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2020 C2S, been tuned since 7k miles now at 17k. The 93 octane tune has been pretty good, but there are occasional issues that are more of a nuisance than anything serious - PASM errors, certain features disabled. Overall, happy with the 93 map and I’m sure Mitch and the team would take care of the above I’d I reached out.
Unfortunately, I cannot say the same for the e85 map. Have had issues from the get to as have a few others in the board. Seemed like a rushed beta tune versus a final product. The team has been quick to respond, but after a few attempts I’m done with the e85 tune - not letting my car be the guinea pig.
had same exact issue with my e85 tune on my ‘20 C2S where it would hang at redline but was happy to go back to 93 octane (never had issues with it). The M-eng gang gave me multiple revisions to work with all my mods so I’m super impressed with their dedication and fast support. Wouldn’t go with any other tuner.
Last edited by reddsektor; 01-28-2024 at 02:01 AM.
Thanks Mitch. While my car was a challenge to get right, I don't think many other vendors would or could offer the level of service that you guys have provided. Always responsive with a goal to get it where it needed to be. Glad at least for now, I don't have to worry about replacing the injectors.
What was the answer for your car? I am still trying to get a tune that works. I'm on version 7 so far.
What was the answer for your car? I am still trying to get a tune that works. I'm on version 7 so far.
I’m told it was the ROM version on my car, they’ve been able to get it to hit intended boost/torque targets. @M Engineering can comment further if they like. Car continues to run good. Sending another datalog over after a timing adjustment.
I’m told it was the ROM version on my car, they’ve been able to get it to hit intended boost/torque targets. @M Engineering can comment further if they like. Car continues to run good. Sending another datalog over after a timing adjustment.
They never say what they are doing. Just, here, try this.
They never say what they are doing. Just, here, try this.
Guarntee they will tell you what adjustments they are making to the tune, just ask.
I'm not certain how many end users understand the complexities that go into a tune for a turbo charged/ non turbo, fuel injected, EPA/ EU compliant vehicle.
Guarntee they will tell you what adjustments they are making to the tune, just ask.
I'm not certain how many end users understand the complexities that go into a tune for a turbo charged/ non turbo, fuel injected, EPA/ EU compliant vehicle.
you are the one person who is not happy with m-engineering. instead of going down a rabbit hole that has no joy, perhaps find another to go down. lots of other tuning options, yes?
@991.1 Guy we get it, you're unhappy. Please discontinue bringing it up again and again and again. Thanks.
I didn't say I was unhappy, just that I have been unlucky or have a difficult car to tune. There are some box codes that are more difficult than others and this is common knowledge amongst tuners.
I want to switch gears a bit here and show you guys some more of the development side of what we do here.
We are testing with our in house 992 Carrera 4S. This is our test mule for testing parts, and tuning so we can see what the cars are actually doing when increasing power out.
I attached a few pictures of one of the EMAP canisters for the Carrera. We will start with one for each turbo and measure what EMAP is stock, and then turn power up. Once we do that we will then switch the exhaust out with a bigger unit and run the same tests. We did this same thing in the 992 Turbo S so that we knew how much boost pressure we were achieving especially when running 35psi(g) of boost pressure. We plotted that with a bunch of combinations of exhausts as well as one set of headers. The data is pretty eye opening from those tests, but these ones we will make more public, since I feel like you guys want to see some more technical data.
For those curious, the EMAP sensors measure exhaust pressure from the engine and turbos. Think of boost pressure but instead of inlet manifold pressure, this measures the backpressure that increased power is outputting in Psi (or whatever unit you desire) It is using AEM 10 bar pressure transducers with T1 Race EMAP mufflers. The mufflers are used as a filter, so that the exhaust pulses don't throw the readings off, and gives us a much cleaner pressure channel. This is a quick log I grabbed from doing some intercooler testing in house so we could validate data and just simply measure what the stock and aftermarket intercoolers looked like when compared to each other. We have much better data plots but I figured I would throw this one up.
And this is what one of the EMAP setups looks like before it goes onto the car:
Stay tuned as we get some more data from this. This test we will run more sensors on the car and use a Motec C127 dash as well as our custom logging to tie it all together. Should be fun!
I want to switch gears a bit here and show you guys some more of the development side of what we do here.
We are testing with our in house 992 Carrera 4S. This is our test mule for testing parts, and tuning so we can see what the cars are actually doing when increasing power out.
I attached a few pictures of one of the EMAP canisters for the Carrera. We will start with one for each turbo and measure what EMAP is stock, and then turn power up. Once we do that we will then switch the exhaust out with a bigger unit and run the same tests. We did this same thing in the 992 Turbo S so that we knew how much boost pressure we were achieving especially when running 35psi(g) of boost pressure. We plotted that with a bunch of combinations of exhausts as well as one set of headers. The data is pretty eye opening from those tests, but these ones we will make more public, since I feel like you guys want to see some more technical data.
For those curious, the EMAP sensors measure exhaust pressure from the engine and turbos. Think of boost pressure but instead of inlet manifold pressure, this measures the backpressure that increased power is outputting in Psi (or whatever unit you desire) It is using AEM 10 bar pressure transducers with T1 Race EMAP mufflers. The mufflers are used as a filter, so that the exhaust pulses don't throw the readings off, and gives us a much cleaner pressure channel. This is a quick log I grabbed from doing some intercooler testing in house so we could validate data and just simply measure what the stock and aftermarket intercoolers looked like when compared to each other. We have much better data plots but I figured I would throw this one up.
And this is what one of the EMAP setups looks like before it goes onto the car:
Stay tuned as we get some more data from this. This test we will run more sensors on the car and use a Motec C127 dash as well as our custom logging to tie it all together. Should be fun!
--The Janitor
Mitch M
Can you help us understand the objective or end goal of this testing? For example, are you trying to see if different combinations of exhaust components has an effect on power or EGT?
Can you help us understand the objective or end goal of this testing? For example, are you trying to see if different combinations of exhaust components has an effect on power or EGT?
Of course! The reason that we test this is so that we can measure the "back" pressure that the turbos are seeing. What, in theory, you would want to accomplish it to have a pressure ratio across the engine from the inlet to the outlet be 1:1 as a ratio. Now this is very hard to do, and on street cars it cannot typically be done unless you have a big turbo with a large turbine housing or something, but that also has its draw backs. So typically we try and keep the pressure ratio at no more than 2:1, so if 30psi(g) then we want to stay at or no more than 60psi(g). This sounds high, but if you measured a lot of cars and a lot of tunes, you would be amazed at what they run in terms of the pressure ratio. For reference Jon Hebbeln and I did this test many ages ago ( we are old) at our old company. What we did was take my 997.1 Turbo with stock turbos and run it at 21psi(g) of pressure on E85 (ethanol) and measured EMAP. Holding 21psi to redline I would have to look back but I think we were around 80psi(g) of pressure. The downside with running this much pressure is that it creates a lot of heat, and it can create damage pretty quickly to turbos. Turbo's like the VTG are actually a bit on the fragile side, so do not tolerate high EMAP, high turbo speed conditions. It will cause them to fail rather quickly.
Now the other reason for all of this a few things. It is showing us empirical data of how well parts work. Things like exhausts, headers, intercoolers, etc. We don't make these things, so sometimes we do it for 3rd party companies which many of you use on your cars today, to give a real engineering analysis of things like pressure drop, intercooler efficiency, exhaust efficiency, header efficiency etc. The other we learn is what doesn't work, and we relay that to customers as best as we can. We don't make money on hard parts for the most part, we simply want to make sure customers know the best parts to use, and which ones not too use. We do this not to throw anyone under the bus, but a lot of the time we will reach out to companies and share with them the data so they can better there product.
Long story short we do this so we know that we are making calibrations that are quality, not pushing a car to its edge. We know how much each and every Porsche means to everyone we work with, as we all live and breath this. So we simply want empirical data that tells us exactly what we want to know, so that we can better our products, and maybe others along the way. Hence the shirts and hats we made that said "In god we trust, all others bring data." We are a very data driven company, so we outfit cars like this so we know that what we are doing is working, plain and simple.
I hope that helps. If you want a more math sided answer I can do that too.
I just found out I have Mechanical Breakdown Insurance from Geico that will cover any mechanical breakdown if manufacturer doesn't pick up the bill. This means I can run a tune and if the engine explodes then I pay $250 for a replacement.
I just found out I have Mechanical Breakdown Insurance from Geico that will cover any mechanical breakdown if manufacturer doesn't pick up the bill. This means I can run a tune and if the engine explodes then I pay $250 for a replacement.
01-28-2024, 01:58 AM
