I'm tired of this "designed to be driven hard" nonsense
02-19-2011, 01:21 PM
#241
R.I.P
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THe theory is:
high rpm<====bad===good===>low rpm
high engine load<===bad===good===>low engine load
For any given speed there are 6 combinations of load and rpm. As you select a lower gear, rpms go up (bad) and engine load goes down (good). Clearly there is no simple rule to follow that is "good" for the engine.
There always is a sweet spot for the type of driving you are doing. If you are accelerating and braking a lot, you want to have higher rpms. If you are cruising at a steady speed on the highway you can get by with lower rpms. I don't look at it so much as driving hard or easy, but driving it intelligently.
I am a proponent of a proper engine break in when the car is new, and then a proper warm up when the car is cold. Then I proceed to drive intelligently and enjoy my car, a lot. Sometimes cruising down the highway, sometimes heelin n toein through some s curves.
high rpm<====bad===good===>low rpm
high engine load<===bad===good===>low engine load
For any given speed there are 6 combinations of load and rpm. As you select a lower gear, rpms go up (bad) and engine load goes down (good). Clearly there is no simple rule to follow that is "good" for the engine.
There always is a sweet spot for the type of driving you are doing. If you are accelerating and braking a lot, you want to have higher rpms. If you are cruising at a steady speed on the highway you can get by with lower rpms. I don't look at it so much as driving hard or easy, but driving it intelligently.
I am a proponent of a proper engine break in when the car is new, and then a proper warm up when the car is cold. Then I proceed to drive intelligently and enjoy my car, a lot. Sometimes cruising down the highway, sometimes heelin n toein through some s curves.
Last edited by richardew; 02-19-2011 at 03:12 PM. Reason: I can't spell
02-19-2011, 01:45 PM
#242
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THe theory is:
high rpm<====bad===good===>low rpm
high engine load<===bad===good===>low engine load
For any given speed there are 6 combinations of load and rpm. As you select a lower gear, rpms go up (bad) and engine load goes down (good). Clearly there is no simple rule to follow that is "good" for the engine.
There always is a sweet spot for the type of driving you are doing. If you are accelerating and braking a lot, you want to have higher rpms. If you are cruising at a steady speed on the highway you can get by with lower rpms. I don't look at it so much as driving hard or easy, but driving it intelligently.
I am a proponent of a proper engine break in when the car is new, and then a proper warm up when the car is cold. Then I proceed to drive intelligently and enjoy my car, a lot. Sometimes cruising down the highway, sometimes heelin n towin through some s curves.
high rpm<====bad===good===>low rpm
high engine load<===bad===good===>low engine load
For any given speed there are 6 combinations of load and rpm. As you select a lower gear, rpms go up (bad) and engine load goes down (good). Clearly there is no simple rule to follow that is "good" for the engine.
There always is a sweet spot for the type of driving you are doing. If you are accelerating and braking a lot, you want to have higher rpms. If you are cruising at a steady speed on the highway you can get by with lower rpms. I don't look at it so much as driving hard or easy, but driving it intelligently.
I am a proponent of a proper engine break in when the car is new, and then a proper warm up when the car is cold. Then I proceed to drive intelligently and enjoy my car, a lot. Sometimes cruising down the highway, sometimes heelin n towin through some s curves.
Some live healthy and die young. Others live hard and die old. Sometimes **** just happens, regardless of the situation in life or with cars. The Sunday driver who needs a top end rebuild at 60k on the clock and the 268k vehicle that seems to just keep chugging along--whats the theory behind that? There is none---its just the way it is.
02-19-2011, 05:23 PM
#243
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Maybe you need to start your own car company and build cars to the quality you expect. Don't forget it needs to be attractive, appeal to it's target market which no matter how small has wide-ranging expectations, good performance relative to it's competition, make it conform to worldwide regulations, and make it last. Good luck.
02-19-2011, 05:46 PM
#244
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02-19-2011, 06:16 PM
#246
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02-19-2011, 06:44 PM
#247
Race Director
Thread Starter
Quality relative to what? I'm serious. Apparently ALL cars are garbage in your mind. In order to come to this conclusion you MUST have owned something better. I'd really like to know what that is. And if you say E36 I'll laugh, not because I think the E36 3-series was a bad car but because it's not perfect either.
Maybe you need to start your own car company and build cars to the quality you expect. Don't forget it needs to be attractive, appeal to it's target market which no matter how small has wide-ranging expectations, good performance relative to it's competition, make it conform to worldwide regulations, and make it last. Good luck.
Maybe you need to start your own car company and build cars to the quality you expect. Don't forget it needs to be attractive, appeal to it's target market which no matter how small has wide-ranging expectations, good performance relative to it's competition, make it conform to worldwide regulations, and make it last. Good luck.
The E36 is a great car but its far from perfect as well.
Here's a vehicle that has scored a perfect 5 in J.D. Power's survey of Initial Quality for the past six years and between 3.5 and 5 in Overall Dependability for four out of the past five years. While most Porsche owners are reluctant to breathe a bad word about the brand for fear of being tossed out of the "club," there has to be something behind years of stellar satisfaction ratings. And if you're paying a base price of $77,800 — and nobody ever pays base price on a Porsche 911 — you have a right to demand perfection.
02-20-2011, 04:27 PM
#249
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If I were Porsche, and was designing a car...
and knowing that the car could be driven either hard or not hard...
and it being a "sports car"
I would most likely design it with the intent that it be driven hard...
Of course I have no proof that such elaborate, convoluted thinking actually occurred.
and knowing that the car could be driven either hard or not hard...
and it being a "sports car"
I would most likely design it with the intent that it be driven hard...
Of course I have no proof that such elaborate, convoluted thinking actually occurred.
02-20-2011, 07:18 PM
#250
Rennlist Member
If I were Porsche, and was designing a car...
and knowing that the car could be driven either hard or not hard...
and it being a "sports car"
I would most likely design it with the intent that it be driven hard...
Of course I have no proof that such elaborate, convoluted thinking actually occurred.
and knowing that the car could be driven either hard or not hard...
and it being a "sports car"
I would most likely design it with the intent that it be driven hard...
Of course I have no proof that such elaborate, convoluted thinking actually occurred.
02-20-2011, 07:57 PM
#252
Was there any consensus?
Cliff notes?
Cliff notes?
02-20-2011, 11:12 PM
#254
Rennlist Member
Since Quad has a financial background, and assuming with some certainty based on this post, that he has a probable bean counter mentality, he wanted tangible proof on something with just too many influencing variables to arrive at a distinct answer with black and white proof....
As many of you have probably dealt with financial people, you know it can be infuriating because sometime stuff just happens in business, things sometimes are just the way they are, etc. and that is about it..........proof difficult to put on paper or in black and white.....
It is a similar dynamic to when someone says someone is an "blank hole" and there is no real answer or proof that can be given when someone asks why....they just are......
The answer or proof provided for this "interesting topic or question" (to be consistent with my previous post), needs to be satisfied within a black and white expectation which is not practical ............therefore it is proposed that the post be informally retired for prosperity for future searchers of this topic to review for pure entertainment or amazement that it went on this long........frankly it has been amusing for us all to review and comment before the actual April Fool's Day this year......
As many of you have probably dealt with financial people, you know it can be infuriating because sometime stuff just happens in business, things sometimes are just the way they are, etc. and that is about it..........proof difficult to put on paper or in black and white.....
It is a similar dynamic to when someone says someone is an "blank hole" and there is no real answer or proof that can be given when someone asks why....they just are......
The answer or proof provided for this "interesting topic or question" (to be consistent with my previous post), needs to be satisfied within a black and white expectation which is not practical ............therefore it is proposed that the post be informally retired for prosperity for future searchers of this topic to review for pure entertainment or amazement that it went on this long........frankly it has been amusing for us all to review and comment before the actual April Fool's Day this year......
02-21-2011, 04:50 AM
#255
In my mind, the harder you drive, the more wear you cause. I find it hard to accept any other conclusion.
If a car gets clogged up and needs to be driven hard to run healthily, then it's been badly designed for road use.
OT
Changing gears at the "optimal" 4000-4500 revs as some have suggested, will quickly result in loosing your licence. In town you'd probably ever need to use 1st gear.
If there is no proof either way on this topic, I would rather take the risk and drive calmly.
With the occasional BLAST
If a car gets clogged up and needs to be driven hard to run healthily, then it's been badly designed for road use.
OT
Changing gears at the "optimal" 4000-4500 revs as some have suggested, will quickly result in loosing your licence. In town you'd probably ever need to use 1st gear.
If there is no proof either way on this topic, I would rather take the risk and drive calmly.
With the occasional BLAST
Last edited by Bouzoukikid; 02-21-2011 at 05:59 AM.