Stop Sale?
04-26-2014, 04:30 PM
#4456
Rennlist Member
And therein lies the crux of this mass delusion. To those of us who have actually participated in replacing an engine, installing a known defective engine makes complete sense.
*How do you QC the various systems and subsystems with no engine connections (electrical/fluid/vacuum) attached?
*If not QC'ed, and discovered problems corrected, is manufacturing actually complete?
*How do you set wheel alignment on a car with no engine?
*How do you secure all that crap hanging down back there that's not attached to anything?
*How do you weatherproof the open ends of all that crap? (Wires, hoses, tubes, fittings,etc)
*How do you secure, with ability to rotate with no interference, the inboard ends of the CV shafts?
*How do you get a car that doesn't run under its own power out of the factory and moved amongst the various storage locations? Donkeys? Dog teams? Slaves?
*There's no electrical system available! How the f*ck are you going to lock it? How will you crack the windows so you can latch the doors closed and then get them back open? Disconnect your battery with the windows rolled up and then try to close your doors.
I'm sure others can add to the list.
When you live on dreams and fantasies, of course reality doesn't matter. After all, what you don't understand doesn't exist
*How do you QC the various systems and subsystems with no engine connections (electrical/fluid/vacuum) attached?
*If not QC'ed, and discovered problems corrected, is manufacturing actually complete?
*How do you set wheel alignment on a car with no engine?
*How do you secure all that crap hanging down back there that's not attached to anything?
*How do you weatherproof the open ends of all that crap? (Wires, hoses, tubes, fittings,etc)
*How do you secure, with ability to rotate with no interference, the inboard ends of the CV shafts?
*How do you get a car that doesn't run under its own power out of the factory and moved amongst the various storage locations? Donkeys? Dog teams? Slaves?
*There's no electrical system available! How the f*ck are you going to lock it? How will you crack the windows so you can latch the doors closed and then get them back open? Disconnect your battery with the windows rolled up and then try to close your doors.
I'm sure others can add to the list.
When you live on dreams and fantasies, of course reality doesn't matter. After all, what you don't understand doesn't exist
04-26-2014, 04:42 PM
#4457
Rennlist Member
Let's assume that these cars were built with the bad engines for reasons outlined above. These cars are still at the factory waiting for engines which are now being produced. Porsche knows they need to replace the engines and then ship the cars (6-8 weeks) to the owners. Does anyone doubt that these cars will get engines before the Y2015 model?
04-26-2014, 04:44 PM
#4458
Whether or not Porsche knowing put a defective engine into cars built after they knew of the defective is not the issue. The question is when will these car be delivered to their owners. Let's assume that these cars were built with the bad engines for reasons outlined above. These cars are still at the factory waiting for engines which are now being produced. Porsche knows they need to replace the engines and then ship the cars (6-8 weeks) to the owners. Does anyone doubt that these cars will get engines before the Y2015 model?
04-26-2014, 05:13 PM
#4459
Burning Brakes
Since cars already built have priority for the new engines, a November date for your 2014 would mean no 2015's will be built before then and that doesn't make sense either. Sadly, there's a lot of bad information floating around and I suspect/hope you have gotten some.
04-26-2014, 05:21 PM
#4460
Rennlist Member
So based on what is in the Porsche system Porsche is going to build a 2014 model after they build AND deliver a 2015 model????? Buyers with late deposits get the 2015 model to drive before those that had earlier deposits get their 2014 model and delivered after 2015 model?
What universe is Porsche living in? I don't think so. Understand this. Engines being built for the GT3 will go first to the 785 affected cars which include I believe those at the factory. Nothing else makes any sense.
What universe is Porsche living in? I don't think so. Understand this. Engines being built for the GT3 will go first to the 785 affected cars which include I believe those at the factory. Nothing else makes any sense.
one qualifier, I believe there are more than "785 cars" identified in the Feb. 20th Stop Sale recall that need a new engine. I know there are several cars that began production in March.
I believe GT3 prod was not stopped until March 20th?
So who knows how many additional engines need to be built, before MY'15s start?
Only PAG...
And, the 'RT' post stated that only 25 of the 40 daily engine prod would be shipped, due to 1,000kil. bench testing...what happens to these 15 after? tear-down?, inventory? don't know yet.
04-26-2014, 06:30 PM
#4461
Race Director
Does any one have confirmation that each engine will be bench tested. If so, does any one have an idea why they would be. Now, I would assume it would be to ensure every new GT3 engine leaving the factory will be perfect. Also, if this is truly confirmed then a short break-in period would be warranted and then let her rip
04-26-2014, 06:42 PM
#4462
Rennlist Member
The talk of the 1000km bench test is reported on Rennteam but should be taken as a rumour at this stage. It is however logical and feasible. A well known and trusted board member here also mentioned to me a few weeks back that his contact within PAG has commented they were using every available test room on the engines. I suspect it's prudent to continue this practice on the first 800 production engines. This should be the most tested engine to go into a new production model for years. If the engines are confirmed bench tested I run in should be necessary.....
04-26-2014, 06:57 PM
#4464
Rennlist Member
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Hopefully they will let us know officially of the 1,000km bench test if the rumor is correct. thus saving from wasting time with the break in period. Not looking forward to that.. will be hard to keep under 4-5k RPM for 1000mi after all this wait!
04-26-2014, 07:17 PM
#4465
Rennlist Member
They will confirm this I suspect. I will be running a one tank of gas run in procedure just like the factory recommended to me personally first time around with ED. My run in will be the 300km to the two race tracks I'm taking the gt3 to when I get it back...
Quite frankly the factory will be anticipating very few people following the manual break in procedure due to their frustration at waiting so long to get their cars on the road .
Frankly after the wait and with the extended warranty and the questionable MY2014 residuals I can fully understand most will take this car and just drive the pants off if it which is a great idea!
Quite frankly the factory will be anticipating very few people following the manual break in procedure due to their frustration at waiting so long to get their cars on the road .
Frankly after the wait and with the extended warranty and the questionable MY2014 residuals I can fully understand most will take this car and just drive the pants off if it which is a great idea!
04-26-2014, 07:34 PM
#4467
Rennlist Member
I don't know how people are interpreting the RT rumor about the daily engine prod?
I interpreted it as PAG would bench test 15 of the 40 daily units to make sure each batch was sound (if one of the 15 failed during testing, PAG would recall the other 25 before the owner took delivery/engine installed).
So 25 of the batch would not be bench tested and shipped/installed immediately.
Hard to believe PAG would bench test every engine.
I interpreted it as PAG would bench test 15 of the 40 daily units to make sure each batch was sound (if one of the 15 failed during testing, PAG would recall the other 25 before the owner took delivery/engine installed).
So 25 of the batch would not be bench tested and shipped/installed immediately.
Hard to believe PAG would bench test every engine.
04-26-2014, 08:13 PM
#4468
Instructor
04-26-2014, 09:08 PM
#4469
Rennlist Member
Once Porsche is satisfied it identified the problem and fix, standard practice requires some testing but to test all the engines would be an indication they do not have confidence in their solution. I just don't see that as a plausible situation. We'll know in a couple of weeks if not sooner.
04-26-2014, 09:23 PM
#4470
Burning Brakes
I understand there is as cold bench test and a hot bench test. For cold they would just spin the engine using an external drive vs hot they would actually start the engine. At least that is what some one posted months ago. So if they do not run it hot you still need to go through the break in period since it would not experience full thermal impact to the engine.