ipse dixit

+1

And, fwiw, both the 1.1 and 1.2 variants in that video sound rather unremarkable.

I've never felt the the 911 sounded all that great until you get it to the top-end near the redline. Then, it howls. But, really, who drives like a maniac like that unless you're on track. And then if you are on a track, between the helmet and/or trying to stay on your line, it's pretty hard to focus on the sound of the engine.

If people want nice low-end engine growl, get an Aston or a Lambo, and tool around town revving those monster sized V12 or V8's to your heart's desire. Or a Vette if you want to be economical about it. Maybe even the new Mustang GT350 with the flat-plane crankshaft V8.

cajerseyboy

It depends on what you mean by "better performer". For me, I feel like I have the best all around sports car / daily driver built by Porsche. I love the engine, love the building acceleration it provides, the responsiveness, the adaptability with PSE, and yes the SOUND! . The whole package. It just works. In fact I had the opportunity to build a 17' C2S but I passed on it because IMO the car looses some character in how the turbo engine provides power. Porsche wouldn't have gone with a turbo engine in the 911 if it weren't for gov regulations...which says a lot.

Why is sound so important? Golfers know this, but in golf the "feel" of a club is directly related to the sound the ball makes at contact with the club. IMO this is the same reaction we experience in our 911s. It provides a feeling beyond just hearing the noise. You hear the car differently so you feel the car differently and thus the performance feels different.

With that said, I know you will also love your new 911 because the things I have listed as my reasons are probably not important to you, which of course, is fine.

I have a unique 911. You have a unique turbo 911. Enjoy it, but I wouldn't go so far as to say there is a new boss in town. That is simply laughable.

robbie9999

PETE - BOOM ! SPOT ON !! 991.1 is done and dusted, make no mistake the introduction of the new shape and interior was incredible, I am taking wheels and couple other things off 991.1 to put on the 991.2, but hands down this new iteration, is much better all around. All this sound nonsense and exhaust tone, really ? It's just as great, please go out and drive the thing. Petee - come 2019 when they pump out the last 991.2, ours will out dated and not keep up, its life so what, can't keep up with progress and change.

Still what a great jump the 991.1 was from the 997. I never fond of the 997, the changes to current Gen are beyond leaps and bounds

Cristophosphorus

Great video, BUT the races were pretty bad IMO. Only two pulls from lower RPMs and, as you can clearly hear in the second video, the 991.1 driver misses the upshift. I would have loved to see a couple of real side-by-side runs, but I'm sure we'll get more videos soon.



I think that *most* of the 991.1 fans on this forum aren't actually saying that the 991.2 is bad. But NA430 summed it up perfectly above: it's about the individual driver and the "feel" they get from the car.

I always preface my 991.2 comments with the fact that I've never driven one before. However, having driven tons of turbo vs. NA cars, I am aware of my personal preferences and I prefer the NA engine. Whether it's the power curve, the intoxicating, raspy sound, etc., it's just something that I and many others prefer. Nothing wrong with having a preference and not immediately jumping on-board the 991.2 bandwagon, and I'll never understand the criticism from others regarding that.

Noah Fect

Disagree. They had extracted all they could from the NA flat 6 in the mainstream 911s. They would have had to go to FI sooner or later to stay competitive, now that every other Camaro and Rustang on the road is putting out 400+ HP.

The regulations are just a convenient excuse. "It's not our fault, honest, the gubbermint made us do it."

Arguably the same is true for the 718.

Larry Cable

+1

Stil_1

As a new owner coming from an F80 M3, I was in the process of picking either a 991.2 or a Pre-owned 991.1, both of the 4S variant and test drove both back to back, having never driven a 911 before. I'll give some impressions I got.

The 991.2 feels very much similar to the M3 in power delivery. the E92 M3 felt more like the 991.1 in that regard.

Near upper end, the M3 and 991.2 will flatten out in power, while that's where 991.1 and E92 would start pulling, giving it a sense of urgency as the RPMs climb. However, you lose out on low end torque to the newer cars.

Sounds wise, the turbo cars have a lower tone, but less of a mechanical induction noise that the NA cars have, even with the double symposers. You do hear the turbo spool pretty easily with the windows down, with them up, you hear more of a whooshing air suction noise along with the engine noise.

As others have mentioned, the NA car starts out pretty docile below 3-4k, with torque on the ok side of things, but after 4-5k the engine really starts to wail and you hear a lot more induction, mechanical and exhaust noise which gets louder and faster toward the redline.

My observations from the M3 is what torque is kinda monsterous at low and partial throttle, very easy to wheelspin from 1-3 gear. on a 4S, no chance of that on the 991.2, which imho is a benefit.

Despite that, I ended up getting a 991.1, specifically because the while torque gets you initial passing power in the street and performance while makes you faster, I found the upper rpm rush to be kinda addicting, this is a combination of the power delivery and sound experience as the car's revs climbed.

I intend to track the car as I did the M3, so that upper end would be used there. Street wise would be limited to freeway onramps and not in city driving.

After about a week of ownership, I find the power is more than adequate for my daily commute even without all the torque at 1700 rpm.

One thing I was curious about and this is prebably a tune. The M3 is an inline 3.0L 6 with 425 hp, 406 torque twin turbo.
Torque curve is peak at 1700 rpm, flat till 5.5k rpm, same as the 991.2, except the 991.2 has less torque, but horsepower is similar at the same redline of 7500.

My guess is porsche could have tuned the torque on the 991.2 to be more, perhaps that's what the GTS is about.

In any case, these are just observations from someone who was getting his first 911 and trying to pick one.

Archimedes

Meh, we'll agree to disagree. If that video is accurate, I think the .2 sounds awful. I have no horse in this race, as sound means little to me when buying a car and it wouldn't stop me from buying a .2, nor would the turbo motor. My issue is that I really don't care at all for the exterior styling changes, so that's what would keep me from buying a .2 at the moment, but that's personal preference and it may grow on me. There is no doubt in my mind that the .2 is a better performing car than the .1, with an improved interior. That sound though, that would take a bit of getting used to.

cajerseyboy

In the end we are all 911 brothers. Even though we want to beat each other up sometimes, that's what brotherhood is all about....Beating up your younger brother

Dewinator

So wait a minute... if I buy a 996, you'll buy a 993 and we can trade? Nobody disputes that the 996 is better after all right?

robbie9999

No matter a cat in a 991.1 bought a brilliant machine end of the day, my 991.2 purchase will be outdated no matter how much more brilliant of car ...the minute I leave the lot there is something better coming .... Enjoy your motor all that matters

budrichard

Picked up the 991.2 C4S, no SE, yesterday and put on 100+ miles.
Quiet!
I found out from my 981B, the wife does not like wind in her hair nor sun! So no sunroof and windows stay up.
While idling, window down, there is a bit more rumbling than the 981B while I set up my parameters.
Once underway from the Dealership, it was great as I piped my 'Music' from my iPhone through 'Carplay' into the Bose system.
Cruised home on I94 at 80mph with the traffic.
Nice cruiser.
Now I haven't Tracked the car yet but I do know that the sound of the 981B in Sport Plus on the track is intoxicating in it's scream.
Have to wait until Blackhawk to find out how this car compares.
If you watch and like all the YouTube videos where the cars have deep gutteral rumbles and snap and pops and cracks, this car may not be for you but if you do get one, I would think SE would be a good option to tick off. For me, no, as I have said, i like quiet.
Since this car is my Daily Driver, sound-wise (Quiet) it's great so far but if I only drove the car sparingly and wanted to make noise, I would look elsewhere.
-Richard

MagicRat

I think everyone's onto a winner here. .2 owners have a faster, more efficient car. .1 owners have a better sound and (to some) a nicer, more addictive power delivery.

A word on this. Some people like boost! My friend who now has my old 987.2 Boxster S wants to fit a TPC turbo kit to it. I consider this sacrilegious, but he says he loves that feeling of being shoved in the back by extra power. To each their own. All people need to do is what an earlier poster here did: test both cars and see which they prefer.

STG

+1

Any .1 owners DO have the option of buying the "new boss in town .2" if they wish. Not like they're tied to the hip for life. People make the best personal choices for themselves.

"New boss in town" really?? Tell it to the Tang dudes! Thought I'd heard it all.

elitex

I am trying to avoid Turbos on my next car but we'll see. I owned 2 F10 M5's and while the power was addictive it was missing that maniac feeling of an engine the E60 M5 V10 or the E92 M3 V8 had. 911 is going through the same phase the M cars did few years ago.