do I really need winter tires?
12-12-2017, 05:51 PM
#16
My Super Sports are pretty good in the rain and even light snow.
However.... <-- please take note --> tires will break loose suddenly even at low speeds (less than 20mph) if there is a hint of ice on the road.
The resulting slide, if severe enough, will obviously ruin the day so.. I'd say, YES. Snow tires in snowy/rainy sub freezing temperature climates are a MUST have.
Better yet, I avoid driving my 911 altogether in above conditions.
However.... <-- please take note --> tires will break loose suddenly even at low speeds (less than 20mph) if there is a hint of ice on the road.
The resulting slide, if severe enough, will obviously ruin the day so.. I'd say, YES. Snow tires in snowy/rainy sub freezing temperature climates are a MUST have.
Better yet, I avoid driving my 911 altogether in above conditions.
12-12-2017, 06:02 PM
#17
Rennlist Member
12-12-2017, 06:13 PM
#18
12-12-2017, 06:15 PM
#19
Rennlist Member
I am quite surprised to read that some folks think it is OK to use summer tires in winter. A dedicated set of winter tires and wheels makes driving safer during the cold season and is not too inconvenient.
For my C4S, I bought a set of 19 inch wheels and snows from the dealer for 4k. I figure that the snows will last me 4-5 seasons. My dealer charges 250/year to store the wheels and tires and 50 bucks to change them over. For a 125k car (mine), it is not an unreasonable sum of money to spend on the perhaps the most important part of the car for safe driving and for performance.
For my C4S, I bought a set of 19 inch wheels and snows from the dealer for 4k. I figure that the snows will last me 4-5 seasons. My dealer charges 250/year to store the wheels and tires and 50 bucks to change them over. For a 125k car (mine), it is not an unreasonable sum of money to spend on the perhaps the most important part of the car for safe driving and for performance.
12-12-2017, 06:19 PM
#20
12-12-2017, 06:35 PM
#21
Well I have driven a few times on the summer tires as the cold weather was approaching and I felt the car slipping a little bit while coming to a stop.
Therefore I don't recommend summer tires below 45F at all.
You don't need dedicated Winter Tires, although this setup is ideal, you can go with the all season approach if you don't want to deal with storage and swapping but I think you end up compromising on both ends going this route. If you did this I do believe the Continental DWS are good based on reviews. For Winter I strongly recommend Michelin Pilot Alpin PA4. In fact I enjoy cold weather driven on Michelin better than warm weather driving on Pirelli!
Therefore I don't recommend summer tires below 45F at all.
You don't need dedicated Winter Tires, although this setup is ideal, you can go with the all season approach if you don't want to deal with storage and swapping but I think you end up compromising on both ends going this route. If you did this I do believe the Continental DWS are good based on reviews. For Winter I strongly recommend Michelin Pilot Alpin PA4. In fact I enjoy cold weather driven on Michelin better than warm weather driving on Pirelli!
12-12-2017, 07:26 PM
#23
I have cracked the tread from the inside tire edge to the outside tire edge. I suspect from parking in freezing temperatures. So besides the low traction, they may be destroyed.
12-12-2017, 08:25 PM
#24
Rennlist Member
We are all adults here. You do what you wish.
In middle Tennessee our weather is all over the place and driven my C4S on summer tires when cold and dry with no issues.
When I travel north like next week for the holidays I'll slip on the winters and keep them on for a month or two.
Last year when visiting family in PA we got 4" of snow and the C4S was a beast with snow tires. I'm wishing for now this year as well.
Tire Rack makes purchasing a winter tire set up so easy..... if you daily drive your 911 in all weather I would error on the side of safety. I bought my 19" Porsche winter set up for a good deal 2nd hand so it was a no brainer.
In middle Tennessee our weather is all over the place and driven my C4S on summer tires when cold and dry with no issues.
When I travel north like next week for the holidays I'll slip on the winters and keep them on for a month or two.
Last year when visiting family in PA we got 4" of snow and the C4S was a beast with snow tires. I'm wishing for now this year as well.
Tire Rack makes purchasing a winter tire set up so easy..... if you daily drive your 911 in all weather I would error on the side of safety. I bought my 19" Porsche winter set up for a good deal 2nd hand so it was a no brainer.
12-12-2017, 08:32 PM
#25
Burning Brakes
If you hit snow on your summer tires, you will either get stuck (on grades invisible to the naked eye) or you will crash. Your chances of getting home unscathed are less than 50/50.
12-12-2017, 08:59 PM
#26
Rennlist Member
Here in Western Washington we sometimes get freezing temps and occasionally even snow, but mostly just cold rain. The passes however are only an hour away and compact snow and ice most of the winter. It is if anything even colder in Eastern Washington, where I attended WSU and so for 4 years drove Snoqualmie Pass half a dozen times in winter, plus having the car in Pullman all season which was always at least three months solid compact snow and ice with occasional vast stretches of black ice.
Now I really have no idea what anyone else needs. All I can say is in all those years plus another 30 up until maybe about a dozen years ago I never ran anything but the stickiest most high performance summer tire I could find. Never ran chains. Carried them. One time put them on just to get going. Stopped after less than 100 feet and removed them. One time drove right past a WSP officer on the pass when chains were required. Also drove up to Schweitzer to go skiing one time when chains were required and I would have made it to the top if the idiots who don't know how to drive hadn't slowed me down a little too much at one point a couple hundred yards from the lot.
Of course winter tires are not required. How could they be? What? Are summer tires gonna freeze solid and break into little pieces? I don't think so. What I think, and opinions may differ, but what I think is that just as in summer if you run less than the most high performance tire you will have less traction than the guy who does, and that just as when it rains you will have less traction with no tread compared to full tread, that in winter you will have less traction with anything less than the best winter tire than if you had mounted the best winter tire. Could be wrong. Pretty sure I am right.
What I did was I learned how to drive in those low-traction conditions. Got to where going down a straight road I could put the car in a spin, do a 360, and continue on in a straight line. Got so good at it, got so confident, I even did it one time not on a deserted road but one with cars parked both sides. Yeah, go ahead, have a cow. But when I did this I was GOOD AT IT!
Again, that was with high performance summer tires. Stahlflex 3011's if I got the number right. Great big tread blocks. No sipes. Being a poor college student, not a lot of tread most of the time either.
When I finally did start running winter tires it was NOT for traction but to save my nice summer wheels.
Your mileage (and spins) my vary. That's my take on it: its not the tires. Its the driver.
Now I really have no idea what anyone else needs. All I can say is in all those years plus another 30 up until maybe about a dozen years ago I never ran anything but the stickiest most high performance summer tire I could find. Never ran chains. Carried them. One time put them on just to get going. Stopped after less than 100 feet and removed them. One time drove right past a WSP officer on the pass when chains were required. Also drove up to Schweitzer to go skiing one time when chains were required and I would have made it to the top if the idiots who don't know how to drive hadn't slowed me down a little too much at one point a couple hundred yards from the lot.
Of course winter tires are not required. How could they be? What? Are summer tires gonna freeze solid and break into little pieces? I don't think so. What I think, and opinions may differ, but what I think is that just as in summer if you run less than the most high performance tire you will have less traction than the guy who does, and that just as when it rains you will have less traction with no tread compared to full tread, that in winter you will have less traction with anything less than the best winter tire than if you had mounted the best winter tire. Could be wrong. Pretty sure I am right.
What I did was I learned how to drive in those low-traction conditions. Got to where going down a straight road I could put the car in a spin, do a 360, and continue on in a straight line. Got so good at it, got so confident, I even did it one time not on a deserted road but one with cars parked both sides. Yeah, go ahead, have a cow. But when I did this I was GOOD AT IT!
Again, that was with high performance summer tires. Stahlflex 3011's if I got the number right. Great big tread blocks. No sipes. Being a poor college student, not a lot of tread most of the time either.
When I finally did start running winter tires it was NOT for traction but to save my nice summer wheels.
Your mileage (and spins) my vary. That's my take on it: its not the tires. Its the driver.
Were you driving 911s in college? Don't want to presume, but if not, and you weren't on the same level tire (again, modern design and chemistry), then your college experience with tires is moot (handling and responding to spinouts stays with you, though!).
A good driver may be able to offset some of these tires' limitations, but in the end, when they turn hard below 40*, all it takes is a slick of water or something equally innocuous to break them loose and they may not hook back up again. So it IS the tires.
Bottom line: if you live in MA and drive in temps below 40, get all season/winter tires.
12-12-2017, 09:54 PM
#27
Rennlist Member
I normally switch to winters and use the C4S through the winter for quite a few ski trips. It's an absolute tank w the winters on.
This time my super busy dealer couldn't swap them on before next week somehow, so I had to go out to run some errands during last Saturday's snow storm in the NYC area. Mostly from NJ to the city and back.
Honestly it was light snow conditions and not a lot of snow cover but I can't really say I experienced this ice skating type of traction everybody seems to talk about. I did a few minor tests around more snowy parts of the road or where I was parked etc and the PS4S seemed to have reasonable traction. I think in a pinch, if you understand smooth driving, you should be able to get from A to B, given mild conditions without too much highway driving or steep slopes. I don't think it's a situation you want to put yourself in but hey if you have to get home or something, I don't think you need to be afraid of this like it's the plague.
But yeah back to the OP's question, you probably won't get away w it the whole winter in Boston unless you never drive - Boston gets some solid cold temps and heavy snow at times.
This time my super busy dealer couldn't swap them on before next week somehow, so I had to go out to run some errands during last Saturday's snow storm in the NYC area. Mostly from NJ to the city and back.
Honestly it was light snow conditions and not a lot of snow cover but I can't really say I experienced this ice skating type of traction everybody seems to talk about. I did a few minor tests around more snowy parts of the road or where I was parked etc and the PS4S seemed to have reasonable traction. I think in a pinch, if you understand smooth driving, you should be able to get from A to B, given mild conditions without too much highway driving or steep slopes. I don't think it's a situation you want to put yourself in but hey if you have to get home or something, I don't think you need to be afraid of this like it's the plague.
But yeah back to the OP's question, you probably won't get away w it the whole winter in Boston unless you never drive - Boston gets some solid cold temps and heavy snow at times.
12-12-2017, 10:07 PM
#29
12-12-2017, 10:12 PM
#30
Rennlist Member
