Deetz

This is not my understanding, where is this documented, or what objective evidence can you provide?

Mike in CA

I agree about the sport button; there should have been a way to program that in PCM so Sport instead of Eco was the default for Auto mode, although I used Auto so rarely it was almost irrelevant. At least there is no Eco mode with the GT3.....

Mike in CA

The dry sump has been mentioned in nearly every independent review of the car. Here is info from the technical information/product update docs released by Porsche on the 991 GT3:

Oil Supply
As with its predecessor, the new 911 GT3 features a classic dry-sump lubrication system with a separate engine-oil tank, ensuring oil supply, even when the vehicle is on a race circuit.
For the dry-sump lubrication to be used with the new engine generation (type 991), the oil pan for the new 911 GT3 had to be redeveloped, Along with the four-way oil extraction which the current 911 Carrera S has, the new 911 GT3 has two additional oil extraction points in the pan at the front and rear, enabling oil to be pumped out to a separate oil tank, even when the vehicle accelerates sharply or during intensive braking phases.

A reintroduction on the new 911 GT3 is the oil wiper which originated in motorsport. This measure ensures less splash oil in the crankcase and reduces the engines so called, “churning losses”. In addition, the separate oil tank was also redeveloped to a tunnel-shaped structure, reducing the oil fill volumes of the new tank compared to the previous model from 7.5 l (997 GT3 II) to 6.0 l, thus reducing the vehicles weight by approximately 1.3 kg.

As well as the on-demand oil pump, the new 911 GT3 has not one (911 Carrera) but two piston oil spray injectors which enables more intensive cooling of the pistons, which are under high thermal loads.

Deetz

My read of that was in the 9A1 sense that it was an "Integrated Dry Sump" and not a true classic dry sump... Indeed, my bad, thanks Mike.

Is it a digital oil pump or variable?

Mike in CA

No worries, you're welcome Deetz. My understanding is that the oil pump is totally analog; since the driver now has a free leg he works a small lever with his foot to maintain oil supply and therefore restore driver involvement.

stout

Totally agree on all points but one: New GT3 feels far from all digital, and is far from all digital. RWS is brilliant, and transparent in use. I am all for it. Steering is not "electric", but electric assist (like hydraulic assist, meaning both create the possibility of filtration as opposed to unassisted steering). AP's team gets full marks here. Suspect that if the original 991's steering had felt like this, there would be zero or near-zero carping. If it gets better than this, it's entirely possible that it will become a complete non-issue, just as hydraulic did.

As for overall feel, the GT3 avoids the "digital" feel some other cars are criticized for. It is, however, far more refined than, say, a 996 GT3. Whether that's better or worse depends on one's preferences, but both are excellent cars.

pete

GrantG

Hey, I'm still not done bitching about hydraulic steering compared to manual

neanicu

That's what hundreds of pages of " digital ink " have been saying all along : brilliant achievement that's taken 50% out of driver's involvement.
AP,since you've stuck with us all this time reading this thread,remember...it is not too late...IT'S NEVER TOO LATE!!!

997TTMeteor

Hi Pete (Stout),

Thanks for your comments about ‘feel’. This is the main reason I am moving from a 997 Turbo to a GT3. We all know the Turbo is not an ideal track car, but through suspension, alignment and tire upgrades (and more power), my car is very quick and handles fairly well on track. However, last year I drove a 3.8 RS on-track and I was completely blown away by how nimble & agile it was and also how stiff the chassis felt compared to my heavy Turbo. If I didn’t order a 991 GT3 I was going to get a 3.8 GT3RS. Would you put these 2 cars in the same league strictly in regards to handling “feel” (removing the gearbox from the equation)? BTW, If I could’ve ordered the 991 GT3 with a manual I would’ve in a heartbeat. It is by far my biggest concern with the car. Anyway, I’d love to hear your opinion on how nimble and maneuverable it was.

frayed

LOL. Hilarious!

Meteor,

As to your question to Pete I'm interested in the answer as well. I felt the 996 to 997 GT3 progression gave us far more daily usability. But at the same time, the 997 version filtered out a lot of the noise leaving behind what the driver needed to feel/hear to appreciate what the car is doing BUT adding in a lot of predictability and tractability. Would be interested in knowing (gearbox aside) whether the 991 carried on this tradition.

Since Pete's on record stating that the new GT3 is an 11 out of 10 (gearbox aside) I have to think the 991 GT3 did indeed carry on this tradition. In spades.

Mike in CA

It's one thing to say that a certain percentage of the mechanical interface has been replaced by paddles or e-brakes. Fair enough. It's quite another to imply that the new car has taken away "50% out of the driver's involvement". To suggest that my Carrera S with PDK was only half as involving (or fun) to drive as my 3.2 Carrera, or 996, or Boxster S with MT's is ridiculous. Some things were lost and others were gained, but 50% less involving? Let's not become so subjective that we lose perspective. And the new GT3 is well beyond what my Carrera was....

Deetz

But it's not just about the number of ways that we interact, it's the quality, the subtlety, the nuance, the excitement of the communication.

The 991GT3 is the Ipod of the Audiophile world. The Smartphone of the Photo world, the Box wine, the digital equivalent simulating the real thing. It may approach excellent, but... It will be different.

At first glance, the CD was great! The Ipod at lower bitrates great! Couldn't tell the difference! Then, we had a chance to reflect, and at first sight, maybe not. We've lost something, something that the "others" couldn't appreciate. Good enough.

I'm not saying the 991GT3 is not great, just be prepared to look a little closer and consider all the other things that have gone digital, and had their analog "replacements" have a resurgence. Singer, Magnus? Why?

stout

+1

The old cars were challenging and unfiltered (and I am talking about the old cars, those with torsion bars, though some like to go back even further). Dynamically and in performance terms, the newer cars do everything better even if they lose some of that "unfiltered" feel many prize, but they also present a new challenge to the driver because everything is happening faster/sooner. This is what makes GT3s so addictive to me, even if I like both old and new cars.

To answer Meteor's question, the 991 GT3 is quite a driver's tool and offers incredible capability. I used the word "revelatory" with regards to its handling in my story, and stand by that. The RWS and eDiff plus the wheelbase stretch, wider front track (especially), and new-gen tires make it a new ballgame. You'll see...and its advantages are going to be reflected in lap times and driver confidence. For the record , my take was: For those open to PDK, the car appears to be a 10 out of 10, and maybe even an 11 out of 10.

Those who are open to PDK are going to be blown away by the 991 GT3, of this much I am sure. It made the 997-2 GT3 that PAG brought to Spain feel oddly disconnected and archaic—far more so than I expected, and I've got several thousand miles in these cars and have been making the leap from one GT3 to the next since they came out in the U.S. They're all wonderful for various reasons, and for one reason. But the thought that went through my mind was "This car was a benchmark 3-4 years ago, and 3-4 minutes ago." A benchmark that was suddenly shattered. The 991 GT3 is a big transition, and, chassis-wise, a wonderful one.

pete

stout

All is right with the world...

pete

neanicu

Mike,for me the calculation is simple : when I drive my stick cars I use 2 hands and 2 legs. To drive a PDK car you only use 1 hand(ok ok...you can use 2 hands if you insist to granny flap paddles) and 1 leg...that's 50% no?

Kidding aside,whether you want to acknowledge it or not,you did lose involvement,don't know the percentage,I guess it's different for every person,some might actually think the new car has gained something due to its increased usability,to me,50% sounds about right...