neanicu

Petevb

Porsche itself tells us weight is important by charging us huge amounts for every pound. Lightweight batteries, lighter brakes and lightweight seats all cost a fortune not because they cost Porsche a fortune, but because they are that much "better". But if we're charged we'd better get what we pay for, and it gets important to know if our lightweight seats are not as light.

Weight isn't subjective. There's a spreadsheet and it's a simple cut and paste. Porsche already plays games with small fuel tanks, etc- why cut them any more slack? If it says 500 hp on the tin I expect 500 hp, and if US cars are disproportionately gaining weight I want to know that too. It's a matter of ethos and principle that has traditionally separated Porsche from say Ferrari or Lamborghini, and if we stop caring you can bet Porsche will too- it's obviously easier to save the money on a bespoke component and make a heavier car.

So... did your PCNA contact say the US published weights are inaccurate? Because it kinda sounds like he did.

BTW, I run my cars with 1/4 tank at the autocross and fill them up at lunch for a reason- it's a difference I can feel and see against the clock. Much bigger than we're talking here, but it all adds up.

sgroer

Heres what he wrote to me after we met...

It was nice to meet you briefly at One Porsche Drive and to give you a first look at the new 911 GT3. I would like to clarify a few points concerning the weight of the new GT3. First, it should be noted that weights published by PCNA are typically the DIN 70020 (vehicle mass in base configuration including all operating fluids and fuel tank filled to 90 percent). US-specific vehicles will usually feature different standard equipment than European-specific vehicles. With that in mind, it is normal for the base weight of US vehicles to differ from the weights quoted elsewhere (usually for European-spec vehicles)

bronson7

Petevb

I'm afraid he's probably wrong on multiple counts above, which is part of the reason I raise the issue.

1. US quoted weight is generally a straight conversion from whatever is released in Europe. That's been true of both the website and press releases, basically anything PCNA puts out. The GT4 for example was listed at 1340 kg (DIN Leergewicht/ empty weight) and 2955 lbs in the US. That's a straight conversion from the German number, with no change for US specs, and it's like that for every model I have checked.

2. Current EU standards let them weigh cars in the lightest configuration, not base spec. On the Boxster Spyder launch in Italy a Porsche engineer clarified when I asked him directly: weights are quoted in the lightest possible spec with every lightweight option. This largely accounts for why the GT4 was quoted at 2955 lbs but most customers weigh them at >3100 lbs, and none on this board got within 50 lbs of Porsche's figure in DIN spec, however if you add every lightweight option it nearly adds up: https://rennlist.com/forums/gt4/9250...-lightest.html

3. Unfortunately even in the lightest possible configuration a US spec car can't match a euro one. DOT lights are different, etc. Traditionally these differences have been pretty small, but recently it's been moving the other direction. Our lightweight seats, for example, are already a few pounds heavier than theirs, and now the US is being denied options that are available in Europe (radio delete, lion battery, etc). Thus the practice of simply taking the curb weights published in Europe and repeating them for the US (as is currently done for the GT3, etc) is either sloppy or (relatively innocuous) fraud depending on your take. For example if the above is correct the new US 991.2 GT3's weight should be quoted as well higher than the 991.1's because of the loss of lightweight options.

You might get back to your contact and have him do a little digging. If I was releasing significantly inaccurate info to journalists and the public I'd want to know about it. At least go in eyes open. And also understand that the loss of options like radio delete is likely having a bigger impact than realized.

STG

Jamie140

Wut?

asia

This has been an issue for quite some time. My 996.2 GT3 was speced by PCNA as "Curb weight 3,043 lbs".

I speced my car delete everything possible, add no options (not even mats). Nothing. Weight 3,150 lbs full tank.

My guess: USA seats rather than Euro GT3 seats (not available as an option) (~45 lbs). PCCB (~45 lbs). And maybe Cosmoline underbody wax. (I am guessing they didn't spray the non ocean transported cars.)

Alan Smithee

I believe rear crash structure, and perhaps side impact protection, is more robust on US-spec cars.

Petevb

Yep. But you can get very close to listed weights if all of the options are available. GT4s with Lion, buckets, PCCB, delete, etc were within ~10 lbs per the math.

RealityGT

Paging Dr Chaosoul.. Dr Chaosoul please report to your own thread,

https://rennlist.com/forums/991-gt3-...l#post14240155
US cars delayed?

Z356

The good doctor is around. I am pretty sure
we saw him in the vicinity yesterday!

Saludos,
Eduardo
Scottsdale

chaosoul

Yes their dealer told them right. Its true.

RealityGT

^We all thank you sir!

nlpamg

So since my car was supposed to lock later this month and now it appears to be delayed (it was originally 9/29 delivery), can I get PTS now?

When is the PTS window?

Thanks.