evoderby

Lack of a knock sensor on the aftermarket ECU is an unlikely cause of the lower top end power since engines are most prone to knock at low revs / high load situations, a bandwidth at which the aftermarket Ecu's programming is delivering significantly more torque right up to the point of max torque / BMEP.

I honestly don't know about the Motronic, but many factory ECU's don't even listen to the knock sensor above 6000rpm due to difficulty in distinguishing knock from noise at higher revs. Again something pointing away from the lack of knock sensing causing lower top end power through using the aftermarket ecu in this thread.

As far as the age old "ignition pushed" comment goes, ignition is ONE of TWO main parameters within an ECU's functionality. The megasquirt system is very easy and intuitive to user adjust...a process I call tuning, the Motronic is not.

Lorenfb

"Again something pointing away from the lack of knock sensing causing lower top end power through using the aftermarket ecu in this thread."

Try re-reading the last few posts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Juha G

This ECU has allowance for aftermarket knock control, and like most (all I think) other aftermarket ECU's, it's not built in like on the factory Motronic.
i.e. we are not comparing this ECU to the factory one. It should be compared to other aftermarket ECUs. So can we please stay on the subject?

The main point of this product is to have a 100% plug'n'play ECU with very EASY user interface. And that's just what it does.

evoderby

Hmmmm, seems like we were typing simultaniously....glad we got the knock sensor thingy out of the way Loren!

Ok, so what I think you're saying is the only valid comparison between Ecu 1 and 2 is when loading the exact same fuel/ignition values into the both of them(?) The engine indeed won't care whether it's Motronic or Megasquirt that's calling the shots, as long as they are the right shots....

.....Imo the whole point of going aftermarket is ease of adjustability (i.e. Orchestrating the right shots for maximum power) without having to reverse engineer the motronic and use emulation software, burn (several sets of) chip(s) etc.

Lorenfb

"The engine indeed won't care whether it's Motronic or Megasquirt that's calling the shots, as long as they are the right shots...."

You got it, finally!

MarinS4

I am curious why you chose to custom build one when there are so many great aftermarket ones available. I have been looking into ECU's and found the Vi-PEC V88 to be a great choice for the 993. If someone made a PNP harness for it (or any good aftermarket ECU) it would be a game changer.

I have played with a few aftermarket ECU's. In the end it comes down to support and tuning capability of the local tuner. I would be reluctant to install something that did not already have a following.

Anyway I applaud your efforts!

Juha G

I don't know how well you read the entire thread but this ECU does not require a PNP harness. It is already PNP. So just plug it in and you're ready to go!

As far as the support, you are right. But MS3 has very good support because it is so widely used all over the world. They even have their own technical discussion forum where you will find answers for the trickiest questions and problems.

The platform is really easy to use. The guy who made the mapping on Jaskas car has been working with Motec as long as they have been in business. For him it was not a problem at all to adapt to the MS3 enviroment.

They run Jaskas car on the dyno for 3 hours straight with no problems and after that he drove back home for another 3 hours. I think it is safe to say that the ECU works...?

Juuso will run his ECU paraller to my Motec to find out if there are problems with the crankshaft position input at higher rpm's.

Jaskas

As Juha noticed there was a real problem with higher rpm. But im sure we can get it sorted soon. Its a shame that the Porsche driving season is over for 2012 and I cant test the car more.

This unit was a real plug and play. Changing the ecu between the motronic/MS takes you about 30 seconds.
Only thing you have to take from the engine bay is a vacuum line.

evoderby

Jaskas,

Many thanks for your efforts, and in depth report!!!!

With regards to the vacuum line you mention, I gather from this the MS ecu has a built in MAP sensor....did you remove the standard 993 hot-wire/MAF from the inlet tract before testing the MS Ecu or just disconnect it from the harness?

I think 9M/Colin found an additional 8HP by running a (quite lengthy) smooth bore airfilter pipe directly from the throttle body, indicating the potential of some HP to be found here....

....something the Motronic can not readily cope with, although the likes of RS Tuning in Germany can convert it to run Alpha N to give the final edge in Cup racing ;-)

Rgds

Stealth 993

I know MS has had issues with the ignition amplification circuit. That might be a place to check.

Stealth 993

A/N requires very precise tuning. It's not very flexible, best for a true race car. Off/on throttle can be a PITA to tune properly.Tip in throttle takes a lot of fine tuning. With electronics today, it's kind of a dinosaur way to tune an engine. I think best way would be to do A/N with MAP and Alt compensation.

Juha G

Yes, but please keep in mind that this ECU only shares the processor with MS, everything else is his own design. Like I posted earlier, the original MS has a lot of cheap (unreliable) components, which Juuso has replaced with proper automotive spec components.
Juuso was quite certain that the problem is in the crank position input filtering. In any case, we will find out what is causing that by running the new ECU paraller to Motec on my 993.

I couldn't agree with you more! Aplha-N (throttle plate angle) based mapping is for racecars. And I think even racecars nowadays have also MAP sensors.

Steve, are you still interested in trying this ECU out? PM me if you are.
Conditions are still the same; no strings attached, no money involved (unless you want to buy the ECU of course). We send you the ECU and you only need to promise you will test it within a couple of weeks.

evoderby

I agree and only mentioned this as, driveability aside, it points towards a top end performance edge. Porsche engineers must have done away with the MAF for a reason on RSR's, and given the drawbacks of pure A/N, outright HP must be the only one.

Since the motronic is not readily capable of running without a (at some point) restrictive air metering device in the inlet tract, this makes for a distinct performance advantage on the MS Ecu's side since it has nothing to do with like for like mapping.

As mentioned, I think Colin's data shows when done right the above is worth 8HP on an engine otherwise flowing 315HP worth of air.

trophy

Have you checked the reference signal to the crank position?

Can you post the dynocharts with the RPM scale visible, would like to see where everything is happening.

Great progress!!!!!

JasonAndreas

This is not the case AT ALL, even for the newer torque based Motronics. You don't need to change a single line of code, it can all be done by modifying the existing (non-fueling & ignition) maps and a few flags (which you really don't even need to but...)