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Pulled the trigger on a 3.8 RS inspired 964 - development journal

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Old 11-10-2014 | 03:22 PM
  #241  
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The drive continues ... Now in wine county so glad of the 17s instead of 18s.
Also hit the weigh bridge with 30L of fuel and all other liquids topped up ... 1224kg
which is pretty much what I expected (dreams of 1150 were just that )

A bit of dust just proves you've left the regular path ... And it's been great booting around
the farms and mountains ... Bumped the idle screw a thread but otherwise all is good w. the engine.

... Added the MoS2 liqui-moly and keen to see any tangible results (oil or fuel consumption?)
More passes and canyons in the am - can't wait!







Old 11-10-2014 | 04:19 PM
  #242  
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^^^^^^
I kinda like it naked like it looks right now, but of course I'd say that. Is the rear deck badge centered?
Old 11-11-2014 | 02:08 AM
  #243  
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Thanks - also like it .... A bit stealthier
And LoL ... No I removed the 2 ... Awaiting its return!
Old 11-11-2014 | 03:53 AM
  #244  
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You need to roll badgeless dude (que the legendary film quote again)
That's what all the cool kids do
Old 11-11-2014 | 07:22 AM
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Originally Posted by HiWind
... Awaiting its return!
Are you painting it red?
Old 11-14-2014 | 08:24 AM
  #246  
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ooops ...
Old 11-14-2014 | 08:25 AM
  #247  
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not a bad idea Udo .. but something else

nice to have a full 4 day weekend to drive the car - and get it dirty!
The birds in the winelands are vicious poopers!
Had a visitor to show around so driving was "contained".
Could drive those long curved roads all day!

Excuse the hamfisted editing and it seems the gopro case has seen its best days as quite alot of
rattling ... but you get the general idea


ps ... yes I forgot to put my license pl-a-te light back in .. oh well

Last edited by HiWind; 11-15-2014 at 12:42 AM. Reason: get rid of sneaky amazon link
Old 11-17-2014 | 02:29 PM
  #248  
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got onto the track on Saturday .. brakes had 0 fade and no bias problems .. new map felt good too
car ran well and even played with an Amg'd SLS for a while .... working the momentum differential

amazing how he can pull a dozen car lengths in 10 seconds ...
guy was a real gent and offered me a drive in the car afterwards .. which was nice
(the torque in 3rd and the engine sound is fantastic ... handling and brakes, not so much )



here's some footage of rear view - exhaust & the SLS hunting me - like being tailed by a shark

Old 02-11-2015 | 12:17 PM
  #249  
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so after a busy year end I'm glad to be back and working on the car again ... hope you're all good!
Also been catching up on lots of key threads ... what is robt next CF invention?! or is Ahab below 1k yet? etc..

I decided it was time to review the loom and the wiring to the engine as the fuel mgmt is a capable local unit (Dicktator ... Std ECU) but is batch rather than sequential. The mod and install of that ECU was done 5 years back by guys I can't "trace" and there isn't any record of exactly what they did exactly
... and while the 312hp (3.8L) is no slouch, the car has become more of a town&country cruiser/canyon carver than a track rat (see my sig for that) and I've never liked the less than perfect road manners due to the limitations of the race-car fuel mgmt system. And the bumper stains from the overfueling after a few months ... though as the vid above show the flames were cool

So Motec it is and while there are many who still proclaim the Bosch Motronic as far superior (they're likely right in many less modded applications) for my needs and considering the alterations (993 RS internals, GT2 Evo cams, 400cc injectors etc..) in the 3.8, oh and that one came up for $500 from a race car near me that goings for the new-new thing (Motec M1), it made sense.

I'm a useless sparky so the loom is in the hands of a real Motec pro ... and we've made some interesting discoveries over the last 2 days:
1. signal to the TPS wasn't perfectly clean .... small jitter on the software reader which isn't due to the TPS itself .... some less than elegant wire patching in the loom was to blame, so that's gone
2. re-wiring the lamda (was taped up under the car) and MAP sensor ... seems the stock pin layout has space for that
3. a few other things which I'll foto later ... grounds simplified etc.. but we will be able to run the altitude compensation, the idle valve and other niceties which weren't being used. Also maybe able to use the knock sensors and will have 2 maps - one for regular 95 RON and one for AVGas or octane boosted use.
4. This will be the first re-tune with the x-piped exhaust (ie mixing the banks) ... as I've reported it was much better noise wise but cost a little ooomph wise ... interested to see what comes of that.

Anyways, that's my news ...
Old 02-11-2015 | 12:33 PM
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Welcome back I was only thinking the other day that we hadn't seen you in these parts for a while.

Re altitude compensation - Are you sure you need that as you have a MAP sensor already. The MAP sensor will already be performing that task.
Old 02-12-2015 | 03:57 AM
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yes you're right Rob - we are not using the barometric as we have MAP - but the MAP is also used for the ISV.

- key thing was some missing "wiring screen" (i.e. extra earthing shield to prevent inteference, which had been cut away during the first install)
- TPS was getting power from stock (ie 5v) but sending signal to the after mkt one (also unclean)
- we are looking at using a wide band lamda instead of the stock narrow band (too narrow a range ie from 14-15 afr while wide is 10-20)
... any input appreciated here (but waiting on Motec in Oz to confirm)

- have added a relay for ecu power to ensure that is clean and any potential problems avoided
- new bracket for the motec ... which means the whole motronic with bracket can be opened, checked, cleaned and sold (email me per my user CP please)
Old 02-25-2015 | 03:17 PM
  #252  
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ok so the Motec (m48 - old unit but good enough for my need) is in ... neat and tidy (no more motronic or piggybacked fueling)

and I am thrilled with the results!!.

I've been driving the 996.1 GT3 for 2 weeks which is no slouch and had prepared myself for a less urgent experience ...
but on the contrary the 964 feels charged, nimble, tight and now thanks to the sequential fueling, revs smoothers, further and tighter (if that's an accurate description) across the rev range.

The smoothness is the best part - it feels like I've imagined the perfect oil would make the engine feel.

The charts show the difference quite well - torque & hp curves are flatter and while not much higher, just better, go further right before fading and its tangibly smoother. The idle is rock steady (without ISV) at 900 and the car sounds better at idle too ... ie less rough. The power flattens and falls about 6-6500 so limiter set at 6880.

There is no kangerooing, no stall at decel to stop etc.. (neither of which we big problems but were there at times).
The motec just seems to provide more granular and precise control of the injectors and obviously the sequential firing is a benefit at lower revs.
The batch firers argument is that at 6k revs the injectors are basically spraying non-stop so the batch firing doesn't matter (or rather seq isnt necessary) .. but that only really applies to race cars, not pared-back canyon-carvers that sometime experience traffic lights.

The m48 allows for a trim switch so tuner will do an octane boosted (from 95 to 102) map for track use in a few weeks time ... just wanted to test and road trial the setup for a while first
...then smooth out any wobbles when we do the octane boosted map. (I would do av-gas but the octane levels aren't very stable in the avgas surprisingly so going with the NF booster.)



bolder line is Motec map with 440cc injectors .. thinner is Dicktator with 440cc injectors



I was hoping for a good result and must say its right up there with my usually too high expectations.
Old 02-25-2015 | 07:41 PM
  #253  
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Great figures,
surprise you mention AVGAS is not stable , it is quite good over here in UK , use it 50/50 with super 98 for years in 2 race engines with no issues,
It would be interesting to see if you get more power with the octane booster ...
Old 02-25-2015 | 11:02 PM
  #254  
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Hi Konstantin .. yes I was also surprised but tuner works on competition drags and says they're now wary of it - small market down here
but I will look into it .. I'm also reserving judgement as we run it in the cup cars quite happily too

.... but undoubtedly the boosted fuel will allow ignition timing 3-5 degrees further out
(as it did with the old batch mgmt system) ... shd be good for 30-40 hp I think, although car feels great as it is
... it seems we always need to balance of the need for "Moooor Pooowa" with keeping the engine safe and happy
Old 02-26-2015 | 10:33 AM
  #255  
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30/40 bhp more , ...!?. Let us know when you test it on dino..., the good thing with AVGAS is that it is cheap compare to special fuels,


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