Mercuriell

Good comment / in 1500 miles Ive lost control of my GT3 twice, drifting due to turn/speed mismatch/ thankfully no harm apart from severe driver embarrassment - never happened in my TTS. Has made me rethink seriously wtf am I doing with a track focussed car on public roads - even feeling apprehensive about its forthcoming track debut- maybe a bit of fear a positive thing. I feel in retrospect the TTS looked out for the driver more and I felt safer in it.

Engro

TT/TTS is safer and you have to be way over the limit and aids turned off to spin on track. I can’t count how many gt3s I’ve seen spin on track probably because it’s much harder to extract speed than TT/TTS.
Average driver can get better times in the turbo plus car forgives your mistakes and you feel invincible I’m an average driver and able to get insane times that would be much harder in gt3 on the track.
I will say in TT/TTS your sense of speed is lost because you get used to the crazy speeds that would terrify normal drivers. Going 120, 130, 140, 150mph is effortless so you feel safe until you aren’t.
RIP the driver and passenger.

Karl911

Both cars have the same Nannie’s. I own both, 992 TTS and a 992 GT3 .
YOU GOT IT TOTALLY BACKWARDS. GT 3 is way easier drive fast. TTS is a handful.
GT3 is way more enjoyable, just flows beautiful thru the corners, vs. TTS is high powered pig,
(525lbs more) Simple put, Finesse vs Brawn. Which one wins?depends on the track!

ipse dixit

I think you and Engro have different definitions of "easier to drive" fast.

You're talking about going fast in a circuit, i.e., where you actually have to turn the wheel.

Engro is talking about fast in a straight line, which is where the TT/TTS really shines, as it's so effortless. Like a Rolls Royce on caffeinated steroids.

abiazis

I felt having owned both:

The GT3 is like a scalpel and the smallest misdirection can create a more immediate problem..........as far as speed......a hard shove in the back....

The TTS can rescue you mostly due to all wheel drive and more forgiving chassis settings........... as far as speed......being pulled by a train with endless power....

Both can potentially get you in trouble.............on street or track.......both exhilarating......

Dr. G

I’m still waiting for my GT3 but I’m going to assume that at the lower limits of “getting in trouble” you’d fare far worse in the TTS because you’re going to be going a hell of a lot faster when it happens. That’s not to say that you can’t get in trouble at high speeds in the GT3, but I imagine you can lose the GT3 at much lower speeds than the TTS on the same road in the same conditions if you’re not paying attention/know what you’re doing. The TTS seems to defy physics - right up until the point that it doesn’t. By that time you’re probably carrying ludicrous speed and the potential for serious injury is much greater.

ipse dixit

Said this before, and I will say it again here.

The TT/TTS makes you feel like a great driver.

The GT3 makes you want to be a better driver.

AlexCeres

The AWD traction control is much more nanny-full than a gt3 and can cover a lot more driver oopsies. The TTS wants to go where you tell it to go, no matter what. The gt3 kinda wants to kill you, but in a very fun and dramatic way.

Folks seem to radically underestimate the difference in tires. The TTS OEM is Michelin PS4S or similar. These are just flat out better on the street and MUCH more forgiving. The cup 2 gt3 tires need to warm up. In theory sure they have better dry traction. In practice, they don’t except on longer trips. And even a little water makes it game over. They wear faster and just aren’t good street tires for daily use. And I say that in CA where it’s sunny 10 months a year and never drops below 40. Track tires are pretty high maintenance for street driving.

911dude41

You guys are wrong about the TTS. It's less safe than a GT3. I'd rather oversteer than understeer. It's easier to explore and find the limits of the TTS, they come pretty quick. You get this false sense and notion most people in here are talking about. That the nannies this and that. Nannies don't defy physics, and the suspension/tire limit of the TTS combined with brute force can be quite dangerous.


The TTS is not "point and go". That's a myth and an overplayed journalist line like the Carrera GTS is the "middle of the line" or "sweet spot" 911. Michelin PS4S understeer on the street unless you're driving like a bitch, but at that point most cars on the road are point and go. You don't need to be driving recklessly to expose the handling limits on a TTS.

911dude41

This post is spot on. The AWD is detrimental to handling and grip. It's good for snow. A Carrera GTS will out handle and is safer to drive than a TTS.

The famous name "Widowmaker" belongs to a turbocharged 911.

Patton250

Congratulations. You are the first person in Internet history, at least that I have read, that says a rear wheel drive vehicle is safer to drive than an all-wheel-drive vehicle. I’ll be glad to pay for your plane ticket to Germany where you can tell those idiots at Porsche, BMW, Mercedes and Audi how stupid they are. After that you can fly up to Subaru and let them how dumb they are also. When you get back to America you might wanna head up to the northeast and let all those dummies know why the rear wheel drive vehicle is better in the snow as well. You could really help out humanity here as far as driving safety. I appreciate your input. And here I thought all those guys with American muscle cars that were plowing their vehicles into the wall after they lost control was because of their rear wheel drive cars. All this time I’ve been wrong.

eclou

I think everyone is trying to relay the same message albeit from different perspectives. An AWD car is more controllable when there is less traction up to a certain point. Rallye cars and desert runners are all AWD. The RWD sports cars usually have insane aero downforce to compensate for traction at high speeds but that also has limits.

The biggest message is one has to respect the road surface qualities. You have maybe 4 palm sized contact patches at speeds in the corner. That's it. On a crotch rocket that goes down to a few thumb prints. Any pinecone, rock, freshly painted stripe or asphalt patch becomes a potential nail in your grave. I never became so hyper aware of surfaces until racing on two wheels - no cage, no harnesses, no HANS, nothing but physics.

These two poor guys could have been ANY of us. They likely had some driving experience and were in the vehicle that beat all modified Porsches at Pikes Peak. Whatever road harzard took them out likely would have killed anyone in any car. That's the wake up call.

911dude41

GT3 RWD. Superior handling, grip and control
GT3 RS RWD. " "
GT2 RS RWD. " "

AWD is detrimental. AWD won't save you. AWD will get you moving under low traction surfaces like ice/water/snow/loose gravel. Barreling down in an AWD will not save you anymore than a RWD/FWD when you want to take a turn or hit the brakes. AWD is perfect for getting you out of your driveway in east coast weather or launching from zero.

This is coming from a TTS owner. I like the AWD, but it's not my teddy bear like many AWD car owners I know. People hold AWD in the same regard a toddler holds it's blankie.

I have recently gotten a track alignment and dialed in the camber along with Cup 2's. Stock size Cup 2 and 265/325 Cup 2. The TTS still understeers and is a handful. This is in direct comparison with a GT3 though, the TTS or any modern 911 still offers superior handling to 95-98% of the cars on the road.
Bingo.

Patton250

Do you want the plane ticket or not? Obviously those engineers over there can learn from you. By the time you’re done with them they will realize how stupid they have been.

911dude41

You buying?