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Presenter: “One of the questions I had coming here is... I loved the rear steer in all your cars since the 991 generation. Why did you get rid of it?”
Porsche Engineer: “I think the most important reason is to improve the weight of the car, to get out some weight, because this car is the lightest 992 we have ever done and we wanted to achieve some numbers to get as much weight out of the car as possible. The second reason is we wanted to have a very clear driving behavior.. so very analog with all its disadvantages as well.”
Nice catch.
But I think, the important nuggets come after that, at 8:00 and the slide, at 8:12 - changed (lowered) lock ratios in the diff, resulting in a "freer diff", to make up for the loss of the RAS (regarding initial turn result and feel). Also, different steering ratio, PASM, PSM and steering servo tuning, etc". It's like, how can we achieve an effect similar to RAS but without the weight and "external inputs".
Thus, Porsche didn't just removed RAS, but also made other changes.
See the first 3-4 sentences in here: https://rennlist.com/forums/992/1230...l#post19169889. I was not that "far off" actually
Knowing now all the above: a lightweight 911, manual gearbox, with the ultra rev happy RS engine, (light) one mass flywheel, freer diff and changes to PASM, steering ratio and steering servo tuning, magnesium ultralight wheels, etc...this car is FUN!
I appreciate your comments, will try to stay more focused. I’m back to my Porsche programming, 🤭, living the dream of the drive! (11 days till delivery) more driving less writing. 😎
Not to rain on your parade, but given that we are on the same ship, you do know that it has been delayed? It is scheduled to arrive at its first port in Davisville, RI on Dec 23/24 and then it has to travel to Baltimore, unload there, and then make the journey to Jacksonville.
Edit: Added screenshot of live tracking.
Last edited by RatherJaded; 12-19-2023 at 02:33 PM.
@SEA2ATX I don't want to take away from your thorough analysis but to me, it reads like it's leaning against the wrong wall. Being on this thread for nearly a year and a half, the argument/concern against RAS has consistently been about how if affects feel, not reducing weight. I also don't ever remember anyone arguing that RAS is technically inferior. The problem is, and yes, this is anecdotal because we're talking about feel here, many journos and owners have reported that RAS makes the car feel less 911 and more mid engine, a sensation of intervention, and a synthetic feel. Given that most people drawn to the T bought into the marketing of "a purist's 911" many of us, myself included, don't see RAS as something that will add to that purism but rather take away from it. I for one, I'm fully aware that a RAS equipped car is ever so slightly technically superior, especially at the track, and passed on it not once but twice since I'm now on my second RAS-free T order. I'll gladly take the 15lb loss but the main reason I excluded RAS is wishing to keep the original 911 feel, even at the expense of some performance that many claim can't even be felt on spirited road driving.
Not to rain on your parade, but given that we are on the same ship, you do know that it has been delayed? It is scheduled to arrive at its first port in Davisville, RI on Dec 23/24 and then it has to travel to Baltimore, unload there, and then make the journey to Jacksonville.
Edit: Added screenshot of live tracking.
Yes! Do not put any weight on the tentative dates once it’s on a ship. I feel like I got lucky with a 2 week handover delay.
@SEA2ATX I don't want to take away from your thorough analysis but to me, it reads like it's leaning against the wrong wall. Being on this thread for nearly a year and a half, the argument/concern against RAS has consistently been about how if affects feel, not reducing weight. I also don't ever remember anyone arguing that RAS is technically inferior. The problem is, and yes, this is anecdotal because we're talking about feel here, many journos and owners have reported that RAS makes the car feel less 911 and more mid engine, a sensation of intervention, and a synthetic feel. Given that most people drawn to the T bought into the marketing of "a purist's 911" many of us, myself included, don't see RAS as something that will add to that purism but rather take away from it. I for one, I'm fully aware that a RAS equipped car is ever so slightly technically superior, especially at the track, and passed on it not once but twice since I'm now on my second RAS-free T order. I'll gladly take the 15lb loss but the main reason I excluded RAS is wishing to keep the original 911 feel, even at the expense of some performance that many claim can't even be felt on spirited road driving.
Another counter in the RAS debate: Remember that the 911's wheelbase has grown significantly over the years. RAS effectively shortens the wheelbase, bringing it back to the "pure" 911s we ALL harp on about.. And i maintain my stance that in no way does an RAS equipped 911 feel any less pure or any less "911-like". In all honesty I've yet to see or read a negative review on a 911 equipped with RAS. And trust me, I've seen and read a LOT.
Another counter in the RAS debate: Remember that the 911's wheelbase has grown significantly over the years. RAS effectively shortens the wheelbase, bringing it back to the "pure" 911s we ALL harp on about.. And i maintain my stance that in no way does an RAS equipped 911 feel any less pure or any less "911-like". In all honesty I've yet to see or read a negative review on a 911 equipped with RAS. And trust me, I've seen and read a LOT.
Most journalists have never received a 911 without that feature. Also, it only shortens the wheelbase below 31mph. Else it's neutral between 31 and 51, and lengthens the wheelbase after that
Not to rain on your parade, but given that we are on the same ship, you do know that it has been delayed? It is scheduled to arrive at its first port in Davisville, RI on Dec 23/24 and then it has to travel to Baltimore, unload there, and then make the journey to Jacksonville.
Edit: Added screenshot of live tracking.
why is it going to two ports? I was unaware Porsche used Baltimore ports.
Another counter in the RAS debate: Remember that the 911's wheelbase has grown significantly over the years. RAS effectively shortens the wheelbase, bringing it back to the "pure" 911s we ALL harp on about.. And i maintain my stance that in no way does an RAS equipped 911 feel any less pure or any less "911-like". In all honesty I've yet to see or read a negative review on a 911 equipped with RAS. And trust me, I've seen and read a LOT.
My understanding at higher speeds rear steers same direction as fronts…effectively extending the wheelbase for more stability during higher speed cornering. Anyway, my T without RWS feels plenty stable thru corners at ridiculous speeds….
The best thing I heard this engineer say in that vid…
Lastly, how come no 1 talking about main benefit of RWS? Gr8 for doing donuts 🍩 Love Subies 😀
Most journalists have never received a 911 without that feature. Also, it only shortens the wheelbase below 31mph. Else it's neutral between 31 and 51, and lengthens the wheelbase after that
Perfectly reasonable response. I'm just not of the belief that RAS somehow makes the car less "pure" (beginning to dislike that word), less "911 like", more mid-engine like, or anything like that. Everyone can pick with or without RAS, but that doesn't make RAS "less" in any way, shape or form.
Perfectly reasonable response. I'm just not of the belief that RAS somehow makes the car less "pure" (beginning to dislike that word), less "911 like", more mid-engine like, or anything like that. Everyone can pick with or without RAS, but that doesn't make RAS "less" in any way, shape or form.
My definition of pure is to have the least amount of computer intervention possible. That's obviously impossible with modern cars, but on a spectrum I think you can have more and less pure driving experiences. Someone else's definition of pure might be much more basic. For example it's available in stick and it's RWD and that checks all the boxes for them. For others it's whatever combination of different factors. For me it's computers and assistance systems. Even if they ultimately make the car go faster
My definition of pure is to have the least amount of computer intervention possible. That's obviously impossible with modern cars, but on a spectrum I think you can have more and less pure driving experiences. Someone else's definition of pure might be much more basic. For example it's available in stick and it's RWD and that checks all the boxes for them. For others it's whatever combination of different factors. For me it's computers and assistance systems. Even if they ultimately make the car go faster
When we're talking about a 3300lb turbocharged 911 with ABS, stability control, traction control, torque vectoring, adaptive shocks, digital gauges (except the tach) among other things I'd say we're pretty far from pure.
Not to rain on your parade, but given that we are on the same ship, you do know that it has been delayed? It is scheduled to arrive at its first port in Davisville, RI on Dec 23/24 and then it has to travel to Baltimore, unload there, and then make the journey to Jacksonville.
Edit: Added screenshot of live tracking.
OK, this is very strange and I need clarification. My charts show one 2 stops from Germany, Jacksonville and Miami. FL.
Last edited by Shortseller; 12-19-2023 at 04:19 PM.
why is it going to two ports? I was unaware Porsche used Baltimore ports.
Siem Confucius for this journey has always been scheduled for four North American port stops via Davisville, Baltimore, Jacksonville, and Veracruz, MX .
Edit: Added VAG ship scheduled with Siem Confucius itinerary.
Last edited by RatherJaded; 12-19-2023 at 04:06 PM.
12-19-2023, 01:58 PM
