse signals. I don't even know how a standalone data logger can log pulse signals, let alone processing them and compute the cam deviations.
Got your point about it may or may not show up. If some something weird shows up, at least that tells you something is wrong. If nothing bad shows up, the test is inconclsive.
#724
Former Vendor
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A purpose built logger that can use OEM or other sensors can do this, and I have done it. I use these things to develop camshaft profiles and plat against cylinder pressures, or even use transducers in the exhaust to plot changes as well.
That said, this issue would have been found by doing a good, old fashioned sump inspection, more than likely. The sump had a ton of material in the outer edges of it that were very small, and those bits of debris are characteristic with every worn main drive chain that we've seen.
This engine was also NOT qualified for an IMS retrofit as the sump plate had not been pulled off as recently as the engine had been retrofitted. Thats classic. If that would have happened, more than likely this issue would have been caught.
That said, this issue would have been found by doing a good, old fashioned sump inspection, more than likely. The sump had a ton of material in the outer edges of it that were very small, and those bits of debris are characteristic with every worn main drive chain that we've seen.
This engine was also NOT qualified for an IMS retrofit as the sump plate had not been pulled off as recently as the engine had been retrofitted. Thats classic. If that would have happened, more than likely this issue would have been caught.
#725
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A purpose built logger that can use OEM or other sensors can do this, and I have done it. I use these things to develop camshaft profiles and plat against cylinder pressures, or even use transducers in the exhaust to plot changes as well.
That said, this issue would have been found by doing a good, old fashioned sump inspection, more than likely. The sump had a ton of material in the outer edges of it that were very small, and those bits of debris are characteristic with every worn main drive chain that we've seen.
This engine was also NOT qualified for an IMS retrofit as the sump plate had not been pulled off as recently as the engine had been retrofitted. Thats classic. If that would have happened, more than likely this issue would have been caught.
That said, this issue would have been found by doing a good, old fashioned sump inspection, more than likely. The sump had a ton of material in the outer edges of it that were very small, and those bits of debris are characteristic with every worn main drive chain that we've seen.
This engine was also NOT qualified for an IMS retrofit as the sump plate had not been pulled off as recently as the engine had been retrofitted. Thats classic. If that would have happened, more than likely this issue would have been caught.
#726
Former Vendor
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BUT I have pulled off a sump plate in another country, in someone else's shop, using their tools, on a hot engine and swapped it out in less than 40 minutes start to finish and was back on the road. You only need 3 tools to do the job.
Every single car that we see, for ANY reason, has the sump pulled, filter pulled, and gets the finger test.
The sump plate is the window to the soul of the M96/ M97.
#727
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Not necessary.. The IMS Guardian monitors this all the time and chain material is ferrous.
BUT I have pulled off a sump plate in another country, in someone else's shop, using their tools, on a hot engine and swapped it out in less than 40 minutes start to finish and was back on the road. You only need 3 tools to do the job.
Every single car that we see, for ANY reason, has the sump pulled, filter pulled, and gets the finger test.
The sump plate is the window to the soul of the M96/ M97.
BUT I have pulled off a sump plate in another country, in someone else's shop, using their tools, on a hot engine and swapped it out in less than 40 minutes start to finish and was back on the road. You only need 3 tools to do the job.
Every single car that we see, for ANY reason, has the sump pulled, filter pulled, and gets the finger test.
The sump plate is the window to the soul of the M96/ M97.
#728
Former Vendor
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Gotcha. I thought you also meant chain pad material (non-metallic). The IMS guardian is definitely be ideal for this application then. I'm starting to think it's wise to install the IMS guardian just to detect these chain issues on the M96, regardless of whether one has already addressed the IMS bearing.
#729
#730
Former Vendor
#731
Three Wheelin'
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Jake,
I'll be swapping the sump pan on my car, in the next couple of months. I'm assuming that any accumulation of material in my sump is a bad sign, but regarding tensioner pad wear, is the material non-metallic?
Thanks,
Jon
I'll be swapping the sump pan on my car, in the next couple of months. I'm assuming that any accumulation of material in my sump is a bad sign, but regarding tensioner pad wear, is the material non-metallic?
Thanks,
Jon
#732
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Nope, because the deviations don't exist between the banks of cylinders, since this issue retards ALL the cam timing, not just one bank. I have caught a few of these in process by mistake during IMSB qualification processes and the symptoms were very hard to note. I caught one chain almost ready to snap, only because I found one small piece of debris in the sump that came from the chain.
Some things are a silent, symptomless death with this engine. Tick..Tick.. BOOM!
Some things are a silent, symptomless death with this engine. Tick..Tick.. BOOM!
If debris from chain is magnetic, can the guardian should detect this early?
#733
Racer
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: 40th Anni. South OC, CA
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I wonder if an oil analysis would pick up on the PTFE (Teflon) from the chain paddle (guide) wear ?
Also, would strong magnets on the filter housing attract the chain material for inspection?
Are the chains made of ferrous material or are they some type of non-magnetic stainless steel?
Paul
Also, would strong magnets on the filter housing attract the chain material for inspection?
Are the chains made of ferrous material or are they some type of non-magnetic stainless steel?
Paul
#734
Rennlist Member
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I would think a strong magnet would attract ferrous debris. How would you use such a magnet?
Magnetic drainplugs are commonly used this way already.
Last edited by Spokayman; 03-04-2015 at 03:17 PM. Reason: typo
#735
Former Vendor
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I wonder if an oil analysis would pick up on the PTFE (Teflon) from the chain paddle (guide) wear ?
Also, would strong magnets on the filter housing attract the chain material for inspection?
Are the chains made of ferrous material or are they some type of non-magnetic stainless steel?
Paul
Paul
EVERY engine I build has a spin on filter adaptor, using a steel bodied filter, coupled to a magnetic drain plug. Its been that way since 2007.