Drove a GT4 today- pretty cool
12-20-2015, 11:15 PM
#1
Race Director
Thread Starter
Drove a GT4 today- pretty cool
Here we go:
Left me first preface that I do not track my toys. So my experience comes from spirited street driving and I am not writing this review to win a Pulitzer in Journalism. I am just writing this because some may have an interest in my opinion of the GT4 as it compares to my 2014 991 GT3. Now, please no need to jump all over me because this is my opinion- which although objective to me; will be subjective to you all but I am not writing this to stir anything so there is no ulterior motive.
A little History –Grew up loving sport cars and having posters on my walls and reading every car magazine. Always loved Porsches and Lambos. Do not know why but always just loved the styling of both. My first Porsche was a Basalt Black Caymans S – loved it. Thought it was one fine looking Porsche (more so than its rear engine Brother) and handled on rails but needed more HP. In 2009 I traded for a 2007 997.2 Turbo because I wanted more HP. It was GR (manual-700 miles) and it was awesome but turbo lag was a little apparent, all wheel not my favorite, and of course the exhaust was no fun. Took care of the exhaust thing when I put on the full FVD Sport Exhaust. But loved this car dearly. After that, in 2012, I caught the bug and traded for a 2011 White Audi R8 V10 Spyder. Great gated manual and the V10 was a blast-very linear. Car was a little heavy, steering was numb compared to my Porsches, and despite how exotic everyone thinks they look it just did not grow on me. Sort of the opposite in a way but I wanted my “Porsche” back (wished I never parted with my GR Turbo for the R8). Basically, I am a huge Porsche fan. I love the history, the style, the accessibility to nearby dealerships, and not too much in your face that I feel uncomfortable driving them feeling. Traded her in 6 months later for a 2014 GT3 allocation. Got what I was looking for despite missing a third peddle. Got a NA, light weight, rear wheel drive car that is very raw and all one could want. Pretty much checked every box. Turned down twice an allocation for a GT4 because no reason -I have a GT3.
Well, no doubt, after time has passed; the novelty of the paddles have worn off and I truly miss a third peddle. All of my other toys were Manual and I have preferred manuals going back to my teen age years.
So, another allocation for a GT4, out of State (at MSRP), ended of falling in to my lap 2 weeks ago. I have spec’d her out to my liking and it is a May build. But- I only have room for one and it would not make sense to have (2) toys for street driving 8 months per year. I average approx. 4000 miles per year.
Thanks to Mauro, who is on the GT4 forum, I had a chance to drive his GT4 today. I think it was a mutual meet up today because he was anxious to try the GT3 to satisfy his curiosity over the GT3 Engine. So, I got a chance to take out his GT4, with him, 2 times for about 20 min each and he also had a chance to take my GT3 out with me as a passenger. It was the first time we were both passengers in our own cars – I little scary I might add but I feel more comfortable with someone who has a vested interest- sort to speak. But heck – the GT3 is freakish from the passenger’s seat- no like
Exterior (as they sit next to each other) – The GT4 is the prettier of the two. Although the GT4 looks slightly smaller in scale I think the lower roofline gives you that impression because in length they look very close. The front lip looks like it almost has the same amount of clearance and yet the GT4 does not come with the “lift” option which I am surprised although I learned there is no room for it under the GT4. The GT4 looks more like the Carrera GT than the 911, in my opinion. Do like the rear lights and the spoiler was better looking in person than in pictures. In the end – a stunning looking car. (So is my GT3 but the GT4 has the advantage here).
Interior – Typical Porsche. Same exact as my GT3. I did not feel like it sat lower. We both do not have LWBs so maybe someone who has these may feel they sit lower. But no real difference in my opinion. Neither has an advantage here. – Until you start driving them. The GT3 seems like it has less insulation and the engine has that rattle that certainly distinguishes itself and that is with the engine in the trunk. The GT4, although engine right behind you, does not rattle and make the GT3 engine/tranny noises but it also sounds a little more refined and solid in a way. So, GT4 does not sound as raw on the inside but more refined and solid-like. I like them both – just different. Now, when driving, I like how the GT4 has the engine behind you rather than all that empty space. I like how it feels more like a jet fighter cockpit – very intimate and solid feeling.
Exhaust – On ignition start up the GT3 has a slight bigger bark (I have the SW Bypass and 100 MM pipes). I originally thought that the GT4 would win in this department because from videos I have heard I thought it sounded better/louder. The GT3 wins in this area. It is louder, overall, and from 7000-9000 forget about it. But – the Gt4 may have a little better sound (not volume) and by no means am I putting this exhaust down. It is awesome but the GT3 has a slight advantage here.
Transmission – both brilliant. The PDK-S is the best in the business and this 6-speed Manual is the best in the business. No need to argue here. I miss a third peddle, so my preference, but neither is better than the other. If PDK-S is faster on the track than it is better there. It is not about better but preference for me on the street. Sure, the PDK-S lightning snaps are unforgettable but love the downshifts with the rev matching - awesome
Steering – Wow!!! – The GT4 may have the best steering I have ever felt in a car before. Thought this is where the GT3 shines until you drive the GT4. It is just better- may be it is the mid-engine platform that helps with this but boy did they get it right. They both give you great feedback but the GT4 just feels just slightly more responsive-really tough for me to articulate in writing.
Handling – Well. It is the mid-engine vs rear engine argument. The GT4 just handles like on rails. It just inspires with so much confidence with the center of gravity being right on you rather than out back. You can actually feel where the weight difference lies. When you take high speed turns with the GT4 and the same turn with the GT3 it just feels more planted and predictable. Could be a mental thing that haunts you from the past with the earlier rear engine 911s but love the mid-engine platform
Engine – Well-this is where there is a large gap between the two and is justified in the pricing. They are both bargains for their price but neither is a greater bargain than the other. For the extra $45,000 you get an engine like no other and justifyingly so. There is no engine like the 9000 rpm screamer in the GT3. The GT4 engine is very competent. I do not feel like the gears are too long but rather you yearn for them to be shorter so you can shift more. The GT4 has a great push form 5000-7000 but the GT3 is just a “beast”. It revs so quickly and so high that it is mesmerizing. And here lies the dilemma – for a street car you really will never get the chance to exploit the GT3 potential. It is great that you have it though but you cannot get to it limits unless you are on a track or abandoned runway. So, you are not going to win all those sprints to the next stop light in the GT4 but I bet you may have just as much fun getting there.
That “Special’ feeling- Both cars have that same feel. Some people have driven both and have commented the GT3 just feels more special. No way – they both feel special. Never once did I feel one feels more “special” than the other. Now – one could certainly feel that the GT3 engine is special – and that it is . But the GT4 steering and handling is “special’ in my opinion so they both exude “special” and all who own one and/or the both/other- is very fortunate.
In a nut shell; Porsche has outdone themselves once again. In the past 2 years they have given us the 991 GT3, 981 GT4, and the 991 GT3 RS. How fortunate all of us avid Porsche fans are to have these 3 models introduced within this short time frame. Porsche has certainly given the sports car public some serious performance products to consider. Unreal actually. If I were a track junkie, and had the means, having a GT3/RS dedicated for the track and a GT4 for the streets- one would have the best of both worlds. For those that can only chose one – “good luck”- each must define on their own what is the “perfect” driver’s car. Most of us are attracted to Porsche because we all pursue perfection. Porsche exemplifies this – that is why we are drawn to their products. But – which one is perfect to you!!!!
Left me first preface that I do not track my toys. So my experience comes from spirited street driving and I am not writing this review to win a Pulitzer in Journalism. I am just writing this because some may have an interest in my opinion of the GT4 as it compares to my 2014 991 GT3. Now, please no need to jump all over me because this is my opinion- which although objective to me; will be subjective to you all but I am not writing this to stir anything so there is no ulterior motive.
A little History –Grew up loving sport cars and having posters on my walls and reading every car magazine. Always loved Porsches and Lambos. Do not know why but always just loved the styling of both. My first Porsche was a Basalt Black Caymans S – loved it. Thought it was one fine looking Porsche (more so than its rear engine Brother) and handled on rails but needed more HP. In 2009 I traded for a 2007 997.2 Turbo because I wanted more HP. It was GR (manual-700 miles) and it was awesome but turbo lag was a little apparent, all wheel not my favorite, and of course the exhaust was no fun. Took care of the exhaust thing when I put on the full FVD Sport Exhaust. But loved this car dearly. After that, in 2012, I caught the bug and traded for a 2011 White Audi R8 V10 Spyder. Great gated manual and the V10 was a blast-very linear. Car was a little heavy, steering was numb compared to my Porsches, and despite how exotic everyone thinks they look it just did not grow on me. Sort of the opposite in a way but I wanted my “Porsche” back (wished I never parted with my GR Turbo for the R8). Basically, I am a huge Porsche fan. I love the history, the style, the accessibility to nearby dealerships, and not too much in your face that I feel uncomfortable driving them feeling. Traded her in 6 months later for a 2014 GT3 allocation. Got what I was looking for despite missing a third peddle. Got a NA, light weight, rear wheel drive car that is very raw and all one could want. Pretty much checked every box. Turned down twice an allocation for a GT4 because no reason -I have a GT3.
Well, no doubt, after time has passed; the novelty of the paddles have worn off and I truly miss a third peddle. All of my other toys were Manual and I have preferred manuals going back to my teen age years.
So, another allocation for a GT4, out of State (at MSRP), ended of falling in to my lap 2 weeks ago. I have spec’d her out to my liking and it is a May build. But- I only have room for one and it would not make sense to have (2) toys for street driving 8 months per year. I average approx. 4000 miles per year.
Thanks to Mauro, who is on the GT4 forum, I had a chance to drive his GT4 today. I think it was a mutual meet up today because he was anxious to try the GT3 to satisfy his curiosity over the GT3 Engine. So, I got a chance to take out his GT4, with him, 2 times for about 20 min each and he also had a chance to take my GT3 out with me as a passenger. It was the first time we were both passengers in our own cars – I little scary I might add but I feel more comfortable with someone who has a vested interest- sort to speak. But heck – the GT3 is freakish from the passenger’s seat- no like
Exterior (as they sit next to each other) – The GT4 is the prettier of the two. Although the GT4 looks slightly smaller in scale I think the lower roofline gives you that impression because in length they look very close. The front lip looks like it almost has the same amount of clearance and yet the GT4 does not come with the “lift” option which I am surprised although I learned there is no room for it under the GT4. The GT4 looks more like the Carrera GT than the 911, in my opinion. Do like the rear lights and the spoiler was better looking in person than in pictures. In the end – a stunning looking car. (So is my GT3 but the GT4 has the advantage here).
Interior – Typical Porsche. Same exact as my GT3. I did not feel like it sat lower. We both do not have LWBs so maybe someone who has these may feel they sit lower. But no real difference in my opinion. Neither has an advantage here. – Until you start driving them. The GT3 seems like it has less insulation and the engine has that rattle that certainly distinguishes itself and that is with the engine in the trunk. The GT4, although engine right behind you, does not rattle and make the GT3 engine/tranny noises but it also sounds a little more refined and solid in a way. So, GT4 does not sound as raw on the inside but more refined and solid-like. I like them both – just different. Now, when driving, I like how the GT4 has the engine behind you rather than all that empty space. I like how it feels more like a jet fighter cockpit – very intimate and solid feeling.
Exhaust – On ignition start up the GT3 has a slight bigger bark (I have the SW Bypass and 100 MM pipes). I originally thought that the GT4 would win in this department because from videos I have heard I thought it sounded better/louder. The GT3 wins in this area. It is louder, overall, and from 7000-9000 forget about it. But – the Gt4 may have a little better sound (not volume) and by no means am I putting this exhaust down. It is awesome but the GT3 has a slight advantage here.
Transmission – both brilliant. The PDK-S is the best in the business and this 6-speed Manual is the best in the business. No need to argue here. I miss a third peddle, so my preference, but neither is better than the other. If PDK-S is faster on the track than it is better there. It is not about better but preference for me on the street. Sure, the PDK-S lightning snaps are unforgettable but love the downshifts with the rev matching - awesome
Steering – Wow!!! – The GT4 may have the best steering I have ever felt in a car before. Thought this is where the GT3 shines until you drive the GT4. It is just better- may be it is the mid-engine platform that helps with this but boy did they get it right. They both give you great feedback but the GT4 just feels just slightly more responsive-really tough for me to articulate in writing.
Handling – Well. It is the mid-engine vs rear engine argument. The GT4 just handles like on rails. It just inspires with so much confidence with the center of gravity being right on you rather than out back. You can actually feel where the weight difference lies. When you take high speed turns with the GT4 and the same turn with the GT3 it just feels more planted and predictable. Could be a mental thing that haunts you from the past with the earlier rear engine 911s but love the mid-engine platform
Engine – Well-this is where there is a large gap between the two and is justified in the pricing. They are both bargains for their price but neither is a greater bargain than the other. For the extra $45,000 you get an engine like no other and justifyingly so. There is no engine like the 9000 rpm screamer in the GT3. The GT4 engine is very competent. I do not feel like the gears are too long but rather you yearn for them to be shorter so you can shift more. The GT4 has a great push form 5000-7000 but the GT3 is just a “beast”. It revs so quickly and so high that it is mesmerizing. And here lies the dilemma – for a street car you really will never get the chance to exploit the GT3 potential. It is great that you have it though but you cannot get to it limits unless you are on a track or abandoned runway. So, you are not going to win all those sprints to the next stop light in the GT4 but I bet you may have just as much fun getting there.
That “Special’ feeling- Both cars have that same feel. Some people have driven both and have commented the GT3 just feels more special. No way – they both feel special. Never once did I feel one feels more “special” than the other. Now – one could certainly feel that the GT3 engine is special – and that it is . But the GT4 steering and handling is “special’ in my opinion so they both exude “special” and all who own one and/or the both/other- is very fortunate.
In a nut shell; Porsche has outdone themselves once again. In the past 2 years they have given us the 991 GT3, 981 GT4, and the 991 GT3 RS. How fortunate all of us avid Porsche fans are to have these 3 models introduced within this short time frame. Porsche has certainly given the sports car public some serious performance products to consider. Unreal actually. If I were a track junkie, and had the means, having a GT3/RS dedicated for the track and a GT4 for the streets- one would have the best of both worlds. For those that can only chose one – “good luck”- each must define on their own what is the “perfect” driver’s car. Most of us are attracted to Porsche because we all pursue perfection. Porsche exemplifies this – that is why we are drawn to their products. But – which one is perfect to you!!!!
Last edited by Jimmy-D; 12-20-2015 at 11:36 PM.
12-20-2015, 11:31 PM
#2
Rennlist Member
Great POV post.
Look forward to compare the RS vs GT4 vs 964.
So far, I'm not tired of PDK, but hat could change. Sure enjoyed driving my 964 on the road this weekend. I don't know that the GT4 can outshine them, but only one way to find out...
Look forward to compare the RS vs GT4 vs 964.
So far, I'm not tired of PDK, but hat could change. Sure enjoyed driving my 964 on the road this weekend. I don't know that the GT4 can outshine them, but only one way to find out...
12-21-2015, 12:10 AM
#5
Rennlist Member
Jimmy. Very thorough review and interested to ready your POV.
Had our first fast backroad drive with a 981 GT4 yesterday. A few 991 & 991 GT3 along as well.
Must say my final first meeting with the 981 GT3 I was a little disappointed. Clearly narrower than the GT3, sitting next to it seemed exactly the same length (maybe 5cm in it?). Might have been the colour but I did not find it a particularly attractive car (side profile is definitely the best IMO).
On the road it sat fine. It sounded quite throaty in the lower/mid ranges but a bit bassy perhaps. In the higher range the GT3 sound (I have SW pipe) has it well beat IMO. Shreeking engine from 7-9000 rpm the GT3 just cant be beat.
I didnt drive the car but having just arrived in country after 3 months and driven my 993 MT the day before I couldnt help but drive the GT3 (paddles of course) and just be so happy with that car. Its definitely all abut the engine in the GT3 and despite what they say about the size the GT4 is only smaller in width.
I can hardly wait to get the GT3 back out n the track on the 9 & 11 Jan. In teh meantime a few thousand Xmas Kms n back roads await.
Im still in for an allocation with the GT4 but cant help but think perhaps with a 993 to RS spec already in the garage I maybe doubling up a bit here. Im starting to think abut doing a Rothsport or Weiner engine upgrade n the 993 and maybe passing on the GT4.
The GT4 from all accounts is an exceptional car for the money. But after the 991RS & GT3 in the flesh I found it a bit anti climatic myself. That said I dnt think you could g wrong with either this or the GT3 and if I wasnt using it on the track Id definitely look at the GT4 more favourable as an only car option...
Had our first fast backroad drive with a 981 GT4 yesterday. A few 991 & 991 GT3 along as well.
Must say my final first meeting with the 981 GT3 I was a little disappointed. Clearly narrower than the GT3, sitting next to it seemed exactly the same length (maybe 5cm in it?). Might have been the colour but I did not find it a particularly attractive car (side profile is definitely the best IMO).
On the road it sat fine. It sounded quite throaty in the lower/mid ranges but a bit bassy perhaps. In the higher range the GT3 sound (I have SW pipe) has it well beat IMO. Shreeking engine from 7-9000 rpm the GT3 just cant be beat.
I didnt drive the car but having just arrived in country after 3 months and driven my 993 MT the day before I couldnt help but drive the GT3 (paddles of course) and just be so happy with that car. Its definitely all abut the engine in the GT3 and despite what they say about the size the GT4 is only smaller in width.
I can hardly wait to get the GT3 back out n the track on the 9 & 11 Jan. In teh meantime a few thousand Xmas Kms n back roads await.
Im still in for an allocation with the GT4 but cant help but think perhaps with a 993 to RS spec already in the garage I maybe doubling up a bit here. Im starting to think abut doing a Rothsport or Weiner engine upgrade n the 993 and maybe passing on the GT4.
The GT4 from all accounts is an exceptional car for the money. But after the 991RS & GT3 in the flesh I found it a bit anti climatic myself. That said I dnt think you could g wrong with either this or the GT3 and if I wasnt using it on the track Id definitely look at the GT4 more favourable as an only car option...
12-21-2015, 12:28 AM
#6
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So they finally fixed the very poor 981 Cayman S engine tranny binding? in all not spirited driving i found it terrible
Last edited by fxz; 12-21-2015 at 12:45 AM.
12-21-2015, 12:30 AM
#7
Drifting
Good review Jimmy. If you didn't have taste of GT3 it would have been an easy decision for you since you like the MT. They are both great cars. The problem is the Power loss. Maybe you can tweak the GT4 to make up more PWR to put you in the middle.
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12-21-2015, 12:51 AM
#8
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Good review. Goes to show that cars are like flavors of ice cream. It's possible to have a favorite, but none is objectively best, and it's nice to have variety. I find that rotating through my cars enables me to enjoy each one of them more.
12-21-2015, 01:09 AM
#9
Three Wheelin'
Good comparison. Good luck with your decision.
I'm surprised at your comment that the lift wouldn't fit given that the front suspension is the same in both cars.
I'm surprised at your comment that the lift wouldn't fit given that the front suspension is the same in both cars.
12-21-2015, 01:18 AM
#10
Nordschleife Master
Jimmy,I'm glad you had the chance to drive a GT4 before buying. You are very lucky,this is a privilege I wish I would've had,but considering the other car comes with only 2 pedals,my choice was clear. I am so happy I did!
The most lucky among us are those that can have both,or real Porsche " maniacs " that can have all 3.
I can't and as I said in the past,you can put a GT3 title or an RS title on the table,even exchange with my title,I won't take it. Can I take the RS,sell it,buy another GT4 and keep the rest of the money? Sure! But it's not worth the trouble going through another waiting period.
Is the GT4 perfect? Far from it,but more enjoyable nonetheless.
BTW,there are a few already before you who've made the switch and never looked back. I won't mention names.
In the end,the GT4 is the living proof for non-believers,of what Porsche is capable of doing if they put their minds to it. Could they have made a 9K RPMs GT3 with a manual transmission ? ABSOLUTELY! And it would've been the sweetest Porsche ever made! Fact!
The most lucky among us are those that can have both,or real Porsche " maniacs " that can have all 3.
I can't and as I said in the past,you can put a GT3 title or an RS title on the table,even exchange with my title,I won't take it. Can I take the RS,sell it,buy another GT4 and keep the rest of the money? Sure! But it's not worth the trouble going through another waiting period.
Is the GT4 perfect? Far from it,but more enjoyable nonetheless.
BTW,there are a few already before you who've made the switch and never looked back. I won't mention names.
In the end,the GT4 is the living proof for non-believers,of what Porsche is capable of doing if they put their minds to it. Could they have made a 9K RPMs GT3 with a manual transmission ? ABSOLUTELY! And it would've been the sweetest Porsche ever made! Fact!
12-21-2015, 01:23 AM
#11
Rennlist Member
Macca,
I'm not sure why you are saying that the GT4 is only smaller in width.
Porsche themselves and magazines that have measured both cars have stated the GT3 is 4 inches longer than the GT4.
I'm not sure why you are saying that the GT4 is only smaller in width.
Porsche themselves and magazines that have measured both cars have stated the GT3 is 4 inches longer than the GT4.
12-21-2015, 02:47 AM
#12
Addict & Guru
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by mwar99
...I'm surprised at your comment that the lift wouldn't fit given that the front suspension is the same in both cars.
12-21-2015, 02:49 AM
#13
Rennlist Member
4 inches is 100mm right? We parked the cars side by side and infact all agreed they lked identical in length save for the protruding front lip/valence on the GT3 (where it goes out a bit further in my photo above). I guessed that was 2 inches (5cm) but just went and measured it and I guess its 10cm (4 inched) but it honestly was all that there was in in...
12-21-2015, 03:17 AM
#15
Rennlist Member
4 inches is 100mm right? We parked the cars side by side and infact all agreed they lked identical in length save for the protruding front lip/valence on the GT3 (where it goes out a bit further in my photo above). I guessed that was 2 inches (5cm) but just went and measured it and I guess its 10cm (4 inched) but it honestly was all that there was in in...
I agree the GT4 isn't tremendously smaller than the GT3, but likely at least 3 inches of car shorter, besides the front splitter difference.