On track experiences and video's 991 GT3 only.
10-03-2014, 10:46 PM
#406
Rennlist Member
P.S. Image three shows some water pooling on the track. Here and on the apex when it trains heavy a little river appears. This is a very dangerous part of the track because the car is unbalanced having just come through a high speed (110mph+) kink. Here is where we lost two cars into the bank and tyre wall that day....very greasy track from a sports bike day earlier in the week.
10-03-2014, 10:51 PM
#408
Rennlist Member
P.P.P.S. Nothing more confusing than jumping in and out of two totally different cars with 20+ years of technology difference every 20 mins on a crappy day. I had anticpated getting tired but that what cocaine is for right? (track cocaine :-) but I never anticipated the sensory confusion of jumping in an d out of 100% different set ups (handling, gearbox, seats/harnesses & helmets, video gear, speed, tyres and chassis etc). I really admire the pros!
10-03-2014, 10:52 PM
#409
Rennlist Member
Lastly what would we do without raining sensing auto speed wipers - both cars have them (retrofitted 996 system into 993 along with dipping mirror - I drive alot in the rain in NZ and have never regretted that option on any car!).
10-03-2014, 11:41 PM
#410
Burning Brakes
Macca that's fantastic stuff!!! Driving in rain will give you a nice pucker factor!
I got to drive in a total downpour at Barber in July. I was in a 991 C2 and it really taught me a lot.
Thanks for all your posts and videos.
The blue car looked like it had *****. I didn't think it was stock. almost looked like Mexico Blue color but a bit lighter in hue.
I got to drive in a total downpour at Barber in July. I was in a 991 C2 and it really taught me a lot.
Thanks for all your posts and videos.
The blue car looked like it had *****. I didn't think it was stock. almost looked like Mexico Blue color but a bit lighter in hue.
10-03-2014, 11:54 PM
#411
Rennlist Member
Agree. Wet driving teaches you a whole load about contact patch and being smooth!!!
The little blue Lotus open wheeler is very well driven and highly developed making around 220 bhp now in a 600 kg package and used exclusively on the track. Indeed it is not stock. Indeed you are correct its basically mexico Blue and Gulf orange colour scheme - had just been painted that was a few days before...
The little blue Lotus open wheeler is very well driven and highly developed making around 220 bhp now in a 600 kg package and used exclusively on the track. Indeed it is not stock. Indeed you are correct its basically mexico Blue and Gulf orange colour scheme - had just been painted that was a few days before...
10-04-2014, 12:29 PM
#412
Instructor
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 209
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well, I finally took my GT3 to Mosport (now known as Canadian Tire Motorsports Park) after 2 months of ownership. Not completely broken in yet, as it was at ~1800 km. But now it is....
Anyways, a bit of a background about me. I've been going to track days since 2006. I'm not hard core, as I only go to about 4-5 events every summer, but work/family prevented me from doing so in 2013 and 2014 (until this past week). I tracked my street cars over the years: a C55 AMG and a manual transmission 135i. On street tires, my absolutely fastest laps were in the 1:40-1:41 range at Mosport in either car.
The GT3 is everything I had hoped for and more. Despite being cautious (being the first time I have tracked a rear engine car), the 991 GT3 is a FAST car and there is tremendous grip. There were only a few times when the tires were a bit cold or too hot where I experienced a bit of a 4 wheel drift around some corners. At no point did I feel the rear end wanting to come around (something I was definitely a bit fearful of given my lack of experience in a 911). Electronic nannies were all left on, but I didn't really see it intervene much during my whole day. According to the tire pressure monitoring system, hot tire pressures went as high as 41 psi in the left rear.
I tried driving in manual mode and in sport automatic mode of the PDK-S. With my skill level, I found no advantage in driving in manual mode, so most laps were done in sport automatic mode.
The first session was done with normal suspension mode, but after switching to the sport suspension mode, there was an obvious decrease in body roll, so the rest of the day was driven in sport suspension mode.
My fastest lap in the GT3 was 1:34.7 according to Harry's laptimer........that is a full 5-6 seconds faster than my previous best times in my other cars. And I'm sure the car can go a lot faster........being the first time in a 911 on track, I lifted probably earlier than I had to, and it is likely I can get back on the throttle sooner too when exiting some corners. Also, I probably can brake later compared to my other cars. I think there are others here who have posted 1:32 times in a 991 GT3 at this track.
Subjectively, the car felt FANTASTIC. Yes, the scream of the engine behind me at 9000rpm with super fast shifts felt like nothing I have experienced before. It was GLORIOUS. And not surprisingly, the car felt so planted when cornering at high speeds. I look forward to next season.......I'm sure I will have many years of learning and driving enjoyment in this amazing car.
And I was running 91 octane gas.....maybe I'll be faster if I run 93 octane.....hahaha.
Here are 2 videos (the first is my quickest lap of the day, and the second on is a clip of me chasing a 997 GT3 RS and other cars). With this driving group, passing is only allowed on the straights, and after the car in front points you by.
Anyways, a bit of a background about me. I've been going to track days since 2006. I'm not hard core, as I only go to about 4-5 events every summer, but work/family prevented me from doing so in 2013 and 2014 (until this past week). I tracked my street cars over the years: a C55 AMG and a manual transmission 135i. On street tires, my absolutely fastest laps were in the 1:40-1:41 range at Mosport in either car.
The GT3 is everything I had hoped for and more. Despite being cautious (being the first time I have tracked a rear engine car), the 991 GT3 is a FAST car and there is tremendous grip. There were only a few times when the tires were a bit cold or too hot where I experienced a bit of a 4 wheel drift around some corners. At no point did I feel the rear end wanting to come around (something I was definitely a bit fearful of given my lack of experience in a 911). Electronic nannies were all left on, but I didn't really see it intervene much during my whole day. According to the tire pressure monitoring system, hot tire pressures went as high as 41 psi in the left rear.
I tried driving in manual mode and in sport automatic mode of the PDK-S. With my skill level, I found no advantage in driving in manual mode, so most laps were done in sport automatic mode.
The first session was done with normal suspension mode, but after switching to the sport suspension mode, there was an obvious decrease in body roll, so the rest of the day was driven in sport suspension mode.
My fastest lap in the GT3 was 1:34.7 according to Harry's laptimer........that is a full 5-6 seconds faster than my previous best times in my other cars. And I'm sure the car can go a lot faster........being the first time in a 911 on track, I lifted probably earlier than I had to, and it is likely I can get back on the throttle sooner too when exiting some corners. Also, I probably can brake later compared to my other cars. I think there are others here who have posted 1:32 times in a 991 GT3 at this track.
Subjectively, the car felt FANTASTIC. Yes, the scream of the engine behind me at 9000rpm with super fast shifts felt like nothing I have experienced before. It was GLORIOUS. And not surprisingly, the car felt so planted when cornering at high speeds. I look forward to next season.......I'm sure I will have many years of learning and driving enjoyment in this amazing car.
And I was running 91 octane gas.....maybe I'll be faster if I run 93 octane.....hahaha.
Here are 2 videos (the first is my quickest lap of the day, and the second on is a clip of me chasing a 997 GT3 RS and other cars). With this driving group, passing is only allowed on the straights, and after the car in front points you by.
10-04-2014, 03:17 PM
#413
Ok. Back to regular programming. Embarrassingly after all the talk on safety gear here I submit for your entertainment some recent laps in my 991 GT3 with friends on a cold and occasionally showery day at one of the oldest, shortest and most Southern North Island tracks in New Zealand. This track of course is old but has some real history with folk like Amon and Hulme and McLaren all having raced there extensively after the F1 Tasman series in the 1970s.
I went out to have some fun that day after a very wet and stormy track session at another track further north the day before (where we lost 2 cars from our group as total losses!). Ill post some footage of a torrential downpour in the 991 Gt3 too when I have bandwidth (island internet here sorry) and yopu can see what the 991 GT3 is like on the back straight at 200kmph when teh wipers wont even keep up with the rain and I can hardly see what Im doing! Not sure about USA and Europe but we seem to have alot of wet track days Downunder!
P.S. I wore my full face helmet with Necksgen on the wet trackday but when leaving base at 6am for the 250 kmpo fast drive to the Southern track you see here (driver debrief 9am!) discovered I had packed my open faced helment which currently does not have the necksgen posts fitted. 5 hail marys for me I know. The neck restraint is new for me this race weekend so I promise to get a second set of posts for my summer helmet! You will be pleased to know I had my fire proof socks and undies on and my 3 layer SFI/FIA approved race suit as always!!! :-)
P.S. This is not a "fast lap" video just some fun with a variety of Pcars in our private track club RSG (Rennsport Gruppe).
A 997.1 Cup car can do a qualifying lap in 1.12 or under here and the 991 GT3 is probably good for a 1.15 or slightly under (the track doesn't give big benefits to heavier more powerful cars and favours lighter nimbler machines really as its was designed in the 1960s). My best for the day was 1.18.18 with another 991 GT3 putting in a 1.17.xx - there was always some time on the table as the temps and track surface wasnt the best (10-14c) and its sprinkled with rain a few times during the day making the sweeper almost impossible to get decent traction on. My 993 in track guise is only 1 second slower than I was in 991 GT3 but this is probably more becuase Im still having to learn the point at which to remove foot from throttle and the braking and turn in points in the GT3 which are remarkably different from the older car.
I drove this lap in Sport Auto but found it frustrating in teh haripin at the end of teh front straight - Id lift to coast a bit (usually spend teh tie heel & Toe from 5th to 3rd in the 993 here starting light on brakes and progressively firmer) but as soon as I lift in sport auto it changes me down a gear and so I decelerate too quickly. A different style is needed here but actually I think I will drive the car manual more often as I also find the shirt shifts on teh up shift catch me out - Im sued to running each gear to almost redline in the 993 to make power and thus have timed my shift points on track based around that car/engine. As you will see in the video there are places the 991 GT3 short shifts on the upshift. there is plenty to learn regards driving this car quickly. I was no faster on this track than an experienced 997.2 Gt3 driver on Supersports so I should say there is 2 seconds on the table once teh characteristics of the car are better understood and the gear selection strategy is better fettled. My single biggest challenge in this car over my 993 is this: "The 991 GT3 carries FAR more corner speed than prior platforms". By that I mean Im over braking into tight or moderate corners thinking its a 993/996/997 type car - its no torque miester just a typical atmo 911 so carrying speed through corners is much faster than hard braking then getting on the gas from a lower speed. Watching the other 991 GT3 driver who is a long time PDK owner and has much track time in PDK and more recently the 991 GT3 I can see he is touching the brakes hard and sharp very late to scrub of a bit of speed quickly then partial throttle around the moderate corners keeping teh apex speed fairly high then onto the gas. This technique is saving alot of time over my older skool 911 technique. the car is very balances and planted and has a very capable chassis so can take the additional speed....everyone said 991 GT3 will be easy to drive fast but I disagree - its still a very thrilling drive but to truly be significantly quicker than previous gen Gt3 RS etc you need to develop new technique and polish it. Still plenty of learning to go and given I dont live in the country the car resides only very brief opportunities for me to increase track seat time in the GT3 but Im looking forward to the learning....
Enjoy. Please note Air con was left on the whole weekend, windows up, sound was SW bypass, Sport Exhaust was on along with sport suspension and Sport auto, ESC+TC were left on and never intervened on this track day (although were working busy on wet track day especially during the 180 I performed in the interests of better knowing the cars limits - not!).
Manfield NZ 13 Sept 2014 991 GT3 - YouTube
I went out to have some fun that day after a very wet and stormy track session at another track further north the day before (where we lost 2 cars from our group as total losses!). Ill post some footage of a torrential downpour in the 991 Gt3 too when I have bandwidth (island internet here sorry) and yopu can see what the 991 GT3 is like on the back straight at 200kmph when teh wipers wont even keep up with the rain and I can hardly see what Im doing! Not sure about USA and Europe but we seem to have alot of wet track days Downunder!
P.S. I wore my full face helmet with Necksgen on the wet trackday but when leaving base at 6am for the 250 kmpo fast drive to the Southern track you see here (driver debrief 9am!) discovered I had packed my open faced helment which currently does not have the necksgen posts fitted. 5 hail marys for me I know. The neck restraint is new for me this race weekend so I promise to get a second set of posts for my summer helmet! You will be pleased to know I had my fire proof socks and undies on and my 3 layer SFI/FIA approved race suit as always!!! :-)
P.S. This is not a "fast lap" video just some fun with a variety of Pcars in our private track club RSG (Rennsport Gruppe).
A 997.1 Cup car can do a qualifying lap in 1.12 or under here and the 991 GT3 is probably good for a 1.15 or slightly under (the track doesn't give big benefits to heavier more powerful cars and favours lighter nimbler machines really as its was designed in the 1960s). My best for the day was 1.18.18 with another 991 GT3 putting in a 1.17.xx - there was always some time on the table as the temps and track surface wasnt the best (10-14c) and its sprinkled with rain a few times during the day making the sweeper almost impossible to get decent traction on. My 993 in track guise is only 1 second slower than I was in 991 GT3 but this is probably more becuase Im still having to learn the point at which to remove foot from throttle and the braking and turn in points in the GT3 which are remarkably different from the older car.
I drove this lap in Sport Auto but found it frustrating in teh haripin at the end of teh front straight - Id lift to coast a bit (usually spend teh tie heel & Toe from 5th to 3rd in the 993 here starting light on brakes and progressively firmer) but as soon as I lift in sport auto it changes me down a gear and so I decelerate too quickly. A different style is needed here but actually I think I will drive the car manual more often as I also find the shirt shifts on teh up shift catch me out - Im sued to running each gear to almost redline in the 993 to make power and thus have timed my shift points on track based around that car/engine. As you will see in the video there are places the 991 GT3 short shifts on the upshift. there is plenty to learn regards driving this car quickly. I was no faster on this track than an experienced 997.2 Gt3 driver on Supersports so I should say there is 2 seconds on the table once teh characteristics of the car are better understood and the gear selection strategy is better fettled. My single biggest challenge in this car over my 993 is this: "The 991 GT3 carries FAR more corner speed than prior platforms". By that I mean Im over braking into tight or moderate corners thinking its a 993/996/997 type car - its no torque miester just a typical atmo 911 so carrying speed through corners is much faster than hard braking then getting on the gas from a lower speed. Watching the other 991 GT3 driver who is a long time PDK owner and has much track time in PDK and more recently the 991 GT3 I can see he is touching the brakes hard and sharp very late to scrub of a bit of speed quickly then partial throttle around the moderate corners keeping teh apex speed fairly high then onto the gas. This technique is saving alot of time over my older skool 911 technique. the car is very balances and planted and has a very capable chassis so can take the additional speed....everyone said 991 GT3 will be easy to drive fast but I disagree - its still a very thrilling drive but to truly be significantly quicker than previous gen Gt3 RS etc you need to develop new technique and polish it. Still plenty of learning to go and given I dont live in the country the car resides only very brief opportunities for me to increase track seat time in the GT3 but Im looking forward to the learning....
Enjoy. Please note Air con was left on the whole weekend, windows up, sound was SW bypass, Sport Exhaust was on along with sport suspension and Sport auto, ESC+TC were left on and never intervened on this track day (although were working busy on wet track day especially during the 180 I performed in the interests of better knowing the cars limits - not!).
Manfield NZ 13 Sept 2014 991 GT3 - YouTube
I think the new 991 chassis in the most underrated upgrade on the 991GT3.
Great video - keep them coming.
10-04-2014, 07:01 PM
#417
Rennlist Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Mid-Atlantic (on land, not in the middle of the ocean)
Posts: 13,287
Received 4,472 Likes
on
2,547 Posts
This is one of the factors that tipped me towards getting a 991 GT3 rather than a 997 GT3. I'm in the camp that feels that the 997 is the last 911 that feels like a 911 (yeah, I know about air-cooled, blah blah blah ...), but if you drive a base 991 back to back with a base 997, or any of the other variants in the same comparison, there's no question that the 991 is a superior platform for performance - feels faster because it is. And since I'm getting the GT3 mainly for track use, the 991 makes sense. But for the road, I'm still a 997 guy, since for me it's the best blend of modern comfort and features with distinctive 911 feel.
10-04-2014, 07:07 PM
#418
Rennlist Member
PC Valykerie
Great footage. Great track. It's incredibly wide decent length and very fast with not much tight stuff so should suit the GT3 well. With proper heat management for those tyres (you need to target 29/32 F/R hot) and some small ego tweaks to help ensure tyre wear and grip there is at least 2 seconds on the table for you here. Like myself you are carrying less speed in many of the corners than you could because you are learning to trust the chassis but I think it had way more grip than we think so we have to push beyond that comfort zone a bit. I'm sure in the right hands a 1.30 or below is quite achieve able but I think you will get a 1.32 within a few more sessions. Great work....great track....
Great footage. Great track. It's incredibly wide decent length and very fast with not much tight stuff so should suit the GT3 well. With proper heat management for those tyres (you need to target 29/32 F/R hot) and some small ego tweaks to help ensure tyre wear and grip there is at least 2 seconds on the table for you here. Like myself you are carrying less speed in many of the corners than you could because you are learning to trust the chassis but I think it had way more grip than we think so we have to push beyond that comfort zone a bit. I'm sure in the right hands a 1.30 or below is quite achieve able but I think you will get a 1.32 within a few more sessions. Great work....great track....
10-04-2014, 11:56 PM
#419
Rennlist Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Mid-Atlantic (on land, not in the middle of the ocean)
Posts: 13,287
Received 4,472 Likes
on
2,547 Posts
NOT the GT3, but I thought I'd share this video of pro racer Michael Krumm, driving the GT-R Nismo at the 'ring, because it offers excellent perspective as far as what goes through the mind of a pro driving at the edge, technical challenges of the 'ring, and the demands placed on a car (especially suspension). Note the stunning time of 7:08.7, about 16s faster than our beloved 991 GT3; kudos to Nissan for the engineering, even if this car isn't everyone's cup of tea.
10-05-2014, 12:27 AM
#420
Rennlist Member
NOT the GT3, but I thought I'd share this video of pro racer Michael Krumm, driving the GT-R Nismo at the 'ring, because it offers excellent perspective as far as what goes through the mind of a pro driving at the edge, technical challenges of the 'ring, and the demands placed on a car (especially suspension). Note the stunning time of 7:08.7, about 16s faster than our beloved 991 GT3; kudos to Nissan for the engineering, even if this car isn't everyone's cup of tea.
